Oakflesh, stoneflesh, ironflesh, ebonyflesh... You don't have many defensive spells in Skyrim, you have two. Defense buff and ward. Same with destruction and the udead. There aren't many spells. At all.

But they made nice effects for them, so 10 spells is enough, right?

Purely objective facts (interpret them however you like):
-There is less types of spells in skyrim compared to oblivion
-There is no way to get better versions of your spells
-You outlevel your spells, renderign them useless for the rest of the game
-With enchant fortify destruction you can achieve unlimited power (not related, just throwing it out there)
-The magic system IS dumbed down

Subjective side note: People not wanting more spell variety/customization makes me sad and confused

No sorry dual wielding is just a gimmick.(obviously my opinion) For mages it does absolutely nothing that could not have been handled by spell making, and for the mixed weapon and spell types it is done so poorly that all it really does is speed up your attacks. We lost a lot more magic effects than we gained and they were far more interesting than what we gained IMO, so I would not trade it for anything.

And no the only thing lacking is not spell effects. Even with the spell effects we have they don't have spells we might want and they never will cover what players want without spell making. Not only in the degrees of spells like a adept version of flames, but in the delivery methods like wouldn't a rune version of heal that went off whenever you or an ally stepped on it be useful, or those wards for repelling undead, how about a ward that increases the armor of all within it, or does frost damage to all who enter it etc. They just wont ever cover all the bases without spell making.

Pretty much this. I agree.

You can't even call dual-wielding a system that has anything substantial to it. It's completely superficial. But it's better than nothing. We still could have both.
Besides, what did we gain? Explain? How in oblivion, is this system more interesting?

Yes, I do see people bashing those that are happy with it. For one, I already see it coming when I was asked what platform I play on. I already know the response is going to be that I am somehow a less complex gamer because I play on a console, which is absolutely bogus.

Yes, the claim of "dumbing down" is incredibly insulting, because it also indirectly implies that I am a "dumber" gamer because I like what we got better than the "oh so complex" ( ) Morrowind of yesteryear.

No, it is not out of line for people to make negative feedback against Bethesda, but more often than not (even in this very thread) it resorts to "dumbing down", "ignore him, he doesn't know what he's talking about", "Bethesda is lazy", etc...

No, not all complaints are mindless ranting and whining. Yes, many complaints are valid and should be heard.

But yes, it also gets incredibly annoying and frustrating when there are new threads upon new threads upon new threads complaining about the SAME THING OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER again.

Yes, we get it, people are unhappy with the spell system. Yes, we get it, people are unhappy that Smithing and Enchanting are "overpowered". Yes, we get it, people are unhappy that Destruction is "underpowered" (those are all in quotes because those are other people's words, and I don't believe those claims to be true). But the same complaints don't need to be repeated over and over and over and over again.

I would actually like to come on this forum and talk about the game. Talk about my character's progression. Talk about my experiences in the game with other fans of the game.

But I can't. Because every time there is a non-complaining thread, it is drowned out and lost by the incessant whining threads that don't stop, and just keep coming and coming and coming and coming and saying the same crap over and over and over again. It's incredibly annoying.

It's incredibly frustrating when I am called a troll, and people talk about how they need to just disregard me, because I like the magic system, and yes, I believe it is better than the past, and yes, I have explained why, and yes, I do believe there is room for improvement, and yes, have explained why. And yes, I have explained why Spellmaking doesn't fit in this game, at least with my opinion, and no, it's not as simple as "I don't like it, it shouldn't be in", and yes I have acknowledged that I am not a designer and that I don't have the credibility to convince anyone who disagrees otherwise, but still, my opinion is disregarded and nobody can just accept the fact that I LIKE THE SYSTEM AS IS and don't think these things that are being clamored for can work.

I don't believe Spellmaking was as in depth and complex as it's been made out to be, yes I have seen the arguments why it is, and no none of them can convince me. I've seen the system first hand, and I know what it is and isn't capable of. But instead, I'm insulted for nothing being smart or creative enough with the system.

The funny thing is, that's not even my argument why I don't want it. My argument is of the technical variety, and why I don't feel it would mesh with the current casting system, and as is, I would prefer the newer casting system over Spellmaking.

But no, that's not good enough. I still have to be labeled a troll, and called "narrow-minded", and whatever other accusations people want to make about me because I have formed an opinion that's not liked around here.

Yes, that is incredibly frustrating, and no it does not endear me to your argument. Quite the opposite, it makes me want to see Spellmaking never implemented, just because I don't think that attitude and mentality that's showcased around here deserves to get what they want.

I've made my point, I'm not going to continue to repeat myself. You don't have to agree with me, I'm not asking you to. But if the whiners and complainers get to have their voice heard, I too, get to have my voice heard.

Pretty much that!

Yes you can have it.

You equip a frost spell, and you equip a shock spell, and you cast them both at the same time.

And thanks for telling me that I deserved to be insulted for having a different opinion. Now I know you are just a troll and don't deserve to have your opinion heard.

You are 100% wrong.

I will not further dignify this elitist attitude with a response.

You should be using lightning cloak as well N3WB

@ Nell2ThaIzzay
Actually, this thread is about how the new spell system is cool.

Also, when you are saying something there is difference between having an opinion and telling a nonsense. If you say there is much more variation and spells, also nothing with any significance got removed, you are either trolling, haven't played any other TES game or you haven't played Skyrim yet.

"I'm glad it was dumbed down, I never liked to have so much choices!" - Opinion
"Skyrim has so complex spellcasting system, so many spells, nothing got removed, paradise!" - Nonsense

See?

This would have no problem if spell making was in the game. In fact, it's just as easy as it was in Oblivion. I mean for all the schools, it's very simple in creating spells. In restoration, there's only really three types of spells. In destruction, all you have to do is pick an element, pick the type of attack, and damage.

I have yet to see an argument form you as to why the spell variety in skyrim is better than that in oblivion, except "It's annoying that people complain about it". The spellmaking system from oblivion is something that a lot of people really liked (to me it was the strongest selling point of the game), and you are surprised when people call you a troll after presenting no substantial arguments and calling anyone who do not agree "elitist", which I, quoting you, find very insulting indeed.

closed for review