They put Movarth in the game, so any change to the vampires wasn't a matter of forgetting. One of the things I like about Skyrim was how much they did take from the books. The Wolf Queen, Ice Wraiths, Pelagius; it seemed like they scoured every book for every reference to Skyrim to see if they could fit it into the game somehow.

Another one I noticed recently:
Reminded me of Falkreath and Riverwood with the old Nordic ruins in the nearby mountains above the town.

Kurt Khulmann has been a writer since at least Redguard and is still there, and is still in touch with Michael Kirkbride who also wrote for Redguard and Morrowind (and continues writing stuff for the fun of it). Todd Howard also did some writing for Redguard and has been working on the series since Daggerfall. Bruce Nesmith has also been involved with things since Daggerfall (though I don't think he worked on Oblivion).

There's also a bunch of other people that have been with the series for a long time, and although they may not be writers, have had input into the world lore.

Yeah, it's old lore. It's perhaps one of the first books you'll find in Oblivion, period. For a quick in-game find, start a new Oblivion game. Get out of the sewers and cross the water to the ruins on the other side. Around the ruins (not inside of them) you'll find a small bandit camp with two bandits, a camp fire, bedrolls and some other things. This is where you'll find the book that mentions the Volikar.

There's also this one, from King Edward (a book that hasn't been seen since Daggerfall):

These threads are tiresome. If I get payed ten dollars for everyone of these threads... I'd be richer then Bill Gates.

HOLY CRAP, it doesn't fit lore, it dosen't fit lore, geez, What does it matter! The only book that mentions the volkihar vamps is an in-universe fiction called immortal blood, its about a vamp telling a vamp hunter how to kill rival clans of vamps.

I swear the tes fanbase is just about the whiniest "fans" of any series i've ever seen. Nothing the've shown contradicts lore, Infact skyrim puts out some stuff from the weird crap mk rights (the good weird crap imo). IF anything skyrim does an amazing job with the world and the lore without being boring to new players

I don't care enough about the lore, so I am unaffected.

Look how the lore, stories, wives tales, and history of Earth has changed in the past several thousand years or so.
Is it that strange that things first written about in the First Era are found to have been wrong, or changed, in the Fourth Era?

We're talking a time span of thousands of years here.

The changing of Lore is okay, as long as it doesn't go overboard...and nothing in TES games have done that so far.

what? Really? then you havent been on many gaming forums.
Like the halo community.Check out the forums..
the fans here seems to be actually the friendliest fan forums i ever been to. hehe.

but the lore is some of the most interesting things about TES

Exactly.

"generic fantasy stuff like vampires turning into bats?"

You DO know that vampires started out not in the fantasy genre, right? They're more gothic.

But, I have to start giving Beth credit and disagree. They've included tons of things from previous books; a game can change some lore now and then, to an extent.

Have people heard of the word retcon around here? (I wouldn't even call it that.)

Like how Cyrodiil was retconned from a jungle to a temperate forest/grassland?

From That Encyclopedia Everyone Plagiarizes From:


IMO Retcons aren't necessarily bad (I'm fairly forgiving about them in video games), but should be avoided.

Nope, they haven't lost it.

However, since they are the devs and the originators of the Lore, they are free to change it as they wish. As long as the DLC and the changes add to the depth of the Lore, then I have no problem with it even if they do have to retcon some of the Lore.

I just want it to be as deep as possible, even if some new stuff gets added in, I can be cool with that.

Not gonna lie, calling things cliche is starting to become cliche.

You should never avoid an idea simply because it's been done before. Standard fantasy in that of itself isn't a bad thing. The Elderscrolls contain elves, dragons, dwarves...kinda ayway, magic, and the like. Vampires turning into bats isn't going to push Skyrim over the cliche tipping point if it hasn't already. The reason most people, at least me myself, like the lore is that it's always just a little bit different than standard myth. There's depth to the ideas, even if the idea's themselves aren't revolutionary. So as long as there is depth to these vampires, which I'm guessing there will be based on how beth dlc has worked in the past, there's nothing to worry about.

And broseph27, technically the jungle was a retcon itself if you're going to get technical. Back in Arena, Cyrodil was a temporate forest if memory serves.

When i was playing arena it was snowing in vvardenfell. And there were forests there too.

Yeah and seeing it casually broken makes me am disapoint.

Guess we better wait and see, however if lore is fondled, eyes will be poked.

Touche. But my other points still stand!

What, would you rather have the stupid Twilight vampires we have now? Seriously, vampires dont [censored] sparkle! The game is always evolving and new lore is BOUND to come into play eventually, its not actual history, so its not written in stone. ITS A GAME.

It seems to me that Bethesday has jumped the ship in terms of lore with the Vampire Lords. Many people are saying that it is "no big deal" but I find it to be a more significant RETCON. Vampires in TES have never had wings nor have they ever been associated with bats. Others would argue the point that there are mant different types of Vampires that we have not seen. While this is indeed true, winged Vampires are kinda a huge thing to never have been seen or mentioned ever before. We know that the Vampiric disease changes the victim significantly with Vamp face, fangs and a variety of other abilities and traits depending on the strain but never such a dramatic structural change. The fact that some Vampires are even borne with levitation in their roster makes this change even more unlikely and needless. I have also heard these Vampire Lords being summed up as Ancient Vampires out of hybernation or something similar. The problem with that is we have actually read about and encountered Ancient Vampires in and out of the games. No wings. The JAM video is the first time TES Vampires have ever been associated with wings. Vampires were not "expanded", they were mutilated, this is why I name Vampire Lords RETCON. Of course we will have to wait until the DLC is realeased for the full story, though I'm perplexed as to why the decision has been made to go with these new Vampires when the Vampires already present in lore have not been touched on at all. There seems to be a lot going on behind the scenes concerning the Vampires of Skyrim and the Vampires of The Order, from Cyrodiil.

There are some on these forums saying that the lore belongs to Bethesda and they can change it if they want. They are right, Bethesda can do whatever they want with their product but they shouldn't just do anything that comes to mind, they should have integrity for their work and take the hard rode to write within the universe that many have called beautiful instead of going for the kewl factor. George Lucas thinks nothing of changing his works and see how people view him. I for one hold Bethesda to a higher standard. RETCONS are stupid and they severly cheapen the experience of that which they affect. There is a difference between "expanding" and mutilating.

bethesda does not follow their own lore in the slightest (before we knew they were volkihar it was ffitting a round peg [fakevampires] in a square hole [established lore], it was possible if you do it right, with what we can assume now it is attempting to fit a 3 inch circle [volkihar becoming like these fakevampires] into a 1 inch hole [the lore we already have on volkihar], totally impossible to do with satisfying results)

I was amazed at how much of the Skyrim lore they managed to get into the game, including lots of the more obscure forum dwelling stuff...as for Dawnguard I dunno, I never really followed the vampire lore that much, I'll just be glad for some fantastical crap involving Daedra.