Honestly, the "off the boat moment" goes back at least as far as Daggerfall.

But anyway, it only takes a few minute changes to add this same sense of open-world, do-what-you-will, no-hand-holding: GO!

1) Your NPC companion dies during the escape from Helgen, leaving you to experience the world without a guide.

2) Points of interest don't show up on the compass unless you've discovered them.

3) Journal entries are written as journal entries rather than a checklist of things to do. "Talk to NPC." "Pick up your sword." "Breathe."

Those three changes alone would bring it all back, I think.

Yeh...the exit from BB is when the beauty and scope of Skyrim hit me.

I then ran to Riften and got a good feel of just how freekin' big it was.

That's true, I'd say between MW, OB, NV, Fo3 and Skyrim; Fo3 has the best "welcome to the world" moment.

I agree completely.

Am I also the only one thinking that every single character in Skyrim is 'dull'?!
They all just say sentences all over and you can have interesting conversation with them.
Companions for example. You can basicly say "Wait" and "Go away"

Man I wish Bethesda hired some writers from BioWare that were working on Dragon age origins. The companions and the quests were amazing

Oh yeah, there are definitely moments in Skyrim when the place feels really impressive.

BTW, I would like point out something about Oblivion. I think it was okay for the player to know the location of major cities right from the start. It's not like your character is born in isolation. Anyone in real life would have a basic knowledge of geography to one degree or another.

Yes they're dull. And it's like they hired 10 voice actors for the whole game. The first time I met the archmage at Winterhold, I thought the guy was untrustworthy and evil because the voice actor used his "evil thief" voice....

Except that I've herad a contingent of people say, over the years, that Oblvion had no atmosphere, was just all bland green forest with no awe inspiring natural areas (hence all the mods that added such things) and that Morrowind and skyrim were the two games that had it in spades. I suspect that, as these things go, it's all subjective. I actually think Skyrim has more awe inspiring vistas than Oblivion.

I actually remember a "Zero Punctuation" where he makes fun of Oblvion's world.

Oh well, to each his own.

The first time I set eyes on the world of Skyrim (or any Elder Scrolls game, for that matter) was when I watched my friend dive into the copy I'd bought him. From the moment that opening cutscene began, I was transfixed. Watching the events unfold was a rush, as was watching him try out the game mechanics ("Can I look in this wardrobe? Oh, neat, I can. Okay, so the white barrels have stuff in them and the brown ones don't. Hey, look, I harvested a rabbit! I thought they were just there for show.") When I finally glimpsed the expansive landscape after watching him creep around cramped tunnels for so long, I was blown away. My friend didn't follow Hadvar, by the way. He took off in the opposite direction and immediately ran into a gang of bandits. Got his behind thoroughly whooped. So much for hand-holding. All this to say, I found the atmosphere quite awe-inspiring indeed and am sorry to hear that many others apparently didn't.

I think this is pretty much right. Morrowind hits you hard right from the beginning. It's a pretty brutal introduction to the game---I loved it, like many others, but it's easy to understand why a lot of people found it discouraging (and there's no need for condescending remarks about those people).

Skyrim sneaks up on you. I smashed through the first few hours, getting to Riverwood, going through Bleak Falls Barrow, getting to Whiterun, killing my first dragon. Then I got summoned by the Greybeards, and that was when I took a breath, and the scope of the game really impressed itself upon me.

It may not have been as intense as in Oblivion but I got *that* chill when I first left Helgen personally.

But part of it was a flashback I think. Sort of a "OMG Im leaving the Prison Sewers all over again, this is gonna be epic!!!"

for morrowind a lot of it has to do with the fact that it was the first time ever playing such a game- i thought the intro prophecy was well done and when you exit the census office it did a great job of saying, i'm dumping you in this huge world and you can do whatever you want. good luck.

oblivion- very nice exit from the sewers and seeing a vibrant, color-filled world.

fallout3- absolutely epic and intense feeling of this awesome post-apocalyptic world. the best for me, by far.

skyrim- i really like the start in the wagon with bound hands. it put me right into the action right away and could instantly see that the graphical world they created was going to be awesome. then, with the beheading and dragon i was ready to go. well done.

Come to think of it, you know what would have been great for Skyrim? The choice to NOT run in either after the Stormcloak or the Imperial but to run through a breach in the walls, cut your rope on a sharp rock and run off in your prisoner clothes without even a weapon, skipping the newbie dungeon. That choice should be there, even if it should NOT be put in evidence as the prefered path.

I bet we'll see a mod

^ This. Although i did feel pretty involved at the get go of Skyrim, it paled in comparison to Fallout 3. I have been overall more impressed with the landscaping of Skyrim than the previous TES games though. But looking out over the wastland of what was once US and seeing that... just gives me goosebumps still today!

very true- the option should have been there to go it your own way without any knowledge whatsoever.

I think the lack of a real "good luck!" moment is largely due to two reasons.

Skyrim was obviously more marketed and an attempt to appeal to a larger audience from the very beginning and immediately saying "You're good to do whatever" at the beginning would be of been fairly intimidating.

And the main story in this one was also more of the focus point as far as the marketing of the game (whereas Morrowind and Oblivion were still, even with a main story, do whatever you "damn well please" games as the selling point.) We heard about doing more things within the game, but it was largely "THERE'S DRAGONS PEOPLE!" And they're not even available until a certain point in the main case, so it needed a larger push in that direction (which in my case since I avoid the main quest until last meant me doing whatever I wanted for 20 or so hours before realizing I had to do the main quest to start their spawning.)

I currently can't imagine why we'll lack an "off the boat" moment in the next game however (or thinking of how Shivering Isles had one as well, in future expansions/DLC.)

I kind of get that moment when I step out of the first cave and see the little river, the trees, hear the music, and so forth.

I do agree that Skyrim feels smaller, which is a bit disappointing, but the biggest beef for me is all the snow and tundra. I love the mountains and everything looks spectacular and really feels spot on for that sort of environment, but I find my self continuously looking for wooded corners of the province, where there is more green. They simply feel more alive and exciting than the rest does, which, unfortunately, is 90% of the game.

The game would probably be infinitely better to me if the following things were true:

• There was a main city, like the Imperial City. This is one of those little things that matters a lot, because it makes you feel there is a true seat of authority somewhere in the world (like the tower in IC), one which you aren't part of or can't even reach.
  
• More vegetation, animals, summer-skies, etc. Cyrodiil is more of a summer region, which encouraged some 'magical' environments. Skyrim is just... Scandinavia in the winter. Beautiful, but dull in the long run.
  
• More things to do apart from quests and crafting. I know TES is all about wandering the hills and taking in the fresh air, but because Skyrim's environment swiftly bores me (being a Swede and all), that's not enough any more.

Fallout 3 - although i love the TES series far more than Fallout, i don't think any game has came close to the feeling i first got when i left the vault for the first time.

Morrowind - i absolutely hate having to run through tutorial dungeons, getting off the boat and creating my character then being set free to do what ever i wanted in this vast alien world was an amazing feeling. I still get a little tingle every time i hear the sound of the silt strider.

Oblivion - Although we were forced through a dungeon at the start, when leaving the sewers and seeing the ruin across the water in the lush green world for the first time, i was speechless. Just beautiful.

Skyrim - the cart ride into town built up great suspense for me and i was pleasantly surprised to see a beheading within the first 5 minutes of playing... I wouldn't say i like it the least, but i wouldn't say i like it any more than Oblivion's start.

For me it seems not to be the case so much. I did not realise it until reading OP. In fact, I started Morrowind this weekend again and now that I think of it you have a point there. Getting of the boat with some papers and a lot of wishes, just to find oneself in this world without someone pointing the way is...odd, after having played Skyrim again. It is a totally different feeling you get in the game when you are (not) introduced that way. I have to say, since I installed my Morrowind again, I have a hard time coming back to Skyrim (they are both great games though).

Best "off the boat" moment in a TES game for me was when I first tested DaggerXL on my computer and exited Privateer's Hold.

What? I don't agree with you because I don't understand. Skyrim lacks " Off the boat"? Um.... I had the moments where I took a moment to look around me and it just.... feels AMAZING. When I finish the first part of skyrim. I can see rivers, waterfall, leaves falling down from the trees, The beautiful trees, The grass. It feels amazing. Soo... I don't understand what you're trying to say. That it is lacking the beauty? comparing the other games??..... Wrong. When you're in a dungeon/Cave. It feels like one. Its actually scary,

It doesn't lack beauty, it lacks an introduction to the beauty.

The previous games confined the player initially inside, and with limited (if any) view of the outside world. They immediately began hand-holding for the first few minutes before throwing the player out into the world (usually with a view that stretched on, leaving very few objects blocking your view) and then said "You're on your own." Immediately creating that sense that you're an ant in the world.

Skyrim starts you off outside immediately, and while the intro's story elements were much swifter than Oblivion's and an overall improvement, it did lack the moment that made you feel immediately lost in the world.

That brings back some serious nostalgia. I'll never forget that silt strider.

I don't see why it matters... At all.
Cause I'm gonna be looking at the first part of the game for 5 seconds and then just move on for quests and dungeon crawling.
Skyrim lacks it? Well... Good. Or bad. I just don't really see why it matters, at all.

it doesn't lack a introduction to beauty. When you get out of the dungeon. You are introduced to beauty there. Its beautiful.

Maybe you haven't played teh previous ES games (not having a dig at you) that's why you don't understand?


It matters because it leads on to a very shallow game from that point on.


What we got wasn't as 'good' as the previous titles imo.