That may be the key Elyanou.

I've also found that if I disable a standard vanilla quest in my ESP and reload, it starts anyway. (I do this in my ScenicCarriage mod because I replace the standard carriage dialog with my own.)

With regards to my above post


This has no effect, the problem is still there.

I tried this same thing to get my scene to work last night. No dice.

I removed "Start Game Enabled" from my quest and added a trigger to start it when you enter a specific location. When I loaded a clean save everything worked as it had prior to 1.7.

However, when I created an alias for a vanilla character and added dialogue for her, none of that dialogue works. When I set her alias as a quest stage objective, then advance to the correct stage, she is not displayed as an objective.

EDIT: Another strange thing I've just noticed. The objectives initially work for my quest, but beyond a certain stage they don't appear in-world. However, they do appear on the Local and World Map.

Just as a further data point, I tested my scenes with a new character.

• Created using LAL
  
• Ran to mod location without COC
  
• Entered building
  
• Not a sausage

I checked the logs and found out that both of my quests were running, but nothing was happening.

Then I saved, quit and reloaded and suddenly my scenes are playing. So it looks like the same pathology as the dialogue bug.

Now it gets interesting. None of my animations were playing at this point. That includes four empty idle markers that I cloned and set to play a random cheer/applause animation, another one that plays indexMemories belly dance animation[1] and two more actors who were scripted to play some idles written specially for the mod.

So I saved that and reloaded again. Now the belly dancer is belly dancing, and one of the four watchers is doing his vanilla applause idle. The rest are just standing there. The other two are doing a stuttering start & stop thing; I want to try a FNIS re-install before I conclude anything from that.

Subsequent reloads had the dancer dancing and nothing else.

Oh, and everybody's hello and idle infos seem to have vanished. [edit] By which I mean still there by not playing...

So: Scenes seem to be affected by the dialogue problem. And so are idle markers, it seems. There also appears to be a non-deterministic component in when deciding what will run and what will not.

[edit]

Regarding "start game enabled", the main quest is triggered when the barmaid's OnLoad event fires, which isn't until you enter the building. Other scenes have their own quests that are triggered by the story manager in response to a keyword event from the main quest. So nothing's ever been started from the beginning for this one.



[1] Just to be clear: Permission to use the animation has been requested, but no response as yet. If I don't have that permission by the time I'm ready to distribute this, I'll simply make other arrangements.

Literally clutching at straws here because I'm out of ideas. My mod doesn't have Update.esm as a master. Could that be the problem?

(just can't think of anything else causing the problem, other than a bug introduced by 1.7)

I may throw into the pool that my mod does not use ESM as a master either, but I did try adding it as one before 1.7.

I think we can safely say this "dialogue" bug can now be classified as a much larger "Quest" Bug! Data points:

1. Affects scenes as well as dialog
2. Dialog not working for quests set to Start Game Enabled
3. Quests set to activate based on some other trigger seem to work correctly
4. Conditional variables are not setting correctly allowing dialog for both states of an either/or condition to display
5. Vanilla quests disabled in an ESP don't work thereby showing the vanilla dialoag when it shouldn't
6. Quest "run once" resets on reload

Did you check the "Allow Reserved" box? Aliases won't get filled, if they are already reserved by another quest, unless this is checked.

Good to know. I don't think this was the issue as she was not reserved by any quest from that save. That said, it cleared up when I did another load clean save - save new save - load new save.

I believe I'm experiencing the same issues after 1.7. I still need to do more tests but these are the facts I have now:

1. All my quests' dialogs stopped working suddenly.

2. All my quests' scenes stopped working suddenly.

3. SQV shows the quests as running, I don't see anything unusual in the output.

4. If I save the game in that location and load it right away, all the dialogs start to work as intended.

5. I've been using coc from the main menu all this time. Since there was advice against it in this thread, I tried a few earlier saves where I never used coc. I had mixed results with these, some characters got the dialogs working when I reached the location, others didn't. Maybe some had visited that location before while others didn't but I can't remember.

6. My mod is an esp.

Since Dawnguard has been confirmed to be shipped as an ESM file, one interesting question must surely be:

Assuming that Dawnguard plays nicely on 1.7.7, what is it that has been done differently in it in comparison to the mods, that do not work properly?

Won't be able to find out what Dawnguard does differently until the CK is updated since there's folks reporting the CK crashes trying to load it.

Indeed.

Someone was saying on the other thread to extract the strings into the strings folder and it stops the crash.

Yeah, I saw that. The crashing stops but there are still load errors.

Is that only when you load Dawnguard.esm, or no matter what if it's installed? I just bought it so hopefully since I'm not touching it with my mod I can work unhindered...

When something like this lands, I go away and come back once there is a decent fix in place ... So I have done no modding or testing since the patch.

However, reading through this topic and noting the release of Vampirion, is it possible that Beth changed the way "Game Start Enabled" works? (Maybe because of how some Dawnguard stuff runs?)

I'm guessing, but one of the key-themes seems to be quests/dialogue not running if - and only if - they are start game enabled?

(I'm not sure how we know that's the case ... without Dev comment ... but looks a bit like it might be?)

You'd be able to answer that before I would. I was just relaying information

Since the problem happens only with the "Start Game Enabled" flag, I've been working around it by setting it off in the Quest form, and calling the start() function on an actor's OnInit() event, on certain conditions (I'm trying just a check on the quest stage).

I'm sure there are more clever ways of doing this, but I've been able to resume development on the mod with no issues.

The mod I'm working on kicks off its main quest from the an actor's onLoad event. I still get the problem.

"Start Game Enabled" may be part of the problem, but it's not the sole cause.

Ah, indeed.


It appears that loading the CK with DG installed, but NOT loading it does not cause any problems. I can still just load Falskaar.esm and Skyrim.esm with no a single additional error.

Confirmed. Installing Dawnguard, but not loading the ESM in the Creation Kit causes no foreseeable issues

P.S. Finally we get Dawnguard!

When taking the initial cart ride to Helgen in a pure vanilla game with no mods, I seem to be getting numerous new papyrus log entries, which I have not seen before.

They are of the following type:

[08/04/2012 - 05:36:38PM] [defaultSetStageTRIGSpecificActor < (00100CD9)>] didn't trigger for base actor [ActorBase < (0001363E)>] <> [ActorBase < (000B9E1D)>]

It may be silly of me, but I can't help wondering, if they might be related to this issue with scenes and dialogues.

A quick update:

I installed the latest version of Fuz Ro D-Oh and the problem, if not fixed, is greatly reduced.

I know folks have reported the issue without ever using FRD-O, so I'm not going to claim a fix. But it certainly looks like it mitigates the problem considerably.

Kudos to Arthmoor who called it first.

Can you explain what this means? Fuz Ro D-Oh fixes the Dialog problem?