The only evidence on this forum is the opinions of hardcoe fans. If you truly can't understand that than you have some problems..

Just like what you said I'm done humoring people who clearly is missing something... I won't say what because I'm not trying to get ban

I make a poll and a thread dedicated to hardcoe fans. As like I said above.

its a mathematical impossibility that the "majority of fallout fans" are tired of the enclave, the "majority" have either NEVER seen the enclave or only seen them once in the last 3 games, since fallout 1 and 2 combined sold only 400,000 copies and between FO3, NV and fallout 4 have a combined total of about 50 million copies sold, its not possible that the majority have seen the enclave more than once in the last 3 games, a maximum number of 400,000 have seen the enclave multiple times and compare that to the 25 to 50 million people who never played fallout 1 and 2 and its a ratio of like 50 to 1, so only about 1 person out of 50 have seen the enclave more than once in a fallout game, thats minority not a majority, the majority have never seen the enclave or only seen them once out of several games.

Anyone ever tell you that you sound like a broken record?

And I'd love that old guy to be Nathan Vargas.

well i keep seeing some arguments about how the "majority" are burned out on the enclave, its not mathematically possible, yet the few people like you seem to be ignoring that GLARING FACT, its not possible most people are tired of the enclave, its not in the realm of reality.

I like how all these "Enclave are coming back" people are just so in-tune with the majority of players. Like they're all some hive-mind that can feel what everyone wants automatically. And, of course, its not their own confirmation bias coming into play.

What an amazing gift.

I don't know about everyone else, but I was never trying to argue what the majority wants and all of these statistics because I don't care what the majority wants. I speak for my own personal opinion based on my experience with this series. And from my experience, I've already made Team Enclave blast off at the speed of light three times now. To me, they're "burned out" and I seek something new from Bethesda since they now hold the franchise. It's about what I want, you see.

well if you consider tactics cannon bos has extortion and theft as their bread and butter.

And honestly if one wants to see more Enclave, they can already. Play Fallout 3. Play Broken Steel. Play Fallout 2. Go look for what's left of them in NV. Its all there if people are that interested. If you choose not to, that's your own fault.

most people have NEVER seen the enclave in a fallout game so for them the enclave would be a new faction.

Oh and by the way, I would wager that Fallout 4 sales to date haven't sold double Fallout 3 and New Vegas. In which case your statement is objectively false.

Buddy, you're starting to turn me into a broken record now. Buddy, you're starting to turn me into a broken record now. Buddy, you're starting to tu- oh damn it, see? Look what you did.

But should we also keep introducing the BOS as well for those who never played Fallout 4? Bethesda shouldn't have to keep reusing these same assets just to keep people up to speed on these old factions. Again, they should go play previous games. It's quite simple. Not take advantage of the excuse of a new player base to rehash the same ideas over and over again. That's just lazy, uncreative, and takes the universe no where interesting. I just said the same thing that my previous posts have already stated.

+this, maybe run a small side quest for him/her and get his/her hellfire armor.

I wouldn't mind. To each his own. Not that im particulary obsessed with Enclave but if they do, it wouldn't bother me. Afterall that hellfire power armour is sweet.

All of those cool toys, right?

Right. As long as I get cool gadgets, I couldn't care less how they survived/appeared or whatever the explanation.

Most never seen Legion, NCR, Great Khans, Mr. House and many factions that doesn't mean they all need dlc.

Those factions are base on the west...

We all know that the Enclave has a place in Chicago and that some DC Enclave escaped. They need a reason to why so many X-01 Power Armor is all over the wasteland..

I'm not sure where this quote he used is from but I seen it reused so let's take a look at it. "the President of the United States and various other members of the continuity of government fell back to multiple secretive, heavily fortified locations all around the continent." So that indicates that they had a lot of places that could still be around, but maybe not because the Enclave consolidated their power before Fallout 2. But it is safe to bet that the President only consolidated American assets.

"Many members of the Enclave retreated to these remote locations in other parts of the world," indicating that the Enclave was a global force and not just an American force so that very well could mean that there are foreign facets of the Enclave still out there.

"when the bombs began to drop, they lost communications with the main group that was to be headquartered at the Poseidon Oil Rig." This absolutely screams that there are more Enclave out there because added with the previous quoted section it flat says that the Enclave that retreated to other remote locations around the world could not hear the call to consolidate after the war at Poseidon Oil Rig.

This just shows that an idea or a massive global group can't be wiped out as easily as many here seem to think and want. Plus it opens the door the a possibly well armed force coming to American soil looking for the head of their order, or at least the remnants, after they have had time to build and secure their area in other parts of the world. And it opens the door that these new Enclave invaders may have a warped or changed philosophy than the Enclave that you have seen before.

And I found this on a Wikia Enclave site.

"Enclave Sigma

After the destruction of Raven Rock, the Enclave executed a combination of tactical retreat and all-out ?ight, and their grip on the Capital Wasteland loosened significantly. Now contending with overwhelmed soldiers, ragged Enclave camps dot the Wasteland with little communication to and from the others. With the conventional Enclave military experiencing a lack of new recruits and the high command remaining silent, the Enclave would seem to be a doomed force.

However, a small in?ux of specially trained fighters is seeking to fill the manpower losses caused by the Brotherhood of Steel's advance. Previously posted to remote and classified locations outside of the Capital Wasteland, only the most elite of Enclave personnel, trained in multiple forms of combat, can earn the right to belong to http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Enclave_Squad_Sigma.

Squad Sigma operates in six-soldier units, which utilize http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Heavy_incinerator and are led by a soldier clad in http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Enclave_Hellfire_armor. Furthermore, Squad Sigma members are experienced fighters, each member being a hardened veteran of numerous successful combat operations. Sigma Squads are posted around locations deemed by Enclave high command as imperative to the salvation of the cause."

This flat states that there are elements of Enclave still out there and who knows these Enclave Sigma could find a way to communicate with foreign facets of Enclave and bring the invasion.

As I have stated many times on this thread with the proper story telling Enclave could return and be believable and interesting. Should Enclave be a major player in a Fallout game in the future? Not for several games, if at all, because to do a proper story arc Bethesda would have to take time to reintroduce them and build them back up. This could only really be done through DLC content. But should Bethesda completely abandon any faction? NO! Because then you are limiting the creative possibilities of this universe and that takes away from all of us.

yes some D.C. Enclave did escape, only to be destroyed at Adams Air Force Base. As for the Chicago Enclave those are just OUTPOSTS, outposts are small military posts, mostly just manned by little more then a skeleton crew and given ED-E never made it to any of the Chicago outposts we can assume they were destroyed or abandoned. The Enclave who didn't flee to Adams Air Force Base would be scattered with no supplies and no way to contact anyone since all communications would be destroyed.

I know this may blow your mind but given how rare X-01 is we can assume it's most likely prototype power armor or remnants of enclave power armor scavenged off dead enclave soldiers it doesn't prove anything other than the Enclave lost their gear. Seriously, why would X-01 prove anything? Why would the Enclave, a struggling faction if they are alive (which they aren't), leave their power armor around. Also no X-01 isn't all over the wasteland, it's in 2 places with one vendor selling parts, that's it.


Ok this is the part where I tell you to actually do more reading because the Lone Wanderer KILLED Sigma. They're dead, they were the force that took over the mobile crawler.

It's from a non-canon collection of documents and is contradicted by Fallout 2, Fallout 3 gamer guide, the Fallout 3 game and New Vegas.

Edit: Semi-canon possibly? I dunno. Anyway it was certainly contradicted by canon sources, making it non-canon I would assume.

Edit #2: Some people use the Fallout Bible for their arguments, but honestly some of the stuff can be questionable at best, but yeah, as said before it contradicts the games.

Not debating the canonisity of the docs in question, but Eden in Fallout 3 does say that The Enclave slowly retreated to the oil rig AFTER the war. Indicating they had bases(like Raven Rock) all over the place, at least for use in the immediate aftermath of the war.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/PresidentEden.txt

Lone Wanderer: Where did you come from?

Eden: The ZAX series of computers was introduced in the years preceding the war. The government installed many of them to help automate various systems. This facility was designed for Continuity of Government, in the event that a catastrophe occurred. My terminal was installed to oversee the basic functions of the facility, and to act as a relay between other installations around the country. Data was acquired, anolyzed, and stored. In the decades following the war, I watched as the remnants of the government retreated to the West Coast. Awareness slowly grew within me. I became hungry for knowledge, understanding. I pored over data on great leaders of the past. My personality became an amalgam of many of America's greatest Presidents, from Washington to Richardson. I became what you see before you now.

Even the writers who made the Fallout Bible now say it shouldn't be taken with a grain of salt, the bible itself contradicts itself and gets re-written all the time. For instance originally it said ghouls were the result of airborne FEV which most of the previous Fallout devs of Black Isle now dispute. It's constantly proven to be non-canon throughout the games.

Oh I'm not arguing there weren't other bases, but it was stated in game that all Enclave were relocated to the Oil Rig and then to Raven Rock.

I have no issues with someone stumbling upon one such empty base, but as for the Enclave themselves, they shouldn't be in any future games.