No sorry.We are probably not gonna go Orwellian.not now,not ever.That cyberpunk fantasy is going to be unfulfilled.

Pfft. Orwell was overrated. http://forwearemany.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/huxley-vs-orwell.jpg

yup.


Has anyone figured the following:

The kids are selling the lemonade, and the money goes to a charity -I believe I heard one of the mothers say to the officer in the vid that it was for cancer treatment for kids, because lets pour on the guilt here, right?

Riiiight.

So, we give the lemonade away for free -circumventing the need for a permit

..and ask for a "voluntary" donation towards helping the poor cancer kids.. pour on more guilt.. and rake in more money..

then tell the officer to happily go [censored] himself.

You shouldn't have to wrangle with law and ordinance to do something so simple and harmless.

The problem is we can't stand for it anymore. Kids selling lemonade? Preposterous. What's next? Yardsales without a permit? Can't drive neighbor kids to a soccer game without a transporter class and license? Are you going to steal jobs from hard working contractors by cutting your own lawn with equipment for which you have not been trained or have a license to operate?

Don't go outside kids, and don't talk to anybody, and most importantly don't do anything. Here watch some television and play some video games, but please don't go outside.

Outside isn't what the real world should be.

But it isn't neccesarily harmless. Modern Neglegence law in the UK stems from a case where a contaminated (with a slug or snail) bottle of drink caused a person to become sick - so these things can and do happen. (Donahuge v Stevenson if anyone's interested)

It isn't about taking someone's job, or anything like that, its simply a matter of public health and safety.

A higher level of oversight exists over selling food and drink in order to protect everyone - including buyer and seller.

That's exactly what I'm getting at. A matter of public health and safety is the very reason we're going where we are. This is crossing the point where public health becomes sterilization.

Kids used to climb trees and break arms and nobody blamed the tree or the yard it was planted in. Today I'd wager they'd level a whole forest if they thought it was an endangerment to child limbs everywhere.

I'm actually waiting for my son to break his first arm falling out of a tree.. I'll be so proud :celebration:

also, just hang up a sign that says



Warning, this was made by kids who don't know better.
Drink at your own damn risk!


..and we have collectively covered our asses from the whiners in the world.


Done.

It's frickin lemonade. What is it going to do, kill me? It's my choice if I want to buy something that could be contaminated. Happens every time I buy a carton of eggs or vegetables or meat; I bet they had permits, but they still sell contaminated products anyway.

In essence, the government is preventing people from setting up a business. Who benefits from this? Other businesses that want to reduce competition, of course. Like the demand by hairdressers to make it illegal to cut hair unless you have a license. Soon it'll be something like you can't babysit without a license, or mow the lawn without a license. The only people who benefit are the big businesses with the money to pay the permit fees.

And just how many people died from drinking some kid's lemonade? And where is the government spending resources to protect citizens? I think there are more dangerous things out there, like real criminals that kill and [censored] people, that the fuzz should be concentrating on.

Don't forget that they'd try to sue the forest first.

It could, if it had the wrong contaminant.

From the CDC

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/eid/vol5no5/mead.htm

If you buy a product that makes you sick, the producer can be investigated to ensure that their practices are as hygenic as possible.

We, as consumers, have a right to know that the products that we buy are as safe as possible.

Oh Nonsense. There's a world of difference between ensuring hygenic food preparation conditions and mowing a lawn. The people that benefit from this regulation are the regular joe who doesn't have to worry about crap in their food. Thousands of small catering companies exist, some in certified home kitchens, others using commercial kitchens, and their customers are safe in the knowledge that the people who are prepairing their food are doing so following best hygenic practices.


Hang on - on one hand you're calling for the US to protect its citizens, and here you are critising it for doing just that! Make up your mind!

As my previous quote indicated, Food related illness is estimated to kill 5,000 people a year in the US!

Cops must be either bored or lazy....shouldn't they be dealing with drug traffic and apprehending convicts? :confused:

I may start a lemonade stand on 6th street just because of this, right in between the [censored] house and the crack den. :disguise:

What what percentage of that is caused by lemonade?

There's a point at which trying to create a safe environment goes too far, cracking down on lemonade stands is a sign that we as a society care too much about our health. Which isn't to say that we should not care about our health, just that stuff happens if you, you know, live a little.

Its Irrelevant what percentage is caused by Lemonade as you can't just offer a law that covers all but one product. Either Hygene rules and laws apply to all products, or they're worthless.

As for "Stuff happens", 5,000 potentially preventable deaths a year?

100,000 die each year from infections acquired while in a hospital. Your point?

as for protecting citizens - yeah, from things that matter. I don't think the foodborne illnesses are from lemonade stands. More like mad cow, e coli, and other heavy-hitters - you know, people not cooking their meat or washing their veggies, or meat cross-contamination. Not because kids are pooping in cups and then serving lemonade in them (and I doubt they are doing that!).

There's always going to be food related illnesses - the government and its regulations can never prevent that.

The issue here is that they are calling a kid's lemonade stand a "business" - the legal term, with all the legalese associated with it. It's some kids selling lemonade. Drink at your own risk. It isn't a business with special tax forms and payroll and shareholders.

A permit doesn't mean it's going to be any safer - what about all those restaurants in Germany where people got e. coli from those beansprout things? Or the egg recall in the US last year, or the peanut butter recall a few years before that? Or the drug recalls because the active ingredients and contaminants weren't at the right levels.

Regulations don't magically fix things or protect people. Yes, safety standards are good. I won't deny that. But applying it to an amateur lemonade stand that is up for a day or two? That's ridiculous. You're trading away your freedom for the illusion of security. Put things in perspective.

Hospitals have to follow certain proceedures, be registered, and such events are investigated. I presume you also have a source for your claim?

No, Permits do mean that it is safer - Just because an event happens does not mean that an inspected locations are just as safe as uninspected. That these events are rare enough to be "news events" highlights exactly why the regulation works.

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Hospital_infections (you can go down and chase their sources if you want). Also heard it on Dr. G: Medical Examiner. And http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/r2k0306b.htm site. Just do a google search.

This particular incident was handled by an ordinary officer in a patrol car. Same kind of guy you see turning on his sirens in the middle of the freeway because the guy in front of him is going 10 miles over the speed limit. This incident is not a distraction from the department's other duties.

Predator, we all know people, especially those in positions of authority, are often stupid. You don't need to keep posting news articles reinforcing that fact.

It's funny because American society seems to care so much about health (millions of gyms per square metre etc) yet a strong majority is overweight. lol

Cracking down on lemonade stands. :rofl:

They should crack down on McDonald's and other fast food outlets if they really cared about health. They don't.

If you have evidence your local McDonalds is operating illegaly and without business permits, Please report it to your local authority.

I hardly think that a health inspector should be required to examine lemonade stands.

Quite a few people die each year you know. Maybe I should rephrase my point. [censored] happens, and if we go too far to prevent injuries and death, then there won't be a point to living at all.

And compared to the overall number of deaths, 5,000 is a VERY small number.

@TESFanner: Ironically, most people I see out and about aren't morbidly obese. The way BMI is calculated is unrealistic, as I have a friend who is quite fit, yet she is still "overweight" according to her BMI.

That's not what I meant (and you know it). Most of McDonald's food is very calorie dense (one of their burgers goes up to 1000 calories) and they're very high in sodium. It's not healthy. It's certainly very difficult to fit McDonald's food into anyone's daily macronutrients because it is too high in carbs, sodium etc.

Pretty soon it will be illegal to grow you own food, it's already illegal to grow produce and sell it without a permit.
It is also illegal for me to keep chickens in my yard as pets, or eat the eggs they would produce. They are considered livestock.
Fishing and hunting liscences here are also rigour0sly enforced, and there are liscening requirements and fees for each type of animal hunted or fished.


It's all about industries squeezing out the competition. Because if it were about health, we wouldn't have half the crap that goes on in chicken farms and slaugher houses going on. Nor would we have the outbreaks of food borne illness that we do.

And Authorities do go after McDonalds. Banning Trans-Fats, banning junk food advertising during childrens programming, etc.

Mc Donald's also gets huge subsides from the government which enables it to offer it's high fat, high carb, high sodium products as cheaply as they do.
Many areas in which Mc Donald's operates are also located in neighborhoods considered http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert
People with very little money to spend on groceries are more likely to purchase calorie dense foods than healthy ones. The problem is that the products they can afford do not have proper nutrional balance, nor do they satiate or fill the purchaser up.
Studes have shown that the poor are more inclined to eat nutrionally poor and calorie dense foods and very little in the way of fruits and vegetables because they cannot obtain nor afford it. Thusly, they are at a higher risk for diabetes, heart disease, and hypertenison.

The US government doesn't give a crap about healthy foods for kids. Go read the labels on hotdogs, mac and cheese, kid's frozen dinners, cereals, lunch snacks.
High fats, high sugars, cheaper than fruits and veggies.


The kids at the lemonade stand should just fill up a cooler with ice and cans of cheap chek soda. They can then skirt the whole contamination issue from prepared lemonade. While drinking a nice tall glass of their own homemade lemonade.