Ulfric the "Ufull"? : V

» Wed May 30, 2012 11:42 pm

I am a fairly Newbie in Skyrim (after years and many Oblivion characters). Am considering joining the Stormtroopers, just to go against the grain. Got to Windhelm and everyone says
Ulfric is such a racist. Later met him, and of course, he was very nice.
I like the way the authors have added this topic. Is Ulfric as big a jerk as he sounds?

» Thu May 31, 2012 4:53 am

It goes deeper than that. He is racist, but that's because he wants Skyrim to be free from Imperial tyranny, for his own Nord people. He's not as big of a jerk as you'd think (I haven't actually heard him actually knocking elves), and he's just trying to make things better overall, though it's a bit shortsighted of him to do that.

» Wed May 30, 2012 8:12 pm

stormtroopers O_o.... well the moon does seem a little big

anyway:in the main quest when him and general tullius meet to talk he does seem like a "jerk"
i joined imperials because he seems racist against anyone who isent nord(im woodelf)

» Wed May 30, 2012 6:27 pm

It goes deeper than that. He is racist, but that's because he wants Skyrim to be free from Imperial tyranny, for his own Nord people. He's not as big of a jerk as you'd think (I haven't actually heard him actually knocking elves), and he's just trying to make things better overall, though it's a bit shortsighted of him to do that.

Thanks. When I think about it--I also didn't hear him saying anything bad about Dark Elves. "Black Gopher" A kewl handle.!

» Wed May 30, 2012 8:59 pm

Well I personally think he is a racist on some levels. I can see him disliking the Kajeet (sp) because of there so call alliance to the Thalmor. IF Ulfiric hated the Elves so much he would not even let them live in his city.

But I don't think he hates Redguards since they removed themselves from the Empire and refused to sign the White Gold Concordia. Despite him being a racist on some levels his valid points over shadow that. Look at his perspective, if the whole country of Elyswer thought of the Thalmor as their saviors, would you trust any of them being a jarl?

Granted I don't have an issue with any race, unless they cause me trouble, but if I was a Jarl, I'd tread carefully on who I choose to be friends with.

» Thu May 31, 2012 12:33 am

How is this even a debate, now? Hasn't it been fairly well established that he's a racist bigot?

Have you even explored Windhelm, talked to it's inhabitants? Some of the Nords that live there think he's going too far.

Talk to Brunwulf, he'll flat out tell you that Ulfric only protects Nords. He'll give you an example of Ulfric only rallying troops to defend Nord villages, no matter if there's a village of Dunmer, or Bretons that have been there longer.

He's also a cunning backstabber. Just listen to his plan to become High King after you complete the Civil War in favor of the Stormcloaks.

However, having watched my fiancee play through the Stormcloak quest line, and actually meeting Ulfric in Sovngarde - it seems that he wasn't always such a bastard.

Galmar is the true influence behind the racist bigotry. Ulfric himself tells you in Sovngarde that he regrets his actions.

In summation.. Don't go Stormcloak, folks. =P

» Thu May 31, 2012 4:31 am

How is this even a debate, now? Hasn't it been fairly well established that he's a racist bigot?

Because he's not.

Or rather, he's no worse then others have been portrayed within the Elder Scrolls series. I hate to sound like a broken record but, The Dunmer kept the Beast Races enslaved.

Also, the Dunmer flat out admit to only settling in Windhelm because it was the first city out of Morrowind, plus Windhelm's a old city built into the mountains and the decree to allow refugees came from the High King in Solitude, who I'd point out doesn't have to figure out where to house these refugees.

I don't know, maybe it's me but I really am getting irked at all these "racist" comments. It just smacks of hyper sensitivity to me. "Racism" to me involves Lynch Mobs and the setting fire to effigies or the 1940s Warner Brothers Looney Toon Cartoons.

Is Ulfric a great guy? No. No he's not. But I can't disagree with the man or his message. Enough Nord blood has been shed for the Milk Drinkers in Cyrodill.

» Thu May 31, 2012 1:01 am

Racism isn't a decent reason to hate him.

Being an active and working Thalmor Agent and a massive throbbing hypocrite is.

» Wed May 30, 2012 11:18 pm

Because he's not.
*Snippy-snip*

You make valid points. I could present counter-arguments, but they would reflect and mention real-world politics about how the Dunmer in Windhelm represent the issue of Immigration. So I will hold off.

I shall simply say this.

Good luck fighting off the Thalmor when they come for you without the help of the Empire, silly Nords. :dance:

..And they will come for you. With one of the main arms of the Legion destroyed and routed, there will be little to nothing stopping the armies of the Dominion from destroying humanity for good. :tes:

» Wed May 30, 2012 1:48 pm

Ulfric is not a racist, only an idiot would say that. None of his dialogue indicates his views about other races. He is on the other hand a loser and a blowhard. I hated his guts the first time I met him in game. I still joined the Stormcloaks because the empire is a laughable joke. It's rotted from the inside and needs to be destroyed and rebuilt stronger. And look at the legion uniforms... Everyone wears miniskirts. It's cold in Skyrim, for Talos' sake!

» Wed May 30, 2012 5:24 pm

seems more like a pretty extreme nationalist to me
his dislike for any other races is more politically motivated than anything
not like he wants to exterminate every other race besides his own

» Thu May 31, 2012 1:16 am

I was all for joining the stormcloaks and I did my first play though. After getting though the first few quests I realy started to hate Ulfric. You find out if you do enough research that

Spoiler

Ulfric is obviously only trying to advance himself as high king. Sure he killed the old high king in combat as is the way of the nords but he used a weapon (the voice) that was not available to the high king and so it was not a fair contest as the nords say it should be.

You will also discover that while he used the ban of talos worship to drive his cause he outlawed the worship of "the old gods" or deadra worship. The talos outlaw was put in place by the thalmor (the only ones worse than Ulfric) and the ban was required for the treaty that the empire had to sign to end the war. The thing is that this was never enforced untill Ulfric made a stink about it. People still worshiped freely untill Ulfric used it to drive his agenda and forced the empire to crack down on it to keep the treaty. So had it not been for Ulfric talos worship would be outlawed but not enforced and everybody would be happy. He just used it to drive his agenda

He is also a bigot to any race that is not Nordic.

That's why I wouldent help him again.

» Wed May 30, 2012 8:47 pm

Racism isn't a decent reason to hate him.

Being an active and working Thalmor Agent and a massive throbbing hypocrite is.

He's a former Thalmor Agent. Read the dossier. He's considered a "Inactive Asset" and any attempt to contact him would end with the Thalmor representative's head on a pike.

Good luck fighting off the Thalmor when they come for you without the help of the Empire, silly Nords. :dance:

We beat the Falmer when Skyrim was the Falmer's home territory. If any sissies from Summerset want to try their hand at storming Solitude, they are welcome to try and die.

» Wed May 30, 2012 9:36 pm

I started this thread and am enjoying reading the replies and threads. I am only Level 9, so much of your experiences are still ahead of me.
I guess a good thing to do along the several years "way" of playing this game would be to play different characters and play both sides. Right now, I am happy to just be an adventurer.
But, what would happen if a Dark Elf went to Ulfric and wanted to join? :wink_smile:

» Wed May 30, 2012 2:50 pm

The game AI doesn't care what race you choose to play; any race can join the Stormcloaks or the Imperials.

» Thu May 31, 2012 3:03 am

Which really destroys the argument that Ulfric is a racist. He's more then willing to take on other races in his service. Also note the Stormcloaks advertise "All True Sons and Daughters of Skyrim", not "All True Nords of Skyrim".

Heck, part of the problem the Dunmer have in Windhelm is they refuse to take sides in the Civil War, despite voluntarily settling there. They also don't care about serial murders as long as a Dark Elf isn't murdered...

» Wed May 30, 2012 9:55 pm

I'm curious if there is ever any obvious racism from Ulfric or any other high ranking stormcloaks. Haven't really done the civil war quest yet, which is why I'm asking. The state of Windhelm doesn't convince me entirely, the refugees aren't rolling in luxury and friendly faces, but the nords are running saturday night pogroms either. Is it possible that part of this "racism" is incorrectly coming from the Stormcloaks desiring Skyrim to be ruled independently? Because there's a difference between saying you want Skyrim to be ruled by the nords (not from the emperor's throne) and saying "skyrim for the nords".

» Wed May 30, 2012 8:42 pm

Everything I've found in regards to the charges or racism are second hand accounts from dubious sources ("The Bear of Markarth" being written by a Imperial Scribe who also wrote a sympathetic book about the Forsworn standing out in my head).

» Wed May 30, 2012 6:59 pm

According to "Bear of Markarth" Ulfric actually executed everyone (including nords) who had not fought with him. That sort of ruins the racism charge in that incident, does still qualify him for ass of the year if it was true though.

» Thu May 31, 2012 3:51 am

I wouldn't believe anything I read about either side - if written by a member of the OPPOSITE side....

» Wed May 30, 2012 7:56 pm

Ulfric is making the necessary sacrifices in order to protect his people from the ultimate racists, the Thalmor.

» Wed May 30, 2012 11:05 pm

Ulfric is making stupid sacrifices which will doom his people to the ultimate racists, the Thalmor.

fix'd

» Wed May 30, 2012 7:33 pm

fix'd

Rationalization or get out.

» Wed May 30, 2012 3:59 pm

If you try to join up as any other race than nord, Ulfric's quite alright with it. Galmar will ask you why you want to join.

If you respond with "Skyrim is home to more than just nords", he'll agree with you.

The thalmor's strength is info gathering and subterfuge, currently the empire is allowing spies to walk openly throughout their lands. Whenever the war starts again, the thalmor will know exactly what to expect because of the treaty. Forces, troop locations, weaknesses. Everything. Mede really screwed up with the concordat.

» Wed May 30, 2012 9:04 pm

If you try to join up as any other race than nord, Ulfric's quite alright with it. Galmar will ask you why you want to join.

If you respond with "Skyrim is home to more than just nords", he'll agree with you.

The thalmor's strength is info gathering and subterfuge, currently the empire is allowing spies to walk openly throughout their lands. Whenever the war starts again, the thalmor will know exactly what to expect because of the treaty. Forces, troop locations, weaknesses. Everything. Mede really screwed up with the concordat.

My point exactly.