Dude... yes.

I'm psyched.

ADDED:

7. Names for your Mercs: There have been many requests for the ability to give names to the mercs. I had always intended on making it happen. A random brainstorm led to it's implementation a bit early. The code allows you to choose a name from a list (essentially). After a short time (3-4 work days) you will have the opportunity to ask the Merc "So, what's your name?". He/She will then say "My name is ...." you will be presented with two options "No, really, what's your name?", or "Oh, That suits you".

The merc will keep saying a random name until you pick the second option. Then, he/she will permanently assume that name.

Hmmm I honestly think the trading thing should be made optional at some point then because usually I trade up fitting them with better armor, not taking and selling theirs. On my current save game I spent about an hour or two grinding on wood cutting,harvesting and looting bandits to buy two high tier mercs and then I gave one of them the piece of Ebony armor you get from one of the main quests and mixed and matched a few steel plate pieces from a bandit chief. I don't mind them being nerfed a bit, but sitting and waiting for 7 in game just to be able to access the inventory for them is a bit of a let down.

Not every one plays the game completely vanilla or just using this mod, the fact that they are now being nerfed 'and' are unable to be given better equipment until waiting 7 in game days is some what "meh", some might be like "Oh it's just seven in game days" But to me that's time I don't have to just be sitting waiting for these guys to open up. It's pretty much a killer because then if they die in the course of that time you have to start all over again. On a side note: I like the name thing.

Thanks... Me too. I hope the reaction is good to the new updates. I really wanted to get the Mages done before the next update, so I still need a few more days in that department. I made the first template NPC and I'm picking out armor now for the random lists. I'm anxious to get one into battle so I can start understanding the default combat AI, and If I need to make any customizations. I'm concerned they will die too fast if melee enemies get close. I want them to have as much chance to survive and develop loyalty and history as the mercs do.

This is definitely one of the features that will be altered via a console command. I have reservations about the 7 day wait as well. I plan to have this time-span reduced based on a stat. Although, my timing is off... because that was going to be saved for another update later.

Your response is exactly the reason I've been posting my progress here. I like as much input as I can get from the players before the actual release. Nothing is final right now and criticism is exactly what I need.

So, it's apparent that you're not going to let me be lazy, and I'm going to have to write the code that allows you to trade... but not actually take their original equipment until after they've been employed long enough. This is better I admit. (you realize this will suspend the update by a few days )

That, now that is perfect something I'd much prefer. I hope I don't come across too critical though with my other posts. I try to give constructive criticism and useful opinions, but some times I guess I come across as a cynical jerk, not the case and sorry if it seemed that way. XD

I take all the criticism here as constructive. And, I would never consider accusing you of being too critical. After all, this post is titled "Opinions needed".

I did find your post to be useful and constructive. I can't guess how people are going to react to any changes I make, so all feedback is good for me. I feel everyone who's posted in this forum so far has been very respectful to each other which is the only thing that matters. Thanks for your part too!

Added:

8. Trade System: -= Done =- You can trade with the Merc immediately after you hire them. If you try to take their stuff, you will be charged for it. This only applies to the stuff they spawn with. You can give them things, and take them back with no charge. You will now see the gold they've earned in their inventory, but you cannot take it.

Pure awesomeness!

That was for you buddy!

Thank you much man

Hey, I'm not sure if it's caused by another mod I have, or if it has been addressed, but I'm getting a ton of letters of inheritance from dead mercs. Since follower AI in skyrim is awful my mercs kinda die in droves due to traps and dragons lol (I have had a spike trap kill 6 people in succession)

Any thoughts on this?

Yea I already brought that up to him. Same problem by the way, but I think he plans on correcting that by making it so they can learn lightfoot in way of purchasing a book or by finding it in a quest "Book of lightfoot".

I am new to the mod, so please forgive me for any ignorance.

First off, fantastic job on the mod, the way you interact and consider what the community has to say, simply amazing.

I also had a few ideas.

See, after installing a small keep/house and a few more houses and npc's on the other side of riverwood, I like to consider it my own little town, and every now and then when I dont need them, I like to use the mercs as guards, having a pool of minions, so to speak.

1.After hiring a few too many mercs, I hit some hard times, I enjoy having them around and I had an idea, why do all mercs have to be combat based, if you want a large army, but don't have the coin to support it, why not make a type of merc that can help? Prices would have to be upped dramatically if this were to be added, for balance's sake.

Bard- Hired around solitude. From the days of Daggerfall, where the bard class was the jack-of-all-trades, The Bard goes into town, doing small jobs, and splits the profit with you, not hired like a traditional merc, you find them and strike up an agreement for him to be your employee. (nervous about them coming up with the payment in the middle of battle) They do not earn too much, perhaps 25- 50 for every few days. But the more they work, the more money they earn and the bigger your share becomes.

Burglar- These are hired around Riften and the Ratway. Burglars do "steal" items from a pool of randomly generated loot, that you can sell. They charge an outrageous amount of gold to start out with, share less, and starting out a 25% chance of keeping the profit, and saying that "Nocturnal just wasn't with me tonight, no loot, sorry." and the lower level the burglar, the larger chance of them being caught and being put in jail. Perhaps you would be confronted with a note saying that he was arrested, you are given the location of their prison, and (if you feel like it) paying the bail. Paying the bail and sticking with them would allow you to get more reliable and better burglars, pickpockets, and the like. Burglars do earn double the amount of Bards, and perhaps they could have a chance of "finding something interesting" so you could get a nice little trophy or whatever. Possible variations, Thief- Brings back mainly gold and perhaps "a few things that caught my eye" Pickpocket- Only brings back gold, but costs less.

Possible- Hunters? Miners?

2.I came up with a little draft of reliable places to get mercs.

Whiterun- average soldier, and a few archers.

Markarth- Heavy armor, two handers, miners? And Orcs

Falkreath- Rangers, archers, and perhaps hunters.

Morthal-Argonians, rangers, soldiers

Dawnstar-Assassins (If you played the Dark Brotherhood, you understand, before the end of that quest line, perhaps a few very low levels could be found in Falkreath) perhaps some scouts.

Winterhold-Do I even have to say it?

Windhelm-Soldiers, rangers, and perhaps a few with the knowledge of the thuum, just saying...

Riften-Burglars, Argonians, Orcs (due to the stronghold nearby) a few low level assassins, rangers and archers.

Solitude- Bard, Soldier, archer, Heavy armor.

3. And on a side note- Looking at The Elder Scrolls fancy text at the top of the screen, am I the only one who thinks the E- in Elder, looks more like a G?

Any sort of feedback is greatly appreciated, I want to know if I'm asking the impossible over here.

And again, this is a great thing we have here.

@thefoopie :

Great stuff there.... Your a bit ahead of me though. I contemplated a separate mod similar to the one you've described. Though I never thought of hiring bards or thieves. That would be pretty dang cool. I was thinking of making a labor force mod, so that you can have miners, farmers, mill-workers etc.

It will have to wait a bit, since I'm knee-deep in this mod atm. Perhaps, when the time comes, I will start a new forum. It would be greatly appreciate if you participated in that conversation.

Thanks for all the good ideas! Keep 'em coming.

Added:

9. Troop Formations - -= Done =- Oh yeah. There is an new option in the Merc-Menu called "Formation". Selecting this option turns on the "Formation Mode". Essentially replaces the 'Menu' power with a new ability that toggles formation movement. When it's enable, troops will move in to more tactical positions. Melee characters to the front, Archers and Magi to the rear. Activate the power again to disable. The power will stay equipped so that you may turn it on and off during battle without having to access the menu a 2nd time. It actually works best to only turn it on for a few seconds at a time, just long enough to rearrange the battlefield with a more strategic posture. If you want to get back to the troop menu, just double-click the power and it will switch back to menu mode.

This feature is somewhat experimental, but offers incredible tactical benefits. Engaging this in the heat of battle will bring your archers out of danger, and push your melee characters out front to take the impact. Walking backward while "formations" is on, allows you to pull your troops back with you. This allows you to withdraw the whole group for a more advantageous position without having to retreat. "Formations" will override the Mercs even if they are engaged with an enemy. This alleviates the frustration of having a merc fight to his own death, when pulling back to regroup would be the better option.

Added:

4a. Tiered Mercs: -= Done =- The 5 Tiers of Mercs are now Novice, Apprentice, Adept, Expert, and Master. Their skills correspond to their respective levels.

4b. Player Matched Mercs: -= Done =- Additionally there is an option to build a Merc based on your own Level. This will randomly Generate a merc that should be comparable to your abilities based on an anolysis of your skills and level. All the uncappers out there whuold enjoy this new feature. It may also be more cost effective at times as you work your own way through the ranks. Daily wages are based on skills.

4c. Hire multiple Mercs at once: -= Done =- Once you have selected a Merc level from Saad (or other Merc Liaison) you will be asked to specify a quantity (Currenty 1-4). This allows you to build a team much faster. You can of course immediately hire another 4, and another 4. It's obviously much quicker than one-at-a-time.

Update:

3. Compatibility: The original mod relied on some physical objects that existed in Whiterun. Mods that modify whiterun too much would create a conflict with those objects. The code has been re-written to no-longer have that dependency, and those objects no-longer exist. This should prevent mods like "Open Cities" from hindering the usage of Mercenaries.

Haha.. I didn't know it was related to the merc mod. That's funny. I've been getting a lot of "inheritances" and didn't know why. I'm always like "I don't have any family in Tamriel, who died?"

Kinda humerous. I just met the guy yesterday, and got him killed by picking a fight with a pack of giants. And today, I get an inheritance from him. Not a bad racket!

So, I'm not sure what the fix is for this. They are not members of any of the "Follower" factions. Perhaps it's because of their "relationship rank" (friendship) ?

Sorry guys, no lightfoot in the next update. I keep adding so much, I need to get the new features out there soon before adding any more. Then I can look at some more of these other ideas. Honestly, I thought Mercs would be nothing but a nuisance in a dungeon. Congesting hallways, blocking doorways. I'm surprised people are using them in such areas. I was going to nerf them, so they wouldn't follow you in.

But... if they are being used in that fashion, I definitely want to support it. I can see how those traps must really svck for whole single-file row of stupid mercs.

So, instead of a skill that you can add to each merc, perhaps I should make a "group skill" so that the whole group has lightfoot for (x=duration). Hit me up agian on this issue after the next update (soooon I swear it)

Lol when I dismiss mercs I often find them around Whiterun doing Radiant tasks like chopping wood,smithing or just sitting about on a chair/bench either in the city or the Bannered Mare though I actually like it because it sort of makes it feel like they belong... Like now that they are unemployed they need to find some type of work. Haha I noticed the letters as well as a lot of the time the courier would magically pop up in front of me when one just died, never in an instance though only in cities or out in the open world.

Almost Done:

If you'll notice, I'm almost done with the list of changes and add-ons to the mod. Items that have a green -= Done =- are exactly that... done. Which leaves adding magi and the GlobalVar options.

Magi are almost complete. The code is in place, I just need to add more faces to choose from. Also need to ensure they don't cause aggro on the mercs with their spells. I suspect there will be many "suggestions" once Mages become available. in this release, they will spawn with randomly selected robes, but with no enchantments on them. It will be up to the player to provide such expensive accessories as staffs and robes.

The Globals will be last, they are the easiest to implement (and the most boring of all features from a programmers perspective)

Bloody Shweet

I dig it too. That suggestion came from this forum and the posters on SW and Nexus. Everyone really liked the "Followers Relax" mod and wanted mercs to do the same. So hat's off to the person who made the "Relax" mod. It does help with immersion tremendously. It's even cooler when you can give them names. It's such a simple thing, but it really makes me connect more with the NPC. If I see them out-and -about, I think to myself "Hey, there's Akina. I remember her. She saved my life from a pack of trolls once." or "Oh jeez, there's Krench over there chopping wood. GOOD! That guy couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag!".

One of the first things I'd like to do in the next update is fix their night-time behavior. I can't believe nobody has pointed it out yet. But, it bugs me a lot. 2am, 3am , 4am, Krench is still out there Chopping wood. They all do. They find a task, and stick to it forever. they need to randomly switch it up, and hit the inns at night. Or go home... wherever that is.


Also would like them to spend/earn money on their own.

Bug Fixes:

Dialogue/Trade Actor mismatch: Previously there was a slight chance you would trade with a different merc than you are actually talking to. (i.e. You take armor from a NPC, but you actually took it from the guy next to him.) This shouldn't happen. (as often)

Battle Vision: this was something I left in after development because I thought some players might like it. It's handy to me, and I haven't had any complaints about it, despite the weird delay. Perhaps nobody except me is using it. Either way, I rewrote the code to operate independently instead of a byproduct of a loop from another script. It now functions like the detect spell, being instantaneous, but still toggles on/off from the menu.