It looks like he's using the fish "frame" to get the tail to move. And disabled the trigger to swim. If he has though great, maybe I'll get to dropkick Thalmor in slo-mo.

You might be right, I didn't examine it that closely. I'm pretty sure he's said he can add new animations, that just might not actually be an example of it.

Please, please! We need this man, dont give up hope!

So how did this guy add this animation mod then? http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/downloads/file.php?id=9421&navtag=file/images.php?id=9421&tab=3

Again those are just animation replacers.

As for the underwater combat the author has already posted in this thread.

Those will be available for purchase via DLC. Just wait for it.

If its something different than 200 variations of a wolf, i'd want a dinosaur, and want it badly.

So ... just to recap and confirm my current understanding of the animation situation with Skyrim:

1.) Creating animations from scratch the Skyrim engine can read and play is possible. Right now it is only possible with 3Ds Max by using the official HKX file exporter plugin provided by HCT 2010.2 (Havok Content Tools version 2010.2). Blender users are pretty much out of luck.
Those new animations, while compatible with Skyrim, still lack some “extended” functionality. For example, all custom walking animations created thus far miss the footstep sound trigger entries.

2.) It is NOT possible to add completely new animations to any actor (or beast) without replacing one of the existing animations. The game engine triggers animations by sending “animation events” down a actors Behavior graph and Havok Behavior itself deals with deciding which animation files are actually played. All this Behavior stuff happens completely outside the scope of the CK (Creation Kit).

3.) Creating a completely new creature with its own unique animations IS possible without replacing existing content, but its Behavior is limited to whatever original creature the Behavior was copied from. For example: If the original has two attack animations, the copy must have two attack animations too. Not three, not one. Two.
Since Behavior is not just a “list” of what animations to play for a animation event, not every original creature is suitable for every custom creature. For example: It might no longer look like a chicken, might not walk like a chicken, maybe not even sound like a chicken ... but deep down it will still behave like a chicken.

Is that the current gist of it?

From what I understand of it that seems to be just about right. Thanks for wording it so clearly.

Just editing the actor's behavior graph is a twofold issue, as getting ahold Havok's Behavior program isn't exactly realistic, and even if you were able to somehow get ahold of it Bethesda would still have to release the behavior files they created, which isn't likely to happen it seems.

We're going to need a lot more than something like niftools this time around.

Thought it was supposed to be an example of mods you can make with the CK...

what about this?
do someone downloaded it while it was available?

http://www.havok.com/news-and-press/releases/havok-releases-behavior-tool-download-game-character-design

Well would you look at that... I'll stop putting my foot in my mouth.

But can you make the player character use existing npc-animations?

It's easy to lose track. lol

It's a semi confusing subject too, because when people see a new animation on the nexus or elsewhere they assume that it really is a "new" animation (why shouldn't they?) and don't see what the big deal is.

Several bit in that video give signs that it is using it own rig:
1) The tendrils coming off its front animate -> these do not even exist on the SF.
2) When it dies it does not ragdoll if it was just a new mesh on the SF skeleton it would ragdoll -> what point would there be in purposely breaking the Ragdoll?

It was using the SF Behavior files though -> I have since altered it to using the Horker Behavior Files as that Graph has several Special Idles and still allows swimming/attacking while swimming.


OLD very old -> far to old for Skyrim... actually far far to old to be useful for any game using Behavior.

Its still available Online though if you can find it.

does anyone know what version of the behaviour tools skyrim used 6.5 maybe saiden?

Version shouldn't matter. Files they used inside of it do, which we don't have.

I doubt this is true for Idle Animations.

The Behavior Files Header reads the same version as the Animation files hk_2010.2.0-r1... the latest version of HBT released was 6.6.0 and that was released in ~2009 essentially a lifetime ago.

But even if we did have HBT from Havok it would not help because we need Beth's version to do anything as the game requires a ton of Bethesda Skyrim Specific nodes there are multiple BSEvents, BSStates, BSListeners, BSGenerators -> almost half of the functions required by the game are BSSpecific.

What exactly makes you doubt it? Just wishful thinking, or ...?

Look at the “Idle Animations” editor under “Gameplay → Animations”. We can no longer specify animation files directly, only “animation events”.
Animation events are not editable anywhere in the CK. The CK just presents the available events for the relevant actor graph in a selector box. Fait accompli.

Anyway I really, really hope I am wrong. I really NEED the ability to add new (idle) animations.

http://www.creationkit.com/Idle_Animations

LOOSE: This section holds Idles that are not associated with any specific Actor Action. Instead, Idles in this section can be called via script, dialogue, or AI package.


That's what made me doubt. I came across it some time ago but was too busy with something else, and it only lingered in my subconscious mind.

So in your mind just giving the Loose ID a Name magically links it to an animation you threw into the animations folder ?!?

Got to love the "ITS MAGIC" theory !

EVERY animation uses an Anim Event except the anims that are broken a few of the Paired anims fall into this category -> and their anim events exist in the Graph they are just not linked so the broken anims will not trigger.

Anim Events are defined in the Behavior Graph -> we can not alter this file -> thus we can not add new idles to existing actors !... fairly simple to follow.

----

I started using Paired animations from a faux actor to force idles onto existing actors but this is not adding anything its sidestepping the issue at best and with the large volume of problems that forcing a paired onto a still living actor possess' this is only good for very few applications...

No need to be quite so hostile, he's simply pointing out that the data is there. Unless Bethesda un-gimps the CK and/or allows us the tools to work with this data ourselves, any avenue of functionality is worth investigating. I confess it'd be very nice to see a kind of "SkyEdit" program for Behaviors, or some other home-brew creation that grants us behavior functionality, but I'm no programmer and have no knowledge of what kind of work that would actually entail. Quite a bit, I'm guessing.

Now I'm curious ... so what does it mean when it says "Instead, Idles in this section can be called via script, dialogue, or AI package." ?

If "calling" an idle triggers playing an animation then it sounds to me like an event triggered by a script can be used to trigger an animation. Scripts can be attached to existing actors and objects right, so, if taken literally it sounds like a mechanish for attaching animations to actors and objects.

Where's the barrier?

Anim Events are defined in the Behavior Graph NOT in the CK and without that Action(CK/Game Event) to Anim Event(Behavior Event) Mapping you do not have a link from the CK/Game to the Behavior animation.hkx sitting in the Animations folder, thus you have nothing usable.

The easiest method available right now is to just Copy/Paste the entire Character Actor and define a new Race with the Copy -> then you can pick and choose which Idles to replace without replacing a vanilla anim, this way you can have unique actors with unique Idles it just requires a lot more work then the previous games.

Downside to this is you can not call ANY idles from a secondary actor onto a primary actor so all of the replaced idles on Character2 will NOT play on Character1.

But the Upside is !!!
Currently I am using the SetRace Command along with multiple Custom Races to animate into the game 1 Handed Spears, 2 Handed Halberd/Poleaxes, Throwing Potions(Explosives, Poisons, etc...), Throwing Weapons(Axe, Daggers) and XBows.