Like I said, no problem with the variation concept, but variation isn't variation if it's grouped all together, like you wouldn't consider the provinces of Tamriel (individually) varied in inhabitants if everyone stayed in their races province and never went to others. I put off playing the main quest for a while as I often do, and as soon as I played it I was amazed how much more intricately designed the dungeons were (Except that I fortunately came across Blackreach earlier which as I've stated is an enjoyable half-exception). I would be interested to see your examples as dungeons that are as amazing as the ones I mentioned in my OP. Perhaps they exist, but I can't think of any off-hand.

Yep that was a response to something not referring to the game itself and I was thinking about something a little different, so I was a bit off base. I do agree with what you are saying.

Edit: I was thinking the game needs more effort put into each different portion, not necessarily making every dungeon and city beautiful.

I noticed you said that you don't get that magic back after the first few hours. Could this be due to the fact that you are new to the game and so the first dungeon you run into has a huge impression on you but then it wears off and the others are just meh?

Here is an example I will use. Everquest Online Adventures was a console port of Everquest. Many Everquest fans HATE that game with a passion. It is considered among many mmo fans as one of the worst examples of a MMO. Yet it was the first MMO I ever played and I loved it. It rates as the best MMO ever in my books. It was new to me, it had a mysticism that to it that no other game had (remember first mmo) and I fondly look back at it and remember all the good times I had.

Then I played other MMO's and in my book they couldn't hold the standard that I had come to expect from EQOA, why? I think it has to do with the fact that it was my first MMO so there was this magic to the game and once I played other MMO's that magic had already worn off. I was use to them, I knew what to expect and wasn't really ever svcked in by them. Maybe this is the same symptom you suffer from?

I am not trying to flame you here, just giving you something else to think about because when you said "After a few hours the magic had worn off." It reminded me of how much I loved a game that no other game of its genre could compare to despite many fans of that genre considering it one of the worst ones in the market.

I do understand the core of your point but I don't think it's relevant in this circumstance. Like for me, I intentionally avoided the main quest related things, including Riverwood (Ivarstead was the first place I visited), until later. But I wholeheartedly agree without a doubt, the dungeons and that town that are main quest related are some of, probably the best in the game. The quality shift is noticeable even without any sort of nostalgia or initial wonder effect.

Also, it makes sense that the locations that are Most Important (i.e, part of major quests/etc) will get more attention than the locations that are Just There.


(On the other hand, that wasn't always the case in Fallout 3. A number of "random" locations, that didn't even have quests associated, ended up being among the best. LOB Enterprises, for instance. But, then, Fallout 3 seemed to have alot more "storytelling" in the locations, just due to all the terminals and setting details - like corpses and other clutter. However, I suppose that "on average" Important Locations got more attention than Random Locations. If you consider the entire collection.)

I just want to say I still do support the idea of having well-thought-out locations be quest related. It seems a waste to have a well designed place with nothing to do in it. But I'm saying let the factions and sidequests get more of the glory as well. Like, as I've mentioned, Hackdirt.

Good thing this is a videogame fanatasy world, where nothing has to be grounded to reality.

There are some dungeons, like those with waterfalls in them or beams of light and trees, that are actually much better than the ones the OP mentioned IMO. There are the 'simple' ones also, but I never would expect every single dungeon to take my breath away either.

I have noted the lack of bats in the other caves. It's like that's something they threw in for the cool effect, but never bothered to add them to any other dungeons.

I dunno, I guess some of you aren't going to the right dungeons then. I've to a lot of dungeons where I was taken aback by just how cool they are. There was a Nordic ruin that had you going up each level on the outside walls and one of the doors was a huge skull and you walked in through the mouth. There is the dungeon where you have to stop the ritual. The dungeon that has the boat in it. There's a few that have forests in them. I can't recall all their names but there are a lot of really cool dungeons. Sure, some are bland caves but there are a lot of cool ones.

Like CCNA said, not every building is spectacular. Same goes for Skyrim's dungeons.

Meh... all books, movies and games have their set pieces. This is not a TES specific thing. Do I want all dungeons to be like Blackreach? hell no.

i've been into many caves in my life an generally they are not as interesting as the ones in skyrim....any of them

In the real world, 'cities' contain more than a few houses and an inn. This isn't the real world though.

Ever been to Jewel cave, Augusta? Absolutely amazing, even without Nordic architecture. http://i1.trekearth.com/photos/116725/cave-01.jpg http://www.topstrange.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/2-Jewel-Cave.jpg http://www.nothinglikeaustralia.com/uploaded_files/local/nz/entry_uploads/large/1272879882_21187.jpg

Wow... Just wow... Some of those in the next TES please!

It's one of 2 caves I've been too, from memory, the other was in Pemberton or nearby, and pretty awesome as well, though it was many years ago and I was young, so my memory is vague.

ever been to any other generic cave besides that?
http://www.google.it/search?hl=it&q=cave&gs_sm=3&gs_upl=984l1629l0l2508l4l4l0l0l0l1l898l1923l3-3.6-1l4l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&biw=1366&bih=643&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=230-T4vfEYSB4ATPhOWtCA

Some will complain about everything...

This pixel looks boring.
It is called 'grey'.
Why do they put grey pixels into the game?
Because some things have a grey colour.
That is just stupid.
... You got THAT right!

How do generic real life caves apply? Sure there can be generic caves in Skyrim, but why would we adventure there?

idk, because you don't know what a cave might looks like until you actually enter it?

First world problems.

All mah dungeons aren't different and exceptional! Some aren't as awesome as others!

If this is your position you are obliged to post examples of a game with as much content as Skyrim, as big a variety as Skyrim BUT where the quality for each gamezone/dungeon/level is first rate. Open world games only please! Please send your answers to Pie In The Sky games. Thank you.

Firstly, not apart from what I've mentioned, but most of that stuff looks varied and awesome, and secondly, why are you against the idea of more interesting caves in a game outside the main quest (I can't think of another reason you would suggest that all caves are more boring than Skyrim ones)?

I mean why would a quest lead to a generic cave? Is some NPC gonna complain to the dragonborn that a bear stole their Dibella statue?

Please read my many, many posts explaining why this is not what I am saying. Thankyou.

well, most of this stuff looks like skyrim's caves = you are wrong

...What?