as others have said, why take out good stuff from the old games?
and simple "add this it would be great" things help too... like fishing and better cooking

I guess you haven't read Meyer much.

Well, I guess there isn't such thing as negativity either. We each have our feelings about others' opinions and our experience of them. That's a great point, try it sometime.

Really? Three or four dungeon crawls and five hours after joining the guild and they're making you leader? And you're Arch-Mage and every court wizard you meet is suggesting you should consider joining the mage's guild. That's the most perfect immersion you've ever experienced in a video game?

Is Miller Lite the most perfect beer you've ever tasted?

I've got Fallout: New Vegas on line two being way better and more epic than Skyrim in almost every way you could conceive of and many you couldn't.

Only been here a week but seems most of the moaning isn't related to gameplay but missing features from previous titles, like spell making.

I'm loving skyrim.

I just had a rough start.

Character 1:
Destruction-heavy-armor enchanter... ... ... ... ... ...
Enchant cost-reduction, or suffer.
Realize that my non-mages deal the same amount of damage with expert-level destruction spells... and that non-destruction-characters also can cast a thousand expert spells per minute simply because they can craft the exact same cost reduction gear and cast destruction spells off base magicka -- while my character has 320 magicka, and is clearly inferior to the characters with 100 magicka and 350 health.
I don't like the idea of wearing gear that allows child peasants to cast spells that are befitting archmages, made by an enchanter who just started enchanting 3 days ago.
... character abandoned awaiting destruction scaling AND cost reduction cap of 50%.

Character 2:
Smith...
I started leveling smithing, assuming I would have to start looking for materials or raise gold anytime soon to be able to continue crafting..
...
...
Started new character once I realized I wouldn't have any fun looting, and had no reason to explore caves because my character already was a god.

Third character.
Confreakinjurer sneak-thief archer.
...
Power-level: Over 9000

But at the least I still have fun finding better armor, even though I wish I hadn't taken conjuration.

I would have restarted, but I have already spent a total of 200 hours in the game on the first three characters not getting anywhere, VERY FAST, and I had yet to find the horn before yesterday.-

Self-discovered blacklist of really overpowered skills:
Conjuration
Sneak
Blacksmithing
Enchanting
Archery with bound bow

Self-discovered blacklist of really underpowered skills:
Speechcraft
Lockpicking
Destruction

My ideal character, after reading about the skills and trying to make a normally challenging character (all my characters were under or overpowered) that doesn't have to kite all the time (destruction mage) :

One-handed, archery, blocking, heavy-armor.

I just didn't realize it was so easy to effortlessly overpower the game without

Graphics: 8/10 (I'm impressed the xbox can look this good, but it is not full HD, and while that is hardware limitation of outdated hardware -- it does affect the graphical experience.)

Skills: 5/10 (See above -- my greatest frustration so far)

Sound: 8/10 (Love the music, otherwise, meh. Not bad.)

UI: 4/10 (Where is the information I need? Why is half the screen used for a 3d-model instead of information about all the objects in the lists? Active effects? Are diseases and poisons magic?)

Gameplay: 9/10 (GREAT! Except the amount of suicidal dragons who on an average manage to kill 0.25 people before dying. My current character has killed 50 by level 31.)

General awesomeness: 9/10 (Fish swim upstream, you can fall for 5 seconds from some places, that feel when the arrow flies for 2 seconds and hit an enemy or fox 150 yards away... So much awesome!)

Overall: 8/10
(I use the full spectrum 1-10 -- not just 6-10 like popular review sites. Only perfect games can get 10/10 -- it is currently impossible for a game to be perfect, but that does not mean they could not have been.)
(Full HD, 32-bit colors (!!!), 4x antialiasing, low amounts of fog, 60 frames per second are the requirements for graphics -- on a console; Whatever the TVs a the moment are capable of displaying at the moment the game comes out)

Dragon Age: 7/10
Oblivion: 8/10
BG2: 8,5/10 (Would've been 9 without many of the spells being all wrong from D&D)
NWN: 6.5/10
Planescape: Torment: 7,5/10
MW3: 5/10
MW2: 4/10
CoD4: 8/10
Half-Life: 7/10
Unreal: 7,5/10
...

It amazes me how people can forget that it's only their opinion that the game svcks or the quests svck or the magic svcks or the map svcks or the leveling svcks or whateverthebuck svcks. Not everyone thinks that or agrees with it. Bethesda has a lot of people to please, first of all themselves because they're making the games they want to play. I'm good with that. I want to see what they think is good. The above is my humble opinion and I think Skyrim is awesome. That's my humble opinion too.

I know right?

I had planned to swear off TES after Oblivion (I hated it, sorry) but then my teenage son started barraging me with the Youtube videos of Skyrim and the new "Creation Engine". I eventually caved and ended up buying us each a copy at midnight the 1st day (him on PS3, me on Xbox). Yes the voice acting is still bad and the dialogue is even worse but I must admit, the asthetically pleasing game world, improved combat and improved character creation are able to distract me enough (along with me RPing my ass off) to ignore the usual Bethesda crapadoodle.

I'm having fun.........so far.

Especially since the destination svcked in this instance.

Intellectual humilty (and respect) are often not at a premium when you're using a medium where there is no risk of getting punched in your nerdy face.

The Elder Scrolls games aren't meant to be compared to previous titles. They are designed from the ground up for each independent game. Bethesda has said this, and I say it all the time.

And the context your applying that statement is entirely incorrect

Different each installment? is that why

All the races are still known by their names?

That bugs from morrowind still exist in Skyrim to this day?

that the weapon classes and gameplay have more or less been identical for 10 years?

That in general how you play the game/ go about doing things in Skyrim is unchanged for the most part?

When Beth says they "build each game from the ground up" its in the sense that your character doesn't exist in the next interation, that the province, story and people you meet are for the most part different, that there is no Morrowind 2 Dagoth Urs revenge or Daggerfall 2.

Well, i knew (more or less) what i was getting: an open world dungeon crawler that can be (eventually) modded to my liking.

Like i've said, compared to oblivion the core is better, but it just feels unfinished. Atleast i sure hope it's unfinished and not intentional design However, i'll pass final judgement only after all the patches and DLCs are released. My current impression is between and A bit closer to

Actually, I complained because for the first 4 days after instllation, I couldn't play my bow assassin because the bow didn't work. Arrows would fly about 5 feet and then hit the ground. Only after another player recommended that I go to a certain page in the game and hit the reset button for keys to go back to default, was the game playable for me.

It seem when the game installed itself, it assigned random letters to random actions. To pull the bowstring to its max position required the "R" key, which is used for a lot of things on the PC, but pulling the bowstring is not one of them. And even the in-game help section said to use that letter. After resetting the keys to default, it change to the mouse key, what it should have been from the beginning - but I tried that and didn't work till after the reset.

So, I guess you're right, I don't represent the norm because nobody else seemed to have that problem.

I have some advice for you, get off your high horse. The game is great and I really enjoy it now, but there are still thousands of players that have major and minor problems. If you don't think so, check out the Hardware/Software section for your platform.

Oh, and as far as getting attention, I'm 64 and have been married since 1971 - my wife gives me all the attention I need.

People like you are unbelievable with your so-called "righteous indignation."

E

I honestly am not creative enough to come up with the criteria that would need to be used to make this claim. Skyrim, like all TES (and now Fallout) games, is instantly accessible to anyone who has played any of the previous games. The gameplay mechanics are just an evolution (or devolution depending on who you ask) of everything since Morrowind, and to some extent even Daggerfall. Even a lot of the music is from Morrowind.

If you look at the esm files that are the _definition_ of skyrim, a lot of settings still exist from Fallout and FONV (references to guns, action points, etc.). They didn't even change the names of the variables--and they don't have to, I'm just pointing out the facts.

Wow you sound pretty irritated. I sure hope my Give a F**k is mostly out of order when I'm 64.

word imagine punch-o-vision

"When I get older losing my hair,
Many years from now,
Will you still be sending me a valentine
Birthday greetings bottle of wine?

If I'd been out till quarter to three
Would you lock the door,
Will you still need me, will you still feed me,
When I'm sixty-four?"


I knw you might have some problems, but OP was talking about hatred (For being different from Morrowind, Oblivion, Daggerfall... or too similar), and not "[censored], I have a bug" mentality.

Yeah, this thread is full of nothing but

Sorry to tell you OP but you don't know everyone's opinion's towards Skyrim and their reasons for thinking it. I for one dislike the game because of how lackluster it is and how many features that are present in games that have been released in the past 10 or so years(like good dialogue and choices) and what they added is extremely shallow like enhanced graphics. Sure I don't hate it, I want to love it, but I can't because of how little depth there is.

Spot on, more or less, although it's not just not being able to play but not wanting them to continue down the road they've started on, I want to see them improve as a company and have TES VI restore my faith in them before it's completely lost as Lionhead manage to do.
I try not to whine for the sake of whining, it may come across as that from the sheer volume of complaints I have, but I refuse to blind myself to the sheer volume of issues with the game, it's simply not well put together on any aspect, even graphics being the best they still failed to streched textures over rocks, some even at easily visible ground level this time. If fact the "fans" probally annoy me more by insulting those willing to make the complaint, even if as hard as they want to they can't actually disagree with any of the points, the best arguement for one of the worse aspects is "Ignoring it is a valid option". Where the balance issue can't be so easily ignore and constantly are rubbed in your face when your punished for not leveling and leveling at the same time, followers don't level after you meet them but they sort of do, and they have level caps anyway, even if you meet them at thier cap and it's rescuing them they are so underpowered they'll die in one hit, made worse by having worse AI then any other followers of games made with this engine.
But even past all that I've never said I'd actually hated bethesda or skyrim, I have made a passing comment that maybe skyrim would be better off being started from scratch then trying to do the patching and things that don't usually come with patchs, like adding to areas within the game severly lacking. If I hated skyrim and bethesda though at most I'd be writing an email to thier PR (not that Id expect a reply with thier current system of "handling things") to make a complaint, taking the game back to the store and not bother to post on thier forums in hope they take on board at least some of it, maybe to even help make a patch for this dlc to address some of the balance issues.
But the game does get in its own way all the time, breaking immersion and enjoyment, frequently turning it to frustration, since having the game on the 10-11-11 (game sent it early) I must have restarted over 30 times due to various problems and game breaking bugs or discovery of some horrid design choice that I never thought they'd bring back after the cold reception it had to 90% of the community last time and in the games not of TES they seemed to realise it wasn't a good idea and just added more bugs with it anyway. Ie bugs that were in previous games that have been brought to this one even though they had fixed it, not all complaints are about the reductions in armor slots...although I do miss my undershirt and left hand ring.

Only with a purely random sample that has been properly selected, and the data collected from that sample anolyzed, using accepted statistical methods. This forum is anything but that. The best you could do with the "data" presented here is identify a few very general trends that would need to be studied in more detail before any firm conclusions could be drawn.

You could draw some conclusions for the entire human populace from a methodology similar to what this forum provides, but you'd need a much, much larger sample than 1,000 people to have any kind of confidence in them.

not even close

I saw peoples claiming morrowind was *scary* and other ridiculous claims. They are verry disconected from reality. For about 3 years straight after release, everyone complained morrowind was unchallenging, the opposite of scary. It got sort of fixed in tribunal, but especialy in bloodmoon, but that never fixed mainland vardenfell

the other classic is daggerfall, but peoples only visited daggerfall city, and the dungeons, and never went to admire the wilderness because it was 320x200 verry low res billboards

now I would love to see a skyrim the size of daggerfall, or just all 9 provinces (for a total of 45 core cities)
that doesnt make skyrim any worst

I'm very aware of how science works and yes, you're right, this forum's membership is not a proper random sampling.

The OP is right, I do not hate Skyrim. I've never said or thought so, but I am incredibly disappointed in it and I do hate Bethesda's apathy towards proper PS3 technical support, or general multiplatform support aside from that of their lead platform, I should say. Criticism is very much a warranted right and one doesn't need to be accused of hating something simply because they find flaws. Skyrim lacks a reputation system, Skyrim's factions are really short and incoherent, Skyrim lacks choices and consequences, Skyrim lacks "worth-it" handplaced loot, and Skyrim's technical quality on the PS3 is just poor (doesn't matter how much you will it so, any PS3 Skyrim player will get regularly sluggish framerates in Riften, Markarth, the fall forest, the marshes near Morthal, other forested areas, certain mist or light effect-filled dungeons, etc. and the unbearable "lag" is affecting a very decent-sized number of people to the point of getting media coverage, which says something; the PS3 version is factually, against Bethesda's false pre-release claims, inferior to its 360 counterpart in performance, quality control, and graphical quality). Stating these things, criticizing the choices, and wishing for better is no crime or evidence of hatred.