I am wanting to do my TES take on a Conan The Barbarian type character. Conan was a talented thief among being a great warrior. Conan was also honorable though. That's the issue with the thieves guild I'm having. Stealing and doing most daedric quests for personal gain I can justify for this character and I can blotch the initial framing quest to join the thieves guild.

The issue I'm having is the very end quest, pledging your soul to Nocturnal. A. Conan character would be about Sovngarde, not Nocturnal or shadows. Do you guys feel the Dragonborn's pact with Nocturnal is binding or has anyone justified it? Only other option I see is walking away at that point and leaving the quest open, but my OCD can't handle unfinished quests.

Thoughts?

your soul is dedicated to akatosh as dragonborn, so s/he gets first dibs. i guess nocturnal would have to take on akatosh to claim you, duel-style.

I see no way to justify it. I "tried" to join it on my honorable character, but the moment I had to shake down the Argonians in the inn, causing them to hate me, I instantly reloaded and killed the thieves guild. Well, you can't really kill them, but I got them to open the closet with a glitch and I killed 60% of their members. Stupid thieves.

I think it's just really difficult. I joined on a good character and you just can't do it. You have to put an two innocent people in jail for life and ruin their businesses, you have to threaten families and break property to get money, not to mention all the killing you have to do. The Thieves' Guild of Skyrim just isn't like Oblivion's.

Ironically I made this yesterday: http://burhenn63.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d4jrjv0

But I really can't see a 'good' person doing the thieves guild quest in Skyrim. In OB they were ok, in fact kinda santioned by the Empire, but in Skyrim they are just bullies and good for nothings.

It's really strange when you regain the influence of a city and the people, even the guards, talk like it's a good thing.

I'd like to see that fight...

My character is Neutral and relatively self serving on my first playthrough thus justifying most quests in the game as long as there's something in it for me... As an honorable character I can't really see joining the Skyrim Thieves Guild though... But there is honor among thieves if you do join aside from a couple but I won't spoil it for you...

Lol. Exactly. Not a fair trade.

I think they went too far with this guild. In Oblivion there were 3 rules, one being you don't steal frm the poor. In Skyrim they try not to kill because it's bad for business, you steal and frame the poor, and instead of lifting Nocturnals curse you give her your soul.

Oh well guess my Conan will steal for himself and I'll be avoiding this guild on another playthrough.

Great game... Would of been even better if there were options during the quest to take the guild to a different path, leaving you with 2 endgame outcomes for the guild. A honor among thieves with no Nightengales would of been my taste.

Exactly. When I saw we could 'rebuild' the guild I was hoping that was going to be our choices. As it turns out all it mean is instead of bullying people in Riften you get to bully them everywhere.

Another point to consider is that where in the game does it REQUIRE you to join the thieves guild to be a thief... I stole many things before I joined the guild... There's no requirement to join it but if you don't I don't recommend stealing anything you aren't going to use unless you have the high level speechcraft perks, but seeing as Conan didn't tend to talk much at all it doesn't seem to me that he'd have very high speechcraft...

You aren't really pledging anything to Nocturna, except to keep her hidden temple safe and hidden. You can be a disciple of another divine without breaking that pledge, can't you? I'm not even sure you can break that pledge. It's not like there are options to go around town and say "hey, I just went to the coolest place, you should come check it out and tag the walls with me.."

Actually Conan was highly intelligent and could understand languages easily. His 'speechcraft' would of been high.

Conan portrayed by Arnold is one variation of the character. He didn't talk in the movie because his English was bad at the time lol.

I never said all thieves are in the thieves guild. Just was trying to find a way to justify my honorable thief/warrior to join.

Quite true. The books are a much better window on Conan as anything BUT barbarian....

As to the current iteration of the Thieves' Guild.... nope. Can't go there. It's too far on the "dark side" for me. Even CG toons won't touch it....

Justify it as saying that you can help rebuild the Guild into a sort of Robin Hood like thing since the guild is pretty much in the gutter in this point. After all, would you expect a company that was about to declare bankruptcy to just give away thousands to charity?

I have to agree. I didn't feel good about playing that character at all. Unfortunately I met that guy I had to set up in Riften and learned about him being orphaned and looking for his parents - JEEZ Bethesda!! What the hell?? If I had no soul I wold have joined the DB.

I like the idea of the Thieve's Guild not being so noble, but the problem is that it makes them at times indistinguishable from the Dark Brotherhood. It makes me think that in the next game they should just have an all encompassing "evil" faction that you can join. As a member you could choose to work for them as a thief, or assassin, or an enforcer.

I never got that far. Because I had bad feelings about both the TG and DB questlines from the word go and did some research. I suppose there are people who actually can divorce their "real selves" from what they play in a game - but I simply can't do that. And I've been playing CRPGs since 1985 (and AD&D PnP games since the mid-70s....)

Role-play is one thing. Actors role-play.... and no one thinks an actor playing a villain is evil himself.... But I simply cannot role-play something totally outside my real nature. I suppose that means I'm missing some questlines. Well.... that's fine. I don't have any issues with that.

simple as pie yet complex as well.

"your family has had many members in the theives guild. You are said to descend from the gray fox! you feel that the thieves guild is a part of your destiny, but not all. You come to riften and see "How the mighty have fallen" --- the theives guild had become thuggish, and small. the poor no longer praise them (like oblivion)....

you cannot destroy what should be redeemed. you MUST join, whatever comprises you have to make are towards the goal. you will find what leaders have shaped it this way, and you will unseat them, and restore the TG"

if you notice the quests, after mercer is gone, you no longer do quests to shake down people.

hope that helps.

edit: I don't remember having to kill a single being that was not already hostile towards me. as for framing innocent people, yes. but in MY game, the fact they stay in jail so long is a gltich that I will fix with a mod. hey, who does not go to jail a few times, right.

Yes, how dare someone actually play differently than they would in real life. Why should I play a fire-breathing lizard who can be an epic dragonslayer when I can be a regular person in real life

/sarcasm

Tell me, do you kill bandits and such? If so, do you kill people in real life? If not, do you wonder if those bandits maybe have families or are forced into their situation with the war. You make it seem like people who join the TG and DB are essentially kitten-eating monsters.

so am I to imply that since I did, I have no soul?

Well according to the game if you completed it then Nocturnal has your soul. That's my biggest irk with the quest line.

*shrug* I was posting only for myself.... No, I don't kill people IRL - but I could - if I were threatened by someone who was poised to do harm to me or mine.

I don't see where I said anything about how others should role-play this - or not. If you just needed an attack target, well, fine - I guess that was me and my post. Otherwise, I'm not sure what your issue is.

If you actually paid attention to the questline, you realized that Nocturnal owning your soul is only until you repay your debt to her. If you return the Skeleton Key, Nocturnal states you essentially already paid your debt. So you get cool powers and Nocturnal gets the Skeleton Key.

Well apparently I missed something cause the oath they wanted me to take was in life and death... And returning the key she says that it was expected of me ( being that she owns me and all...)

If I'm mistaken than great, but can you elaborate why you think so?

I can't really find much of a reason for an honorable warrior thief to join...

And I was actually referring to the books about him not talking much as he didn't, I don't mean that he's stupid just that he's not much of a talker... I would NEVER relate to anything by Arnold Schwarzenegger because I believe him to the the WORST actor of all time as he has absolutely no acting ability whatsoever... I have nothing against Conan though as he was a decent character to read about... Speechcraft is about how your character speaks though not how he understands others...