Of course even FnV is totally different from Fallout3,and for obvious reasons (different developer,different type of game -FnV is an Rpg,Fallout 3 and Skyrim in my opinion are action/adventure games with some Rpg element indeed)

The first thing they need to do is get rid of the GPS that shows things around you when you aren't even close. There is no incentive to explore when things just pop up on your compass when you aren't even close to them to where you can see them yourself.

The second thing is to make it so that you can be interupted when using fast travel so that there is no advantages to use it and have it take longer to get somwhere than instantly.. Right now the advantage to using fast travel, you get there instantly with the only time being used is in game time. If you had to look at a loading screen for a few minutes you would rather walk. The second advantage is that you can fast travel without ever being stopped and attacked. Remove that as well.

I agree, and that is why i used a mod to make the compass show only North, East, West and South. Like a real compass, not a GPS with radar Also removed the player marker from map, so i actually have to navigate with the map and compass

Welcome to this forum. Most of the malconents have spent hundreds of hours playing it.

I hardly ever agree with you... but I do here. If even they could do that when you up the difficulty to Master, I'd be fine with it (rather than a toggle).

Well, Skyrim is a big game, it takes time to see past the shiny and dragons

Hmm. I've always found those an encouragement to "explore". Ooh! There's something over that way! Let's ramble that direction and see what's there! (And what else I find along the way!) This is, of course, on top of just wandering around the countryside peeking under rocks.


...so it's not instant?


"If we make the time-saving feature obnoxious and time consuming, people won't use it!" That's an interesting idea. Kind of goes against the entire concept, though.


I certainly wouldn't mind the ability to get a "random encounter" some % of the time with FT, like in Fallout 1. Another thematic improvement (for the "but my precious immershunz!" crowd) would be to replace the generic loading screen with an Indiana Jones-style "dotted travel line moving across the map" animation, to reinforce the fact that you are traveling & it's taking time.

What? Skyrim is beautiful, While Fallout was fun to explore it got boring with its mostly flat landscape (I mean, it got boring faster with the lack of variety in Landscape)

I like to explore, Visually, not so much Meaningfully.

Skyrim beats Fallout visually.

Skyrim needs to add books that detail a location, and only when you read that book(No Quest is given, its about the player ACTUALLY reading the text and seeing where to go) the secret entrance will be 'clickable'/'revealed'

Fallout 3 had an unnamed quest -- learn what happened to this society. My favorite quest. I wanted to go everywhere and collect all those audiotapes and notes to find out what the world was like prewar, during the war, and after. Not so much in Vegas because there was not as much data and some of it was only seeable if you went down a certain quest chain. Nothing like that in Skyrim or Oblivion except maybe for the books, and that wasn't really a single coherent story. That's like I liked to wander in FO3.

The crafting in FONV wasn't bad, but not nearly as satisfying as Skyrim and Oblivion. You don't get the gasps of delight from the beauty of Oblivion and Skyrim in FO. There's more a sadness and light depression seeing all the damage. But still you want to see everything.

Perhaps this is the main reason of their displeasure ...and they even ignore it

I'm reluctant to call Fallout 3's internal areas "Dungeons"... Fallout 3 just didn't have that dungeon-crawler feel built into it like Skyrim and Oblivion, and to a lesser extent, Morrowind.

Maybe the problem is, Skyrim is very aware that it's a game, it uses a lot of elements in it's level design that don't feel natural because it wants consistency. Similar to I guess Daggerfall and Arena or even Diablo, (Making Morrowind the outlier here). So you have these "Levels" Where you fight your way to a tangible "Reward" (Treasure), instead of locations that have believable context and purpose beyond "Looting". In not so many words, "Dungeons" in Skyrim (And Oblivion) simply exist to be looted.

I would really like to see the whole "Boss Chest" thing phased out. It just seems to me like a very lazy piece of design. I mean, I really have a hard time believing a cave occupied entirely by spiders would have a giant, pristine coffer containing a bunch of enchanted treasures.

I know what you mean,but searching for "logic" in a fantasy game like this would be like having six with Camilla,Carlo and the Queen itself at the same time.

Well,on a second thought all is possible in England in this regard

Hehehe. I've heard that one before. It doesn't negate the irony, however. If I've spent over 100 hours on a game, I'd look like a fool if I complained about it. I realize this and have never complained about games that I've spent over 100 hours on... I believe in the power of intellectual honesty.

I think you're right. Every dungeon has a boss and boss chest (except few of the smaller, animal filled caves). Kill the boss, loot the chest, dungeon is marked "cleared". Skyrim doesn't even try to hide that it is a game, meant to be completed


Well, for me it took about 60 hours to go from to Still as i find it mostly I've kept playing it, but i don't see how that's supposed to prevent me from speaking of things i find wrong in it After all, all those faults aren't visible form the get-go, some may become apparent only in following playtroughs. Personally i dismiss any complaint made by a person who has played less than 100 hours.

Except the ones regarding the UI

Well, the graphics are much better in Skyrim... but they are unique games. I loved exploring in Fallout as well. Mainly because they did such an excellent job of recreating the DC area (postapocolyptic, of course). One of the things I loved most was trying to locate landmarks to see how Bethesda rendered them after the destruction of a nuclear holocaust. New Vegas, not so much for me, mainly because, if you've ever been to Vegas, you'll notice right away that there is pretty much nothing outside of the Strip and the old downtown. The key to enjoying the exploration in New Vegas was with less familiarity and more discovery. Skyrim, like Morrowind and Oblivion before it, is a complete fabrication... so other than lore related architecture that bears some similarities with past games, the land is completely foreign to start with. It's pure exploration. I like all of the games in this paragraph... which shows by the reality that I played them for over 100 hours a piece.

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I think finding the "Enchanted uber weapon" should be the exception, rather than the rule. I had a much better time when "Looting" usually involved gathering a bunch of what is essentially "Clutter", from a bunch of different dungeons, and pawning this crap off to buy the Glass Armor at Ghostgate. Sprinkled very rarely in there, are the rare gem dungeons that contain something amazing (Galom Daeus Daedric Boots, for example).

Finding an enchanted suit of armor or weapon in every cave just really creates a sense of oversaturation. And it's doubly weird because with shops, you don't really need to do that. Just make merchants a bigger part of a player's "Life".

I like exploring in Skyrim because of the beautiful scenery but there is no rewards for it. I wish it was like FNV where you could find really unique weapons and armor from exploring out of the way places. Skyrim doesn't have that because of the overpowered black smithing feature. Now I just roll around RPing as a hunter living of the land and trying to make armor that I have the material for makes the game a little more fun.

Well, Fallout 3 and NV also probably have more "named" item treasures because, as "modern"/sci-fi games, they can't really fit in a wide variety of Magic Powers to give equipment. There's AK-47 and Named AK-47.... but not AK-47 of . At least not if they want it to be even vaguely "realistic" (Versus, say, Borderlands with it's fire/shock/acid guns of infinite ammo)

FONV gave you the chance to do a little bit of "enchanting" with the weapon mods. But even that was pretty tightly controlled. Item creation just isn't quite as free-wheeling as it can be in a magic-rich fantasy setting.

I felt the need to explore Skyrim more more than the Capital Wasteland.

New Vegas played so differently from Elder Scrolls and Fallout 3, I'm not even sure exploration could be argued as a mechanic within that game. I felt that the experience was a lot more directed than even Fallout 3. From enemy placement, to quest progression, it always seemed like the game had one very specific location it wanted me to go at any given time. It played a lot more like... Mass Effect 2 I guess. Where you're intentionally directed along the main narrative, but there's lots of other side missions to do along the way. That interpretation is optional as per the design of New Vegas, but not adhering to that path always seemed... wrong.

Playing a ton of hours (And I mean a ton) in New Vegas gave me an appreciation for just how different Bethesda's games really are. Here is a game that runs more-or-less on the same tools Bethesda made for a game that was essentially a prequel in the classic sense of videogame sequalage, yet they feel fundamentally different in how they approach the role of the player.

Compare say... Wasteland Survival Guide, arguably one of the first quests the player will receive in Fallout 3, to... Really any quest in New Vegas. WSG plays out almost like an entirely different faction of the game, taking the player, quite literally, all over the map before its final resolution. Considering that WSG is acquired in the first major town, from the shop (likely the first place a seasoned RPG player will visit) and the fundamental difference in design approach is pretty apparent. I'm actually having a really hard time putting the feeling into words.

I guess in a bit of a cryptic manner, The player exists because of Fallout 3, where as Fallout: New Vegas exists because of the player.

With Oblivion and Skyrim though, you see a lot more of that trending where the World revolves around the player, and the world tries to fit the player. Instead of Fallout 3/Morrowind, the player inhabits the world, and tries to find his place in it. The dichotomy isn't something that's superficial though, it's buried very deep in the design, but at the end of the day, I feel that when the experience revolves around the player, you have a hard time convincing that very same player of the world's integrity and believability.

Deimos doesn't fast travel. And I have found some pretty novel things. I found out more about the alchemist who has a shack where he abandoned. I happen to want to collect all the alchemist journal entries. I also found a tower with lots of jewels inside of it. I've found an old Akarvi sword, etc.

No Radiant Quest though.

I agree.

The only problem I have with Skyrim is that there are not a lot of unique items that you can find anymore, like the Mentor's ring (Morrowind). I like exploring because there are neat unique dungeons like Ironbind Barrow (just beat it last night, it was awesome.) I think the reason so many people dont like exploring is there is no reason to delve into deep dungeons for goodies because it's all just gonna be randomly generated crap that is useless to them because they already got better items.

No, I'm not talking about climbing. I'm talking about having the CHOICE to enter a subway tunnel as opposed to being forced to go in one. I'm given a quest marker that's half way across the map and then I'm told through game mechanics that I only have one possible route to get there? How the **** is that open?

And why shouldn't I be able to go wherever I want? Because i don't have some bizarre mental hang-up about entering dungeons in order? Absurd.

Dude, you understand that we all can have opinions and yours is not the only one? Why make a thread if you're just going to disagree with whoever conflicts with your opinion.

OT: I FT'ed a lot in FO but I still really loved the game. Skyrim's atmosphere is much better IMO and that means I'm usually leggin it everywhere I go.