Slick scoring and 3D modeled NPCs OR deep dialogue trees?

Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:11 am

I figure that if people are http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1352250-slick-voice-acting-or-deep-dialogue-trees/, well, why stop there with such an awesome idea?

What about the score? I mean, writing a score and getting it recorded by an orchestra and a vocal choir is no inexpensive proposition. The composer commands a good fee, then there's a conductor and an entire orchestra to pay to record the piece - lots of pieces, actually, since there's more than just the opening score. There's background music playing through the entire game, and there's incidental music when something particularly dramatic happens - leveling up, seeing some especially scenic view in a dungeon, and of course the combat music. Then on top of that, Skyrim has a number of pieces that include vocal parts, so you've got to hire a choir on top of the orchestra.

Then you also have to pay for studio time - and a professional recording studio is not cheap at all - along with the rather expensive talents of professional engineers and a music producer, all of whom are well-paid professionals working in a very lucrative industry.

Long story short, this is one hell of a lot of money dedicated to having the game scored. It's obviously just yet another step in Bethesda's long decline since they were doing things right, back in the days of Morrowind (although even Morrowind had resources leeched by a professional score) and they're just abandoning the hardcoe gamers, the RPers, their real base, to appeal to the Casuals and their ridiculous Modern Warfare and Call of Duty and Angry Birds. Think about how much money they could have saved by not having spent all that money on this flash-in-the-pan, all-glitz-and-no-substance music score, and instead spending it to hire a metric ton of writers, who could really flesh out their characters? I mean, really flesh them out. Don't you just kinda find it annoying that you can't follow Nazeem and find out why he doesn't seem to think his [censored] stinks? Well, if there were enough writers hired, there could have been a writer whose only task was to develop a massive, branching dialogue tree that would allow you to find out why Nazeem was such a [censored] arrogant [censored] and why he wanders around town when he's got a farm to run? Maybe you could invite him to the inn for a meal and, y'know, just sit down to talk to him and really get to know Nazeem as Nazeem, an individual, and not just "that stuck-up Redguard who wanders around the market in Whiterun and whose wife thinks he's worthless."

I mean, do we really need a live score to the game? Back in the day we had MIDI scores playing in the background? Was that so bad? Did we have to abandon MIDI scores, which were dirt cheap, and replace them with expensive scores played by live musicians, when we could have had the money allocated to some real, deep conversational trees, so that we could really get to know these simulated characters better?



And then there's 3D modeling. Yes, yes, it's pretty and all, but is it really all that necessary from a role-playing perspective? I mean, back in the day we had Doom, with its sprite-based enemies, and that worked well enough. Daggerfall used sprites for NPCs and monsters as well, and durn it that worked well enough for role-playing purposes. Where's peoples' senses of imagination? And again - think of all the money Bethesda had to sink into a top-of-the-line game engine capable of rendering all these high-polygon 3D models with textures, and their fancy HDR lighting effects and water particle spray effects for the waterfalls.

Think of how many writers Bethesda could have hired if they had saved the money on the score AND on all the fancy graphical bells and whistles that serve nothing but to lure the stupid Casual Gamers away from their Wii and their iPhones and their Farmville and their Words With Friends and their Mario Kart; they're just messing things up and distracting Bethesda from developing games for the REAL gamers, the Hard-core Gamers, the True Believers.

Again, think of how many writers Bethesda could have hired with all that money; hell, I bet you could sit and talk to Nazeem or Belethor for hours. Maybe one day, Nazeem. Maybe one day.
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SexyPimpAss
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:20 pm

No voice acting = me not playing.
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Hope Greenhaw
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:09 am

No voice acting = me not playing.

Yeah, same with me. I can't even imagine sitting and clicking through a ton of boxes of text-speeches.
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Cheryl Rice
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:00 pm

Seems like the main theme required a big studio set up. Lots of the other pieces could've been done by one person (especially someone like Jeremy Soule, who probably has a badass home studio).
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Rhysa Hughes
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:41 am

Voice acting is a must have feature in TES series of games people!
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Melanie
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:03 am

Nope, 3D modeling isn't needed.

And nope, a live orchestra isn't needed either.

Next?
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Lalla Vu
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:43 am

Pretty graphics do not make a game great, neither is voiced dialogue. Sure people are drawn in by the awe of hearing peoples voices and seeing pretty images onscreen that does not make a game great that is just fluff.
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Chris Guerin
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:47 am

:wallbash:

People are [censored] insane.
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Josee Leach
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:12 am

Pretty graphics do not make a game great, neither is voiced dialogue. Sure people are drawn in by the awe of hearing peoples voices and seeing pretty images onscreen that does not make a game great that is just fluff.

If that were the case, pre 1995 rpgs would still be fun to play. There's a reason why people, even those who thoroughly played those games, don't play them anymore.
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Rik Douglas
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:02 pm

If that were the case, pre 1995 rpgs would still be fun to play. There's a reason why people, even those who thoroughly played those games, don't play them anymore.
You assume I am one of those people, I still play them and I play them often.

People are amazed by the next pretty thing so they flock to it, I do too to a certain degree, but RPGs hold their age well and I will continue to play them.
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Daramis McGee
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:07 pm

Pretty graphics do not make a game great, neither is voiced dialogue. Sure people are drawn in by the awe of hearing peoples voices and seeing pretty images onscreen that does not make a game great that is just fluff.

Poor graphics and written text don't make a game great, either.
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Nany Smith
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:42 pm

Poor graphics and written text don't make a game great, either.
Agreed
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xemmybx
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:08 pm

nope, they don't need to spend huge amounts of money on the music nor the voice acting.

in fact, it's wasteful spending that could be done much cheaper without any real noticeable difference.

i want a deep, complex and meaningful game with well-implemented mechanics.

the fluff needs to go.
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Nathan Maughan
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:11 am

nope, they don't need to spend huge amounts of money on the music nor the voice acting.

in fact, it's wasteful spending that could be done much cheaper without any real noticeable difference.

i want a deep, complex and meaningful game with well-implemented mechanics.

the fluff needs to go.

I'm quite sure that somebody, somewhere has written an incredibly detailed text adventure that will suit your needs.
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Makenna Nomad
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:08 am

If that were the case, pre 1995 rpgs would still be fun to play. There's a reason why people, even those who thoroughly played those games, don't play them anymore.

Is that why they keep making 2D games?
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Louise Andrew
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:20 am

nope, they don't need to spend huge amounts of money on the music nor the voice acting.

in fact, it's wasteful spending that could be done much cheaper without any real noticeable difference.

i want a deep, complex and meaningful game with well-implemented mechanics.

the fluff needs to go.
Somebody gets it, fluff is just that fluff.

The pretty artsy graphics are meant to draw people in, the voice acting is also just another way to draw people in with that ooooo these people can talk.

The money would be better spent on making the world a more interesting place and beefing up gameplay mechanics.
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no_excuse
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:03 am

Is that why they keep making 2D games?
I love the older style RPGs on the Playstation and ther PSP and DS.
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Steve Smith
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:22 pm

gram-

your statement is way off base and is a very poor attempt at grasping my very simple message.

i didn't say get rid of music or voice acting.
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Andrea P
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:31 am

Some folks seem to be stuck to the false choice between quality of presentation or quality of content like a barnacle sticks to the hull of a ship. You can have both, it's not an either/or thing.
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teeny
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:35 am

I love the older style RPGs on the Playstation and ther PSP and DS.

I mean... we might as well throw Okami in the trash bin since the 3D models aren't realistic quality.

Some folks seem to be stuck to the false choice between quality of presentation or quality of content like a barnacle sticks to the hull of a ship. You can have both, it's not an either/or thing.

This.

You don't need amazing "insert X" to make a great game.

What makes a great game is the combination of everything on their own assorted levels.
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lauren cleaves
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:58 pm

Some folks seem to be stuck to the false choice between quality of presentation or quality of content like a barnacle sticks to the hull of a ship. You can have both, it's not an either/or thing.
We should have both quality of presentation and content, however I do think the content and mechanics are far more important.
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ashleigh bryden
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:57 pm

I mean... we might as well throw Okami in the trash bin since the 3D models aren't realistic quality.
Or Resident Evil 5 or even Parasite Eve.
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Misty lt
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:18 am

i want a deep, complex and meaningful game with well-implemented mechanics.

So why not hook up with like-minded folks on this forum and start your own game development company? You could build a RPGs exactly the way you think they should be and gain fame and fortune from the massive sales that would doubtless follow.

Then you could come back here and flaunt your success in Bethesda's face.
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Beth Belcher
 
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Post » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:21 pm

Some folks seem to be stuck to the false choice between quality of presentation or quality of content like a barnacle sticks to the hull of a ship. You can have both, it's not an either/or thing.

absolutely, both.

but, with skyrim you have good graphics with great music and very poor depth, sophistication and meaning with subpar/absent gameplay mechanics.
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Beat freak
 
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Post » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:29 am

These discussions are irrelevant anyways. They have money to spend. Bethesda, like Blizzard, wears money hats. And wipes their butts with those very hats after a wholesome meal of imported sushi just flown in from Kyoto.
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Catharine Krupinski
 
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