I'll second that. (And if they ever decide to add co-op to this game, however unlikely that may be, I'd join that)

Also, one thing I think people overlook, is that nothing really ever states definitively that Mora actually HAS all of the knowledge that he collects.

Who's to say he doesn't just take the knowledge and lock it up, or write it down? Who's to say he can even remember it all? Have you seen that dude's plane?! It's a mess!!! I'd be willing to wager the fool doesn't even have half of the knowledge that legends claim he does, he just keeps books about all of it, so if he ever WANTED to he could have it.

Maybe he's not the Daedric prince of Knowledge at all, maybe he's the daedric prince of reference material. That would certainly seem more fitting.

In all seriousness, [censored] HM. I don't care if he does have some magical sphere that would destroy all knowledge if he died or whatever, it'd still be worth it.

I hope no one is misunderstanding me. By KO I mean suppress, not kill. They suppressed Jygallag, one of the most (if not the most) powerful Daedric Princes in history inside of a new (?) Daedric Prince. You have to wonder what happened to his sphere while he was gone...

Hermaeus Mora finishing off Miraak was necessary to solidify the whole, "You'll be tossed aside like yesterday's news" angle, IMO.

Maybe we should get the help from the Daedra and/or Aedra and trap him in a converse Daedra. Hmmm... the Daedric Prince of Forgetfulness and Cluelessness. His plane is a blank white page, with him walking around a bit and scratching his head.

That's what I gathered... And Miraak's last words weren't so much a 'wish of vengeance' upon you, rather a warning to you.

I like the way you think. Better yet, make him Blind so he can't read it all. Or Make him just visually stable enough to read with the help of glasses, and then crush them right in front of him and leave.

TES 6

chartcher becomes a lacky in mehrune dagons army
and then allies with the armies of the summerset isles to destory nirn

the end

^^thats how it's going

Yup.
And the demon-dancer got the secrets of the Skaal as well.
He wins.

I wonder whether Neloth was right. What is so important about the knowledge of the Skaal? Or is he really just obsessed with knowing everything in existence?

Hermie is adorable! Though I was sad he killed that dude... I wasn't expecting that.

And in my opinion I think Mora is obsessive about collecting knowledge; and so really didn't like it when the Skaal kept stuff from him.

HM is weak lord, very sad and weak idiot! I bet Akatosh is best of them, Malacath hes (King of Vampires etc) afterall. Akatosh=Auri-El is strongest Lord!

HM isn't weak. He's arguably the most dangerous.
Malacath has nothing to do with vampires. You're probably thinking of Molag Bal.
Akatosh isn't a daedra lord. He's an Aedra.

Oh my bad! Didint remember, it was Molag Bal. I didint say Akatosh is Daedra Lord. I just sayd Lord, but still HM is [censored] pile next to Akatosh.

1. I figured as much. It's cool.
2. Fair enough. I misunderstood.
3. Probably.

No we could not physically beat him, but we may have tricked him. Pulled a fast one and trapped him in the Soul Carin or Akatosh's help could have been used to deal him a serious blow to bind him for a time.

The actual importance of the Skaal's knowledge is unknown, but given how long and how dedicated they have been to preventing it from falling into HM's hands I would say it is of some importance.

However, what that knowledge actually is, is only important to the Skaal. Hermaeus Mora doesn't really care what the knowledge is, only that it is being hidden from him.

This was something that bothered me greatly in my first playthrough. Hermaeus Mora wins? That's a first; usually the player wins at the end of a questline. The player is basically forced to dance like a puppet on strings attached to HM's tentacles all throughout the quest. The only benefit RP-wise is that the island is saved from Miraak. But what exactly was Miraak going to do, other than mind-control some peeps and ride dragons about? Was he going to destroy everything, or was he going to have his hissy fit, then go back to dragon-riding and maybe kill Alduin? And now that he's vanquished, HM gets exactly what he wants: the knowledge of the Skaal, and a new Dragonborn to use as a servant. I am seriously concerned about the soul of the Dragonborn once his or her life is ended; does it go to Sovngarde for his deeds? Or does it get claimed by HM, despite his/her wishes?


I can't help but imagine Jyggalag showing up at Apocrypha and threatening to impose order, only for Hermaeus Mora to usher him in with gratitude and relief. That place needs the Dewey Decimal system like crazy!

Don't know if it matters, but it's interesting how the dragonborns play a critical role in Mora's desire for the Skaal's secrets whilst the Skaal say that their secrets are from the all-maker who is Akatosh.

You can't soul trap a daedric prince dude...

Miraak is a dragonborn and a particularly powerful and power-driven one. He'd simply seek to extend his influence and grow in power.

I wouldn't worry about the dragonborns soul, he might be an avatar of Lorkhan himself whilst having the will to resist Mora's influence. Frea say that Aka made you for a reason, and that you can resist Mora. Given the Skaal's obvious secret knowledge and power I would suggest trusting Frea on that one. Not to mention that Miraak apparently needed your soul to leave, and that you gained his soul instead.. which might have put you over the top, so to speak.

This, more or less. Essentially Herma-Mora gave us a taste of the 'dark-side' when he helped us to beat Miraak and we're by no means his servant right now. However, as both Frea and Neloth suggest, you need to be wary of being lured into his service. Pretty a-typical of the Daedric Princes and fantasy literature as a whole (Lord of the Rings, for example).

"I think you're going to need a bigger soul gem..." XD

I think it was un-necessary for him to intervene but I still serve him as always

Well, true, but I can't help but think of how many of Hermaeus Mora's boons you can receive from the Black Books throughout the dlc, and my mind is drawn to the example of Kodlak and his ties to Hircine. He was able to be freed, and his tie seems more powerful than the ties that HM has to the PC, but still. That seems to be how HM lures a mortal into his service: lots lof little tidbits that keep you coming back for more. When do you become his servant? At what point are you so inextricably bound to HM that his claim over your soul is absolute?

As for his being an incarnation of Lorkhan, how do you figure? I understand that he's dragonborn, but that's a special gift given by Akatosh (or potentially inherited in special cases like the line of Tiber Septim). I do agree, though, that his will is enough to resist HM's influence, but I suppose my question is how much and how long can he resist? I simply find it suspicious how easily Hermaeus Mora allows you to leave his realm so freely. Ostensibly, it's to let you be his representative or champion on Nirn, but he basically hands you the keys to Apocrypha at the end, and with each Black Book you find and read. Why would he allow such a powerful mortal such freedom unless he knew that mortal's soul was his? A daedra does have eternity to wait...

Of course, it does seem easy to defy a daedra prince. Look at Azura's Star: with a bit of sorcery and some soul-murder, it can be transformed into the Black Soul, something so far from Azura's will that it can't be anything but a corruption of a part of Azura herself. Same with Malkoran's twisted use of Dawnbreaker, and Erindur's dismissal of the Skull of Corruption from Tamriel. Still, these are artifacts, and while artifacts are physical representations of each daedric prince's will, that aren't the deadric princes themselves. Just how easy is it to defy them directly?

Wow! I felt the same way. I was like "Hey you overgrown squid, get your tentacles off my kill!"