Glad youre all right then, Jack.

What are you talking about? Weren't you the one accusing Beth of deliberately nerfing the CK so that they wouldn't have to compete with modders?

There is a perfectly acceptable work around. It's not a fix, granted. But it works and to me is not a big deal. I prefer to deal in the real world. And by that I mean doing something constructive rather than ranting. Only Beth can fix this. So, why not try to work with them rather than throwing a hissy fit?

Does anyone know what workaround he's on about? Not a big deal? Are we on different threads or something?

Anyway, back to the whole point of the thread, that has moved on a long way from initial frustration and my initial annoyance.

Does the bug still persist if the esp is merged into the master esm for the worldspace? It may be only esp files referencing outside the limitation area that cause the bug, possible?

Oblivion didnt have the same problem so possibly this is a single line of code and a fairly easy fix, if willing.

His workaround is creating multiple worldspaces. Kinda works if you have clear provinces of 4 quads in width, but for a world like Mesogea or Middle Earth that's not an alternative.

My workaround is going to be a script that TCL's actors since that appear to fix the issue, but it will have to monitor additional stuff to make sure actors don't start levitating. I'm going to need additional SKSE functionality most likely, but if/when I have a reasonable workaround I'll make sure to share it.

You can try it ingame, go to the bugged area, spawn an actor, watch him glitch. Then TCL the actor through the console and get in a fight with him. The bug is fixed and nothing odd seems to happen, it's not like you can walk through him. If you push him over a cliff he won't fall though, that's why the script needs additional checks so it can toggle TCL on until the actor is done falling.

I'm not prepared to tcl actors - there's just so many other things that could affect - what happens when an object hits them, for instance? I'll give up and go to separate worldspaces - which isn't a work-around: it's a different mod.

http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1348275-gamebreaking-bug-for-worldspaces-bigger-than-4-quads-in-width/page__view__findpost__p__20321741 he'd tried merging a worldspace to skyrim.esm with no luck.

The same will happen as usual. It will only pass through the other if both colliding forms are TCL'ed. So NPC vs. NPC combat might occasionally have that issue, but since actors disable the NavMesh under them in general actors never try to walk through each other, but always walk around other actors.

But yeah, there will be side effects. I'll try to perfect the script over time so it can handle exceptional cases. I'd rather have an occasional collision glitch than butchering my project, MERP can't be divided over 4 separate worldspaces. For Tamriel provinces it will do, for Middle Earth it won't.

I have the same issue with Mesogea, to split the world into 4 quad blocks would mean a total overhaul of the map that even then isnt feasible. I cant imagine Middle earth having gateways between Arnor and Rohan, Rohan to Gondor etc.

So its down to two things:

The tcl workaround if everything else fails
primarily the hope that Bethesda will patch the issue. This will, unpopular to some that it may be, require us to keep the topic in view and regularly bumped, push it on twitter and keep reminding Gstaff. I am loathe to pester the admins though. The more people bring this issue to their attention however.....

Yeah the TCL script is an if-all-else-fails method for me as well. We should keep requesting a fix.

Also, by mere luck we already chose the first release are of Middle Earth as Rohan, which is in the centre and not affected by this bug. So even if the TCL fix doesn't work out at all, we can release one province of Middle Earth in full.

Yeah, we're a little luckier than you in that respect - we sort of started from the assumption we'd be building separate worldspaces but got talked into the single-worldspace idea by public opinion

Even though I seriously doubt I would ever be in a position to create a mod that would be affected by this bug, it seems to mean a lot to people who would probably help me with stupid questions in the future, and I need those stupid questions answered.

So bump for the devs, get on a fix!

Thanks SIckman, guaranteed one of us would try to help. No questions are stupid, just some of the answers

Ive just sent Gstaff a PM. Cant remember if Id already done that, so hopefully I didnt just troll the guy. oops.

Thanks. Don't want to troll, but the more the better.

As a non-modder, or at least someone who will never personally experience the bug, this is still of great importance to me because I was anticipating mod projects like Beyond Skyrim and MERP and would hate to see them carved up for no good reason.




Well, I did it right this time anyway.

MERP is going to get a new Skyrim ModDB page very soon... We could add that call for a twitter message on the main page. On the other hand, whenever we post an update we get like 12000 views on a day, so I'm somewhat afraid it would become more like a ddos attack in the form of twitter messages, which might actually have the opposite effect? I don't think they'd appreciate mass bombardment.

I don't know - it would certainly make the point. And if we got #SkyrimWorldspaceBug trending then the gaming press might pick it up....

Twitter's meant to be mass communication: it's not like we're advocating mass-pm'ing them. Which we're not, just for avoidance of doubt...!

As much as I know this bug severely hamstrings you guys in what you're doing, you have an acceptable workaround.

The one bug that, IMO, is far more insidious and has NO ACCEPTABLE WORKAROUND, affects you guys just as much, perhaps more, than the specific issue. Navmeshes. Even if all the noise yo make gets someone's attention on the dev team and they fix it, you guys need to navmesh all of your new material and once you realize how insidious THAT bug is, all of your efforts will have been entirely wasted.

None of your outdoor cells would work. None of your interiors. None of your caves, dungeons, and other stuff. Nothing. Converting your file into an ESM will not work to correct it. The game will simply ignore the changes instead and all your connective tissue between vanilla Tamriel and the expanded areas will be non-functional at the connection points.

So while I get the fact that you guys want this -64 thing fixed, it really would be of far greater benefit to everyone to concentrate the attention on the bug that affects the entire community across the board.

Appreciate your concern, Arthmoor, and you're right - except that Bethesda will have to fix the navmesh bug, precisely because there is no workaround, whereas they could easily sweep this one under the carpet. So we're trying to make a noise about an issue that stops us far sooner than navmesh undoubtedly will.

Sorry - we have our priorities too, and just as you can't continue without the navmesh fix, we can't even start without a verdict on the #SkyrimWorldspaceBug fix

It's not just me who's impacted by the navmesh bug. That affects literally anyone doing anything more substantial outdoors than small house mods.

Aye, that bug sounds more horrible. But at least that one is acknowledged by the devs already with a "we're looking into it" (or at least a team mate told me that). Plus because of a LOT of modders being affected by the NavMesh bug, they can't possible miss it's existence. This bug only affects a few mod teams, it's easily overlooked.

I absolutely agree - everyone is affected by navmesh: it must be fixed. But the worldspace bug will still cripple everyone who will still be modding large worldspaces long after all the excitement has died down and the devs have all been firmly directed away from post-launch support.