Can we all agree Ulfric caused Alduin's return?

Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:05 pm


It's not that they don't pay taxes - there's no way they could operate shops (or farms) without paying taxes. It's that they generally don't support the Stormcloaks in a military capacity - it's the same beef Galmar Stonefist has with Jarl Balgruuf. Some elves, both high (Niranye) and dark (Belyn Hlaalu,) actually thrive in Windhelm.
No, a monument near the edge of Skyrim (near Windhelm at that too) which all Jarls at the time signed says the Dunmer are to be welcomed in Skyrim without having to pay tithes (in accordance to them losing their homes because of Red Mountain's eruption).

So yes, they don't pay taxes

Or, at least that's what I remember. Anybody can confirm this? It's near a destroyed tower around East of Windhelm, just follow the road through that Dunmer farm
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how solid
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:11 pm

That is correct, they were granted the right to live clear of the normal systems (including taxes).

That does not mean, however, that they are then entitled to complain when those same systems are not operating in their favor, especially since they (for the most part) cannot be bothered to do anything on their own to improve their lot. In fact, those Dunmer who do seek work complain that the slackers are actually sabotaging any attempt to improve by wasting all their time complaining instead of doing something about it, since that attitude only furthers the dislike the locals already had for them and makes them less likely to help instead of more.
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Sarah Bishop
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:56 am

That is correct, they were granted the right to live clear of the normal systems (including taxes).

That does not mean, however, that they are then entitled to complain when those same systems are not operating in their favor, especially since they (for the most part) cannot be bothered to do anything on their own to improve their lot. In fact, those Dunmer who do seek work complain that the slackers are actually sabotaging any attempt to improve by wasting all their time complaining instead of doing something about it, since that attitude only furthers the dislike the locals already had for them and makes them less likely to help instead of more.

There isn't a single Dunmer in all of Windhelm that doesn't have a job, so I can't imagine how you think they're not trying to improve their lot.
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Ross Thomas
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:56 am

There isn't a single Dunmer in all of Windhelm that doesn't have a job, so I can't imagine how you think they're not trying to improve their lot.
The farm worker mentions that his family looks down on him and his sister for working for Nords.


It's not that they don't pay taxes - there's no way they could operate shops (or farms) without paying taxes. It's that they generally don't support the Stormcloaks in a military capacity - it's the same beef Galmar Stonefist has with Jarl Balgruuf. Some elves, both high (Niranye) and dark (Belyn Hlaalu,) actually thrive in Windhelm.
That's probably part of the Decree of Monument. They don't owe fealty, so they have no obligation to support the local militias. And in turn Ulfric doesn't consider them his first priority.
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Gill Mackin
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:30 pm

The farm worker mentions that his family looks down on him and his sister for working for Nords.

True, but that one owns his own business. He's a self-made man, and I'm sure that he'd like to see his family either helping his business become stronger or become entrepreneurs themselves.
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Sabrina Schwarz
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:59 am

The farm worker mentions that his family looks down on him and his sister for working for Nords.

That's probably part of the Decree of Monument. They don't owe fealty, so they have no obligation to support the local militias. And in turn Ulfric doesn't consider them his first priority.

Why doesn't Ulfric enlist them into the Stormcloaks? Skyrim is just as much their home as it is the Nords.
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Multi Multi
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:18 am

The Dragonborn was the final piece to intiate Alduin's return, Ulfric just setup the materials and oil, Dragonborn was the match.
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Robert Jackson
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:35 am

Why doesn't Ulfric enlist them into the Stormcloaks? Skyrim is just as much their home as it is the Nords.
Not according to the agreement made when they settled.

untithed to any thane or hold, and self-governed, with free worship, with no compensation to Skyrim or the Empire except as writ in the Armistice of old wheresoever those might still apply
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Judy Lynch
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:48 am

No, a monument near the edge of Skyrim (near Windhelm at that too) which all Jarls at the time signed says the Dunmer are to be welcomed in Skyrim without having to pay tithes (in accordance to them losing their homes because of Red Mountain's eruption). So yes, they don't pay taxes Or, at least that's what I remember. Anybody can confirm this? It's near a destroyed tower around East of Windhelm, just follow the road through that Dunmer farm
Yep. Refugee's Rest. There's a book/journal that explains this on a pedestal just off the east face of the tower.
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maddison
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:37 am

Yep. Refugee's Rest. There's a book/journal that explains this on a pedestal just off the east face of the tower.

I certainly stand corrected, then; the tower and its book are things I have yet to encounter, and will seek out!
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Cool Man Sam
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:40 pm

I certainly stand corrected, then; the tower and its book are things I have yet to encounter, and will seek out!
I had previously found the tower, but just now went back there and saw the book. :P
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jessica robson
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:36 am

Why doesn't Ulfric enlist them into the Stormcloaks? Skyrim is just as much their home as it is the Nords.

They were invited and refused. Implied by the fact that Nords complain that they wont join and dunmer claim its none of their affair.
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willow
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:08 pm

The way I look at this whole prophecy thing, and it's just my perspective with now special insight at all mind you, it's that the elder scroll used to banish Alduin also acted as a kind of window between the past event of his banishing and the future event of his return. There was at least one survivor of that confrontation, I believe, so maybe he was able to use the scroll to look into the future in the same way that the dragonborn uses it to look into the past. or maybe he found someone else who can do this and used the scroll itself to outline the time of Alduin's return looking directly at future events as a sort of hint or guideline for the dragonborn in the future by writing it all on the wall. so, by my reasoning, which isn't authoritative by any means remember, either it was all just destined to happen, history is preordaned and is really unchangeable, or the guys that time warped Alduin in the first place are really the catalist for all of it and its really their fault, lol.

also for the record, I started to dislike Ulfric after being forced to sack Whiterun, which I had only just saved from a dragon attack, bought a house in and been made thane of and had grown rather attached to. had to start all over just so I could join the legion instead, lol.
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brian adkins
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:10 am

Overrated Nord is Overrated.
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Josh Trembly
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:10 am

They were invited and refused. Implied by the fact that Nords complain that they wont join and dunmer claim its none of their affair.
I think that's stretching it. Rolf is a drunk on the street, not even a Stormcloak, let alone privy to their recruitment.
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Timara White
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:23 pm

I think that's stretching it. Rolf is a drunk on the street, not even a Stormcloak, let alone privy to their recruitment.

But the dunmer he is harassing confirms it.
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Rich O'Brien
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:00 pm

Even after finishing the main quest, I was still left wondering about certain things. Alduin may have figured where/who Ulfric is. He could have used a shout to kill the King, but does that mean he's a greybeard or a dragonborn?
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Amy Smith
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:06 pm

Even after finishing the main quest, I was still left wondering about certain things. Alduin may have figured where/who Ulfric is. He could have used a shout to kill the King, but does that mean he's a greybeard or a dragonborn?
Any Nord can train with the Greybeard to use the Thu'um, it just takes months/years of training. Ulfric chose to train with them but abandoned his training before too long, the only shout he learned was Unrelenting Force, which is apparently the most basic shout/the first one the Greybeards teach. He said himself that he wasn't able to stand to be away from the Great War, so he left to join the Empire and fight.
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saharen beauty
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:18 am

Actually I would like to point out that the two dunmers that are comainkng on how things are in fact do not have jobs, they sleep above the inn and spend their time kn the taverns. Every other elf be it altmer gasp!, dunmer, or wood elf all have jobs and actually state that the nords want and like people who can hold their own, and said wlves are working and they have no probs with the nords or stormcloaks.

Again, drunken rabble harrassing a racist woman, and if u dont believe shes racist, follow here around and watch what she says. And then replace argonian with which ever ethnic grp u like and see if u dont get more offended.
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K J S
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:00 am

Actually I would like to point out that the two dunmers that are comainkng on how things are in fact do not have jobs, they sleep above the inn and spend their time kn the taverns.

The two Dunmer who spend all their time in the tavern work there. They aren't just there drinking, they're running a business. One of them is the owner, the other is a hired hand, but neither of them isn't working.
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quinnnn
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:44 am

But the dunmer he is harassing confirms it.
She says it's not their fight, not that anyone was around trying to recruit them. It's the terms of the agreement made when they settled in Skyrim- the owe no fealty to any jarl.
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Marguerite Dabrin
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:12 am

She says it's not their fight, not that anyone was around trying to recruit them. It's the terms of the agreement made when they settled in Skyrim- the owe no fealty to any jarl.

True. And considering what the Dunmer went through, most wouldn't blame them. Personally (though I'm not an Ulfric adherent), I find their attitude short-sighted in the extreme....

[NB: I'm not an Ulfric adherent.... that's very different from being on the Stormcloak "side"....]
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Klaire
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:49 am

Uhhhm... Ulfric's rebellion didn't "cause" anything, aside from a detainment of the Empire recuperating and biding time until Round Two with the Thalmor. It was a coincidental event that was foretold to happen at the time Alduin's return did.
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rolanda h
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:05 am

She says it's not their fight, not that anyone was around trying to recruit them. It's the terms of the agreement made when they settled in Skyrim- the owe no fealty to any jarl.

The fact that she was accused of not helping and she defends herself against the accusation by saying its none of their affair implies that they were invited to join. If they werent invited to join the stormcloaks she wouldnt have bothered to claim its not their fight - she would have just said that ulfric doesnt even want them in the stormcloaks.
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-__^
 
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Post » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:57 am

The fact that she was accused of not helping and she defends herself against the accusation by saying its none of their affair implies that they were invited to join. If they werent invited to join the stormcloaks she wouldnt have bothered to claim its not their fight - she would have just said that ulfric doesnt even want them in the stormcloaks.
No it doesn't. You're attributing something that isn't there.
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vicki kitterman
 
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