So, I have slght OCD tendancies, and I need an answer to this, or at least a guess that seems right.

I've been thinking about how old Serana, and Harkon, are. However as i've only watched a lets play of the Dawnguard side I haven't got to converse with Harkon a great deal and wll be focusing on Serana.

Serana when she wakes seems not to knwo the Empire. Furthermore, when you state the Cyrodillic Empire, she seems stunned that Cyrodiil is the seat an an Empire. This... is where it gets tough. With a couple of gaps there has been an Empire since the Merethic Era. A Cyrodillic Empire at that. She doesn't make it sound like she is suprised there is one now, she is suprised there is one at all.

Am I just misunderstanding her? Perhaps i'm wrong, and the Empire was in one of ts 'collapsed' states she she was simply suprised it was back. I find this very unlikely though. I still feel she was suprised there was an Empire in Cyrodiil at all.

That would put her at older or as old as figures like Vivec, Almalexia, Sotha Sil, Dagoth Ur and even Divayth Fyr.


A little mini-timeline I made to try and find somewhere she could have 'lived'.



So. If she is became what she is and years later she was sealed away around the time of TESO, she would be more than 998 years old. Unlkely because of her suprise. If she was born in the unknown period between the First and Second Era, then She would be over 1500 years old. However, I still thin she was born in the Merethic Era, which puts her at over 4000 years old.

I just find it interesting how Serana carries herself. She has none of the gravity of the Tribunal, and noen of the world weary wisdom of Divayth Fyr. Then again, I suppose Harkon does seem every inch the ancient Vampire, and she has been locked away potentially most of that 'whichever' age. I'm still going with 4000. When we release her our hand is spiked and bleeds; I assume the blood funnelled down to her, and woke her from a sleep. Or Torpor as other vampire sources would put it. So while ancient, mentally she is just 'young' (we ahve no idea the space between her becoming a Vampire and her sealing) and out of touch.

So. Thoughts? It seems a pretty interesting thing to discuss, though perhaps better suited to copy-pasta in the Lore forum when Danwguard is more widely released.

More things that I might have missed on the Lets Play would would be interested. Things said by the family and other Vampires. Things we can sue as time markers.

I think she said she's from the 2nd era but don't quote me on that.

Your thinking too much into it. Theres no good beth writers left. Her backstory doesnt have any meaning. Selena = serena underworld rip off. VL = markus from underworld.

Both faction storylines end the same way. Your forced to kill harkon. No choice at all. Same with the snow elf brothers. Forced to kill the evil one.

I disagree. I still enjoy what Bethesda produce, and I find it a pity that you feel that way.

Nor does your post really contribute anything. Perhaps you have something more constructive to add? That would be appreciated.

I'm fairly certain that Serana says she became a vampire in the late 1st era/early 2nd era.
And she's been locked up since before there was a Cyrodillic Empire. So, she's pre-Talos. Quite old, I can't be bothered to look up exactly how old that means.

You don't get to know specifically how old she is..only get to know that she is older than 4000.

Which is older than what Vincente Valtieri was and he if I recall was one of the oldest Cyrodil vampires which would mean she is older than most if not all of the Cyrodil vampires...

Leads me more towards the Volkihar being the original Vampire clan..since they were set in Skyrim and usually the first means the strongest..and the Volkihar are the strongest/dominant clan in the Skyrim, plausible the first Vampires named their clan Volkihar.

Further proof is..no other clan has Pureblooded Vampires that we know of...only other Lore one is the first ever vampire.

Harkon being her father must mean he is even older than that..

"And she's been locked up since before there was a Cyrodillic Empire. So, she's pre-Talos. Quite old, I can't be bothered to look up exactly how old that means."

If I remember correctly, the Empire has always been in Cyrodiil, from the days of Alessia. Which is where the 4000 years comes in. Talos is relatively recent, from a historical perspective. Still, it doesn't sit rightwith me for some reason, as (that I saw) she makes no mentioned that she ever saw a Dwemer in person, showed no suprise that the Snows Elves were all but gone, and so forth. However, I only saw a lets play, and the guy tended to run off and miss Serana's comments.

Lucky him, if you talk to her (give her items and such) every now and again if you are a human she borderline flirts with you and tempts you with Vampirism even in some of the quests as a Vampire Hunter she tries to turn you, shes nice about it though unlike her dad who demands you accept it or be banished! lol

I personally cured myself of Harkon's disgusting "gift" after the MQ only to let her give me her gift. =P

For f*** sake, it's SerAna. Why does everyone keep misspelling her name.

And I feel quite different about the writing. With Dawnguard Bethesda has proven that they actually can write a nice plot.

Anyway, OP, I agree with you on her age. Given the facts she has to be at least 4000 years old.

Only if you play a "Man" race, such as Nord, Imperial, Breton, and Redguard?

Then my Argonian has nothing to worry about. Don't need his Dunmer bride worrying about anything.

And, OP, I agree with you. 4000 years seem's reasonable given her lines. As why she doesn't mention the Tribunal? I'm stumped. Maybe she never knew of them?

I meant human as in a non-afflicted race, sorry.

Serana is a true servant of Molag Bal the lord of corruption...shes had 4000+ years of learning how to corrupt people with her wiles.

Not quite sure if shes secretly using you as a puppet in the story and just wants to turn you into a Vampire to make sure you stay loyal to her so she can become the leader of the Volkihar or if she genuinely cares and wants to turn you because she wants to spend eternity with you, I mean Harkon does say you're her pet.

Your marriage is in jeopardy.

Have you finished the dlc yet?

I watched a full lets play. T'was good enough, as it won't be any different with me at the controls. I only saw the Dawnguard-side main quest, and didn't get to see the sidequest. I would have been happy with just what I saw, and there is more. I'm very much looking forwards to playing it myself and playing the sidequest. Having Serana as a companion is going to be nice too.

However, the DLC as a whole has little to do withthe specific topic at hand. Even if you feel its bad, it doesn't change the topic or the answer. =)

Thanks for typing that all out. Gl with thread

Thanks. I'm still sorry you didn't enjoy the DLC. Its a shame.

Buy me some flowers and I"ll talk about it.

Doesn't mean other vampires cannot be pureblooded. It is just a rarity.

Thats why I love Serana! Master manipulator, corrupting idiots here and there.

those briasts will never corrupt me.
i wanted to sacrifice her to end the tyranny of the sun as soon as i seen her,and still do now.

That didn't end so well, did it?

no matter how hard i try harkon still betrays me

Yes, I do suspect that she is a manipulator. Thing is, its sadly always going to be just speculation, unless they expand her in another DLC (unlikely) or she gets into a book in the next TES (more likely) what we see is probobly what we get.

Still. Its fun speculation.

I was pretty disappointed that the quest lines are basically the same for both sides for the vast majority of it. Whether you choose Dawnguard or Volkihar you're still forced to side with Sarena.

No, no. There is a time before the Empire even existed. The Alyssian Empire isn't even the Empire that rules now, but Serana is from a time before there ever was an Empire of any type. She even says so in her dialogue: "Empire? What Empire? There's an Empire based out of Cyrodiil?" So she is clearly "alive" from sometime before there was ever an Empire, and was locked up before Alyssia began her conquests of Tamriel.

So Alyssia started her conquest of Tamriel in 1E 242.

From 1E year 0 to 4E 201 = 4451 years.

Alyssia didn't start her conquest of Tamriel to create the First Empire until 1E 242: 4451 - 242 = 4209

This puts Serana, Lord Harkon, and Serana's Mother (because her name escapes me at the moment...), at a minimum age of 4209+ years old. And that's only if they got "changed" in the same year as Alyssia starting her war effort. Most likely, they were changed well before that.

Since during the dialogue with Serana, you find out that they were created during Molag Bal's "Summoning Day" festivities where they summoned Molag Bal himself to Tamriel for a day. Since they had to do the Summoning, then this timeline says that it would have to have been during the Merethic Era and not as early as the Dawn Era (since during the Dawn Era the Aedra and Daedra could walk Nirn freely, the fact that the Cult had to summon Molag Bal means that the barrier had already been put up and the Daedra weren't free to wander).

Now we don't know when in the Merethic Era that the particular "Summoning Day" festival took place, but the Merethic Era is noted (currently) to be 2500 years of time.

So Serana and her family are anywhere between: 6709 - 4209 years old (Beginning of Merethic Era {ME 2500} - beginning of Alyssia's Conquest of Tamriel {1E 242} - Present day {4E 201}).

Mh, would be nice if Bethesed thought this. But I don't think it is so. They simple thought, she is an old vampire, so how do we out on a hint that sch is long locked - she don't no the Emopire. perfect.

I think that is how it goes. Betheseda don't care really about there lore since Oblivion, yes they put things up.

But usually they think this way. "Not do things to create a part of a fictive world, do things like putting in Dragons, because dragons are awesome".

i have nothing against the dragons, but that was their reason why they put them in, they would even had do it, if it would have absolutely disagrred with their previous stuff.