Nothing more entertaining than character development. Grey makes it easier [edit: more complex]; cuz the moment [my] goodietwoshoes Lightsider does something naught-necessary, he isn't really Lawful Good anymore.

My only beef is that, if [I] don't plan it right, everyone in that great american novel [I've] been spending [my] time writing instead of in college turns out gray and unappealing without any foils and contrasts.

Uhm

edited for some gentle selfdeprecating irish humor

I think he meant "Loose" "er" not "loser" As in to "loosen up"

OT: You might want to donate to Arkay whenever you take from a corpse of an undead creatures..

Or you could loot only dropped stuff like weapons, or loose potions in dungeons, leaving (selfmade) corpses alone. That way you don't defile anything, but still have a steady income/speech. With the encumbrance of weapons (which always drop) it is challenging

Grey just means the character isn't fully white or black, so pure good or pure evil... I do not see how that's easier. Grey still means rules you abide by in any circumstance. If I kill all Thalmor and evil people I'm not white, the Thalmor aren't pure black evil but grey themselves. There many shades of grey.

My barbarian Nord hates elves, he refuses to help them at all. He's not evil however and won't slay the innocent. So how makes this him bland and boring? It limits my options in and for quests while making him totally different from my previous characters.

Yes, I was thinking of changing the wording to My great american novel. Not that there is a novel--there isn't. My failed rhetoric.... Not at all targeted at you, my apologies. My view on some fiction outside Skyrim. And I think I quoted you because I like gray characters, not because your char may or may not be fun.

So

I was thinking about beginners and the whole DungeonsnDragons alignment. Sometimes players forget that characters grow. And don't have to stay that way. But then it becomes a matter of Roleplay vs Ruleplay. Is that Paladin allowed to slay a bandit on the Jarl's order? etc etc, human life, authority. New players forget that though and string themselves up.

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edit,
LOL

I put "Grey makes it easier"? Whaoh. I guess I meant "easier", by leaving room for char development ---gray/complexity. Otherwise I disagree with my old post. Good thing I have some coffee now. A writer-gamer shouldn't be so strict with his role; then again, if the point of this thread was to set down some rules for the OP's roleplay, then I've totally missed the point. Woops.

You can be a down to earth good type. Somewhat. Like maybe Xena-like (can't think of a male equivalent atm).

Or a self-serving neutral type, who comes through at important points. Think of Spike Spiegel or Han Solo.

Paladins are kind of silly anyways.

It's more of an action adventure game.

Keven Serbo's Hercules..Or Angel.

i don't see a problem, undead are un natural abomination so my paladin kills them, i just evoyde DB and thiefs guild, help who eve i can and never rob or kill inocent people, i give to the poor and donate some gold every now and again to temple for the poor and in need dragons and will beast provide really nice loot not to mention bandits

Due to how the game is presented, you just have to find creative ways to workaround certain issues.

For example, I wanted Dawnbreaker and Spellbreaker for my Paladin, but these are Daedric artifacts. However, if you really look at the quests and what they entail, you are actually ridding the lands of evil. At the same time, I wanted the Ebony Mail, but I couldn't justify the means in that quest.

For Speech, the biggest thing to do here w/o exploits or focusing on looting would be Alchemy. Concoct a bunch of potions and sell them off, then use that money to buy more ingredients for more potions. As long as you keep points out of the left side of the tree, and only put one point in the base perk, you should be spending about as much as you are making, evening things out. To get rid of some money, just buy ore and ingots and sell them back, which will also contribute to your Speech. If you are using Dawnbreaker, another good money sink would be to buy Soul Gems to refill the enchantment use bar thing (as you cannot pay anyone for the service), since absorbing souls is pretty much a no-no.

Each person plays their Paladin a bit different. For me, I'm ridding the land of the Undead and, more specifically, the Dragon Princes (except for the one tied to the MQ). However, I still help those in need of assistance, be it by eliminating bandits that are threatening the townsfolk or keeping an eye out for specific books or instruments.

Your idea of a Paladin sounds more like a Monk to me and not a Paladin.

There is a trick to up your speechcraft. As soon as you acquire a dwarven bow, you'll get a note from an altmer in markarth (he's good don't worry) where he asks to buy the bow. You can persuade him to up the price, then back out of talking to him instead of agreeing to sell him the bow, and keep doing that over and over to up your speechcraft. I don't believe it takes much speechraft to be successful in upping the price since he doesn't care about money, its a silly simple misc. quest, and he's desperate to study dwarven artifacts.

There is also another NPC you can do this with although i forgot his name, he works at one of the meaderies i think.

Plus, don't try to up your speechcraft selling vegetables. It goes by the price of the item unlike X amount of items sold in Oblivion. And if you are selling a stack of items, sell them one at a time. If you sell 5 healing potions at once for 30 gold each, it will only recognize the 30 gold once for the whole stack, so sell them seperately.

I hope this helps

*blink

The English language weeps.

...I think the point of this whole game is that there is no good and no evil, just a grey inbetween. Good is a subjective, political judgement. You can't be a Paladin because it's too black and white an idea. You can only be a fighter taking quests from priests and getting blessings at shrines, which is effectively the same thing without being validated externally as a 'good guy'.

As for not wanting to loot bodies, that's something I've long struggled with in RPGs... You kind of have to accept that as a mainstay of fantasy games.

I do agree though that there are a lot of quest lines I just don't want to go down eg Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild etc. But I like watching my less goody-two-shoes other half play through them to see the story!

Since when Paladins don't loot corpses? I thought they were called.. Monks?

Besides the fact that skyrim is very combat and looting centric (yeah it would be great if you could join an complete the main quests as a practicing member a religious or spiritual order, like the imperial cult or greybeards, just as it would be great to do it via the guilds and it actually having an effect on the world) , are there even any "paladins" in TES? If there are, would it make sense that your character are one?

Knights are there, both as a class and as characters. Paladins in the popular culture are just a highly specialized kind of knights, so I guess it makes sense to be one of them. They are lore friendly, that's for sure.

He meant looser, as in loose, less tight, less strict and thus more open of an RP, not the insult 'loser'. Learn to read before logging into forums, please!

"Real Paladin"? Isn't that an oxymoron?
But assuming its not, well, the crusaders were "real Paladins" and did all of those things. Some of the nastiest wars in history were fought over religion. Even in the Bible, the warriors of god regularly defile the corpses of those they slay (See king David and his 200 strong collection of foreskins).

I'd say you've got a very strict (and fictionalized) notion of what a paladin is. The fact that Skyrim's fictional notions don't gybe with yours is not a flaw of the game, its just a design choice that reflects the game setting rather well.

That said, if you do want to play a higly virtious character (of any sort), its not so hard. Sure, you ignore some quests and treasures (though not many- those tombs are full of unholy potential undead, after all), but other than that, meh. All knights were expected to pay for their gear, retainers, mounts, expenses, etc - why is a paladin exempt? If you are exempt from such things, it just means you have friends who are rich enough that they pay for those things for you. That's not especially virtuos, its just lucky (and a bit lazy). Viking culture would almost certainly not have allowed it.

Keep in mind, this is YOUR version of a Paladin, there is no "class" in Skyrim. How would you make money? Doing good deeds for Jarls. Earn cash. By materials, make items, sell items, buy items. Use Persuade and Intimidate (largest increases occur there, not buying and selling, IME). I don't think you're making a great point here. How would you increase speech in any other game? Same here.

A Paladin can loot every corpse, urn, chest, sack, et al that they come across. What you do with the loot is a different story. Total up your Loot, subtract operating costs (gear, potions, ingredients, food) and give the rest away (leave it in a chest in the Jarl's house) to simulate donating to the less fortunate.

Done.

The dead have no need of material goods, the living do.

Well there's your problem.

"I want to role-play a guy who gives all his money to beggars, but maaaaans it's so hard cuz there's no way I can gain coin myself!"

You could always play a Blackguard

Yes, being a Paladin is almost impossible in this game because there are some quests where you literally have to do something evil and trap you until you do it.

I think Bethesda really lost the plot here with optional choices. Previous rpgs including Bioware`s baldur`s gate, NWN, etc would have an alternative, somehow, somewhere even if it took longer ad was harder.

I dunno what`s going on with Skyrim.

In this game you can only play only a Neutral character who tries to do good.

There are many interpretations on what a Paladin is. Its possible to play a Grey paladin. Lord knows the ones that exsisted in real life werent the holy men they claimed to be.