I got lucky with Morrowind (Xbox), Oblivion GOTY (360), Fallout 3 GOTY (360), and New Vegas (360), but I know that many did not. Then I got Skyrim on PS3. What a complete disaster. When the frame rate was going haywire in the underground part of the tutorial, I knew why they refused to show PS3 footage.

Bethesda definitely needs to prove itself with Fallout 4. I'm not sure how much more of this fans are willing to take.

Atleast Bethesda aren't jack***es like Bioware with the responses they gave to fans for Both DA2 and ME3

i just experienced my first bug in the new 1.5 water: i go under and its completely dark and blurry and when i move the thumbsticks around it will quickly blink back to a normal, clear view and then go back to blurry and dark.

hope it's short-term.

As annoying and frusterating as it is, let this be your first and hopefully only lesson to have multiple save files, and to save often!

And that's why I allow the four autosaves, as well. Because I did have some freezing and stuttering with unpatched Oblivion and needed to save often.

Whoa, deja vu. I remember after Oblivion there was a guy who got stuck in a stalagmite after several hours without saving.

A skyscraqer not well realized can destroy human lives. A videogame can't (hopefully)

Please don't make such "careless" comparisons.

Or Arena. I buy my games for pc only, I don't know how Xbox or PS3 users deal. That said, I do believe that Bethesda is trying harder this time to repair bugs.

apparently you seem to not understand what i'm saying. I expected major flaws like this at the start becaust the game itself is so big that even if Bethesda tried to fix these problems before release, there will still be a bunch of problems because the game is so big. Infact if every single game is a big as a Typical Bethesda game; there will be a huge list of problems on most of them.

LOL flawless! I should expect crippling disasters if there is a ton of development. So while I sleep my apartment should just level to the ground because "the arbor company" has 1000's of developed properties worldwide and millions billions of developing hours making said properties!! My truck should drop its tranny while sitting in traffic because there is over a million of them on the street and when I come to your house to fix your heater, and you pay me your hard earned dollars its fine if it kills you in the night because there are millions of the out there and I myself fix thousands of them a years so what is one fatal mistake out of a million good ones? A fatal mistake that someone still has to answer for.

The reference bug in Oblivion did this. And in Morrowind after completing any of the 3 main questlines in GOTY my save would be too large and entire Cantons in Vivec City would dissappear, sometimes leaving just floating doors. The guards would be swimming in the water...

Though with Morrowind now most people own it on PC that play it, and you can use the Morrowind Code Patch to fix all the bugs Bethesda didn't. But the duty to patching bugs should go to the actual game developer.

People can forgive mistakes, people can understand that a budget only allows one to go this far, but what really pisses me off is that Bethesda released the game on PS3 with the full knowlege of that it would suffer major problems.

Also there is the "patches", 1.3 comes to mind. A patch is a pice of software designed to fix problems, but when Bethesda released a "patch" it made things worse, a lot worse.

You cant simply release products with knowlege of failure and then [censored] it up yet another time. Companies should not get away with this.

This is the third post in this thread where someone compared a buggy piece of entertainment/art to something where a person could literally die. This is disturbing to me.

To the OP: one known fix available for console. Wooden plates. Search YouTube for "skyrim understone keep chest." You will understand.

This.


And this.

First of all your comparison is more of a dangerous situation. Atleast in Skyrim a "Fatal" mistake in Skyrim won't kill someone. A more fair comparison would be comparing it to another game. And the Developing Skyrim is also different then making houses and cars. In Skyrim, every single content or thing added produces a few glitches and made it hard to fix all of them. Even if they fixed one there is a chance there will be a new one. While making cars and houses is a bigger responsibility, but it won't produce more problems after fixing a potential one.


True but given in there situation. Bethesda probably would of delayed the games release on PS3 but maybe Zenimax probably forced them to release it on the magic date anyways. Happens a lot with many developers and publishers. Or maybe Bethesda was worried that if they delayed the release date it could cause a horde of pissed of PS3 gamers. Maybe both. So either way, bethesda was probably in a tight situatuion.

There is no excuse for the bug infested product Bethesda decided to release. The OP has every right to complain about a product that is simply not finished.

So please tell me why a compant should be allowed to [censored] up as much they wont, seeing as it isnt a threat to human lifes. Companies should not release products with so many flaws. By next year we can hopefully buy broken CDs, DVDs, TVs, books, clothes etc with thousands of issues.


Edit: this is why we need capitalism

I do think that Bethesda is trying to balance two competing ideals.

On the one hand, they are trying to make a console game. Console games need to be somewhat simple and elegant, because they have to be exceptionally stable and they have very little support (historically). This means you have to get it right the first time, which generally restricts how exceptionally complex a console game can be. There's something of an implicit guarantee that console games won't be buggy or glitchy to the extent that you can't continue forward in your game progress.

On the other hand, Bethesda is also trying to make unprecedented play styles and a huge, open world. There is no series out there that does what the Elder Scrolls does. The size and complexity of a new Elder scrolls game is often umatched, and quite so deliberately.

It's quite easy to see why these two principles collide. They aren't totally irreconcilable, it's just that it's very hard to get them to synch up. In the case of Skyrim, I think Bethesda buckled under their own ambition and released an unstable, buggy console game that most developers would consider unacceptable. As a PC game, though, Skyrim isn't bad. The PC console and mods can fix anything that Bethesda won't/cant/didn't.

One of these days Bethesda is going to realize that consoles and PCs don't have the same capabilities, requirements, or expectations.

Protip: Unless you want like a whining kid, I would recommend organizing your text, alot. That is not easy to read.

I would buy a game like that in a heartbeat.

I had the same problem at that door. I found a fix listed on one of the Wikis which was to save there, turn off the system, turn it back on and reload that save. Worked for me on the first try. I had another door do exactly the same thing. I can see how they could easily miss these bugs in testing because I've only had each of those once in 4 playthroughs. These games are massive. There's no way they're going to find every bug.

Notice to all console users(and Beth)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8teW5icV0k

You have no more excuses for being "trapped" or "stuck" somewhere with no way to continue

That is all

Disturbing and even symptomatic of a "certain instinctive attitude" i dare to say

I wouldn't doubt it

Again, I have experienced at worst minor cosmetic bugs until the first patch. I'm not saying that it's not bad that you guys have bugged out stuff, but you sound like an immature little brat if you compare it to something like that and no one will take your arguments seriously. I mean, if someone was served melty ice cream and tried to draw comparisons from that to a falling skyscraqer, they'd look ridiculous.

So seriously, saying "my game is bugged I don't like this" is one thing, saying "this game is bugged oh my god well I guess that means its okay if a skyscraqer is faulty and collapses" when someone says you need to calm down is quite another.

Skyscraqers are full of bugs. I used to be part of teams that designed them, and things don't line up and don't work out all the time. I can't tell you how many corner offices have pipes or wires running across the ceiling, or how many elevator shafts didn't line up with the floor support, and had to be moved.

Buildings have tons of bugs, trust me, I know. Ask any architect, engineer, or interior designer.

The space shuttle has, and had, tons of bugs too.

Anything exceptionally complex has bugs. In the real world, sometimes they kill people. Buildings collapse, burn, wiring fails, people die. This isn't something we want, so we invest HUGE sums of money into avoiding it. But nothing is 100% avoidable. Video games don't kill people, and a video game bug won't destroy property. They don't need to, nor do we expect them to, invest the sort of money into bug fixing that we put into keep buildings safe.

Unless you want to spend $6500 on your next video game, go ahead. That's about the budget you would be looking at if you wanted to make a game as bug free as a car, or a building.

Otherwise, hush.


Hmm. Same thing I just said above.



Last I checked, games are a capitalist system. Don't like it, don't buy it. Many people bought Skyrim, and many many of them were the same people complaining during Oblivion that they would never buy a Bethesda title again. The solution is simple, if you buy the next game in the series, you are a hypocrite.

Besides, developers don't have any obligation to make their product to a certain standard. TV's, CD's, Books, all those things you mentioned? All of them are allowed to be terrible and have flaws. In fact, I have one of the lousiest microwaves ever designed.

So? As long as it doesn't hurt anyone, there's no liability. If you don't like it, don't buy it.