It doesn't mean hack content and make games shorter. It means don't give me "repeat" quests or an endless fetch quest that serves no purpose other than to give me 500g. The excess content needs to be a tad more profound and dynamic imo.

Its like taking a script for a movie. They say that "every" scene has to serve a purpose or contribute to the plot or reveal something about a character's personality.

In Skryim, there are things that serve no purpose other than to simply be a time sink.

Skyrim is a great game, but doesn't come close to matching the hype imo.

I do agree with much of what the OP says- I like many of the new game mechanics.. yet so much was dumbed down that it makes the game feel less like an actual TES game and more like something else..

OP:

While I agree that most of what you said is true, this is to be expected in an Elder Scrolls game. The meat of every TES game prior to Skyrim has been primarily about dungeon crawling. If you thought Skyrim was bad, you should play Daggerfall's dungeons - they make Skyrim dungeons look like tiny rat holes in comparison.

Having said that, Skyrim has TONS of outdoor "dungeons" to explore as well, such as bandit camps, forts, towers, ship-wrecks and much more. If you're getting sick of the constant cave exploring, try going off the rails for a while and find some outdoor environments.

Even though Skyrim continues the long tradition of dungeon crawling of the Elder Scrolls series, in my opinion, they have been vastly improved in design. Morrowind is a close second, but compared to the monotony of the Oblivion and Daggerfall dungeons, Skyrim is a HUGE improvement. Criticizing Skyrim's dungeons is also a criticism of the dungeons of the entire series - but your'e missing the fact that Skyrim has improved them greatly over its predecessors in general.

Well, I actually admire that Skyrim is a GREAT game, but the OP made me think about it...

My main is 35 atm, and I never EVER found a good item in a cave, something that would replace my current gear (well, going from Iron to Steel doesn't count, really), unless if there's some boss in it. (like, Dragon priest masks... but I think that's all)
I've yet to see an Ebony armor in game (made one for myself 15 levels ago). And I mean in caves/dungeons, not at traders (they already have it), not speaking about daedric stuff (same here, have it, made one 10-8 levels ago)

All the enchantments I'm using are coming from own enchants (made at 70 enchant)
Maybe I didn't explore enough, and there're some very high level areas?


P.S. No, I'm not proposing the Oblivion's Daedric bandits, God forbid... but it'd be nice to have some reward from clearing out a cave... like, not just bunch of gems. And not always, of course, but at least few times during 40-50+ hours playthrough, and not just from "epic" bosses...

P.P.S. Although, it's not as bad as it may sound. And there're other things to fix first)

He's got a point. The tried and true formula is wearing a bit thin for some people. Though many intangibles have been vastly improved, the main concept of the game hasn't really changed at all. Get quests, go to dungeon, do some stuff. I think he's just asking for more quests to revolve around the world outside of caves. Which isn't too much to ask really. I think Oblivion had it's fair share of quests that took place outside of a cave or in place that were NOT caves, like transporting you to a dream world. There might be something like that though, I haven't played every quest yet.

Now I'm all for additional variety with the optional content though I know there's a point where I have to moderate my expectations since they must at some point release a product. There are definitely tasks that are timesinks in the game just like many, many other titles and practically every MMO ever made (Collect X number of X from X). The question is are you having fun while wasting your time, and I almost invariably do. When I enter the 134th dungeon of the game and see some same-ish content I'm still involved: I'm hoping to find the last book of that series I've been collecting, maybe a flawless gem for crafting, or an item I've picked out to flood my player house with. In the Fallout games, for instance, I collected garden gnomes and I'm fairly certain every single one in those games were recovered and placed in my house.

I'm the type player who uses a lot of my own imagination when playing to fill in the blanks and create a narrative to supplement what is provided by the game. I don't think the movie anology holds up here; in fact the very nature of Elder Scrolls is to go against the scripted experience a movie offers. Games like Uncharted 3 are more like that; this is a sandbox game where they craft a world and you get to do as you please.

I loved Oblivion, I love Skyrim
Just my opinion though!!

it makes me really want to play oblivion again
i miss so much about it
the music (i like it alot more i have no idea why maybe its just me but i think oblivions was way better)
the menu system was amazingly helpful
the voice actors (argonians n khajit)
the attributes
the jumping 30m high in the air
the fact that you could actually just be your character and not be the one and only dragonborn (i HATE being dragonborn its good for my main but i want just an average guy why does he have to be so good :@)
the nice storyline length
the painting quest WAS SO EPIC
everyone going home when it was night time and going to bed instead of chillin for some reason
the dark brotherhood waking me up mid sleep and scaring the [censored] out of me with face zoom in xD
i dont think we'll get another game

Similar caves, monsters, items everywhere?

WELCOME TO TES, where have you've been?


And the idea is exploration, and yes there ARE unique things to be found, I have yet to see a dungeon that did not had at least one unique quirk on its own.

And no unique, mythical enemies?
Well try to kill any of the named Dragon Priests and get their mask. Go on!

I agree with the OP. I've played the game every day since release and so far have done around 1/3 of the main story and explored most of the south-west chunk of the map - and I'm bored. I don't want to go on. The other three quarters of the map will all be the same - cave after cave, bandit after bandit. I've basically explored the entire game without exploring the entire game. Oh and of course Bethesda are 100% sellouts - us PC gamers that made their company what it is today got bent over and shafted hard, this is a console game from top to bottom and lacks the kind of depth that Morrowind had when you were still making proper games and not just dumbed down pieces of crap for the console kiddies.

This is very true and it is a problem with all Elder Scrolls. Caves, caves and a few more caves. There is barely any quest that doesnt force you to go to a cave and honestly its getting boring. With such and amazing world as Skyrim they still make me spend more time in caves than in the forest or at the beutiful mountains. People used to complain morrowind had to many fetch quests and wanted deeper quests. Well the only difference here is that you go to a cave to fetch something. No more depth than those "fetch me a bowl for my experiment" questt Morrowind had. In fact I wold prefer them to all these dungeon crawls.

The part about loot is also true. There is absolutely no point in me to explore a cave or tomb unless part of a quest. I know I wont find an artifact there , at best I might find some leveled gear which my current equipment (gained from quests) outperforms.

Still its an excellent game, one of the best I have ever played. Yet it does not beat Morrowind which still stands as my favorite game of all time.

You sure you played all previous Elder Scrolls games? Because this series is all about what you call "filler." How many Ancestral Tombs and mines dotted Vvardenfell that served no plot-related purpose? How many ayleid ruins and Oblivion gates in Oblivion? And Daggerfall... Daggerfall practically has the record for the most "filler" content of any game, in any genre, of all time.

The only difference about Skyrim is that they created an engine to generate quests to point you toward that content, rather than allowing you to explore it without any context. If you think this makes that content less "profound and dynamic," well, I can see that, actually. Perhaps it was better when your imagination did the work, or when this content was hidden away for those who specifically wanted to seek it out. But the statement "there are things that serve no purpose other than to simply be a time sink" has always been true of this series. That's what the fans (myself among them) love about it.

The more caves the better.

I just don't really understand this. I've had plenty of quests that took place outside a cave or dungeon interior. Some of them took place half inside and half outside a dungeon. I've had quests to kill animals, collect pelts, collect herbs, assassinations in towns, etc. Sure, these are probably the exception to the norm, but it's not like there aren't quests outside to do.

There are quest but too many involve a dungeon..

*Pokes head in*

Yup, coming back here was definitely a mistake.

tl;dr

Also, dungeoncrawling is fun. TES has always had dungeoncrawling.

I agree with the op.

I mean this was like the only game i was looking forward to play for a long time, but i reached lvl 30 didn't even finished the main quest and the game is already boring for me, i can't play it more than 2 hrs a day.The gameplay is very boring i was expecting when i enter a cave to have an interesting quest waiting for me inside rather than just kill everyone inside and kill the last boss, the outside world is boring too, there are no random events than just dragon flying around and after getting that shout to make him land you can use 3 power attacks with duel wield and kill him so its not a threat at all, i am sorry but for me and for the people i know irl this game is a bit boring.

In Oblivion, my favorite part of the game was just exploring dungeons and the ruins of the Aeylids. In Skyrim, there is lots more caves and tombs/dungeons to explore. Amen!!!!

Double Amen. Skyrim is everything that Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion were, but much, much better.

I thought most rpg's expected you to explore places like caves, forts, towers, fortresses, dungeons, barrows. Those are usually the bad guy hang outs anyway.

I like Skyrim alot, i dont mind the amount of caves that are quite the same, but i do miss fphat lewwwt! Most of the stuff in the chests are pretty boring.
There might be some cool lewt , but most of the time is just.. meh...

My wishlist would be:
- More leather/furr/hide kinda armour with high amount of armour. The dragonscale/plate stuff is just toooo epic and ugly and waaaaay too much, less is more =)
- More ppl wandering the roads, caravans of travelers and they need to get robbed from time to time.
- More kinda weapons, like polearms, crossbows, throwing weapons.
- Enemy's that give up fighting when low on health. Throw away the weapon and runs like hell.
- Npc's on boats rowing the rivers/sea and do some fishing.
- Make cooking more rewarding.
- Some hunting game/tournament questkinda thingy, like find the biggest heavyist Elk/Bear/whatever.
- Thats all i can remember for now.

Oooooh best for last... Make some kinda flying mount, or maybe some spell that turns you into an crow, just like the druidspell in World of Warcraft. man that was [censored]in EPIC!!

I also agree with the OP , but that is because we expected too much of Skyrim waiting for all those years , we didn't think it would be a super Oblivion minus spell crafting . We probably over -estimated the radiant story too , to be honest , i thought we would have less dungeons , more npc , huge cities (the big let down for me ) and a lot of "non violent" quests where the story is the main focus as well as different ways to complete quests and different outcomes/choices that have long lasting influence on the characters , story and the way the NPC react to you .

I also expected that you would not be able to have 100 in almost everything (which makes characters less unique ) , and also expected a "traditional " rpg character sheet , i expected Morrowind's style of apparels (more details , left /right pauldron , robes under armours , spears etc ) with more of them in Skyrim since the game goes out a decade later with much more powerful cpu , ram and much larger hard drive ( blue ray can contain 30 gigs , Skyrim is just 5 gigs ) , i expected even more different objects , armours , weapons and clothing) , i also expected the game to have more interesting magic system with actually more schools instead of less and more polishing on various aspects of the game ( not only the frustrating interface and locked key mapping of TAB and numkeys ) involving gameplay ( pointless cooking , brutal level scaling , unrewarding loot scaling , unbalanced magic at higher levels , pointless vampires/werewolf status , some perks unbalanced like weightless heavy armour which makes light armour useless etc ) although most of them can/will be addressed by mods surely

But Skyrim is still an awesome game in its own right , the problem is in our minds IMHO , we simply expected too much and expected something different than an action/adventure game in a rpg scenery , i have over 100 hours in skyrim right now , and i just start feeling bored about it , i was shocked when the Bard guild was just one quest yesterday ,but i realize in this game , the most fun i have is not when roleplaying but actually when fighting with magic , swords and bows , most quests i found really uninteresting , not absorbing my attention there is no NPC i will remember that was attaching , what i will remember from Skyrim is the stunning art design , varied dungeons lay out and memorable music , the "wow factor when exploring and discovering locations , i think most of the energy of Bethesda went into that aspect of the game , so if you treat Skyrim as an action/adventure game mainly , i think it's a great success in this regard , also the concept is quite unique , there are only a few games like this on the market where you can create a character and wander a virtual open world with as much freedom as Skyrim , Skyrim is definetely the best among them IMHO

I say this... It's been too much cave dwelling in every TES game. These newer worlds could give us so much more, though. Morrowind's caves were clearly most variable and they had everything in them intact, which made them personal and great. Oh, and they weren't all the same cave. And there was the most non-cave quests. I mostly agree with the original poster - some great arguments there! I've had my share of dungeon dwelling that repeats and repeats and repeats itself all the time. I only do dungeons in Skyrim if I get to do something in between them... Otherwise I always go "*sigh* dungeon, not again..."

OP+1