I'm sorry guys. I can't even.....I can't even talk about how annoying this....I can't. I....I wont! Instead, I'm gonna use a quote from someone else who had the same problem as me. It's just...to annoying to talk about....

"I've killed Ulfric. The Rebellion is over. Butr I've always wondered, why are the leaders of the stormcloak camps around skyrim essential NPCs? Shouldn't they be killable after you've beaten the quest line?"

..........................[Warning! Psychotrip is about to enter a nerdrage, if you don't want to get caught up in his mindless rantings, skip to the last paragraph.]

Ok, I already made a topic a while back asking people what changes occur after the civil war. Short answer? Nothing. Ok, I was aggrivated, but I got over it, grit my teeth and fought for the glory of the empire. Now, after a pretty cool ending battle, I'm told by general Tulius to kill any remaining Stormcloaks. Meanwhile, Rikke is randomly talking to me every five seconds with her "what is it soldier?" crap even though I'm the same RANK as her now and we just WON A WAR together so I was hoping for a slightly different piece of dialogue than the one she greeted me with when we FIRST MET.

So, still trying to have fun, I svck it up and keep moving. A few days later, I come back to Windhelm to see all the copl changes that must be there! I wasn't expecting anything huge, mind you, but I was expecting different npc dialogue, discouraged Ulfirc supporters, the gray quarter looking a LITTLE less like a cesspit maybe? When I walked in I had a cool dialogue with a priestess of Talos, but then I hear good ol' Nills openly talking about decapitating an imperial guard when there's one right next to him! I was expecting his hatred of the empire to be a little more...discreet now? I leave Windhelm and notice thay virtually everyone is acting like Ulfric is still ALIVE, even Elisif who doesn't ever become high queen because the moot doesn't happen, so I'm left feeling like I hardly accomplished anything!!!!

But you know I could forgive all of that, ALL OF IT, if I could KILL THE STORMCLOAK CAPTAINS. I was told by my esteemed general to wipe out the remnants of the traitors, and Bethesda doesn't even bother to take off their essetial flags?!?!? I give up. I have lost all faith in video games. How is any of this acceptable? Granted, the civil war questline itself was AWESOME, but just like everything else in Skyrim, I'm left with a shallow aftertaste as I slowly realize my actions have no consequences, benefits or drawbacks beyond some pretty gear and guards with different uniforms. Please...someone....tell me I'm not the only one whose frustrated by this....

Same problem when you join the Stormcloaks and can wipe out the Empire encampments, but cannot kill the captains because they are labeled essential. I beleive this is an oversight on developers part. It should have been done to where once you reach the "point of no return" on either side, the NPCs of the oppisite side are no longer labeled essential.

Crazy thing I have seen is, dragons are able to kill essential characters but you cannot. Hmm....has anyone tried to summon your dragon friend on these encampments? Is he able to kill them?

I just can't piece together how they could have overlooked this.....I mean really.

welcome to skyrim where you are head of every major organization and yet your deeds have no lasting effect.

I've tried it, and it doesn't work. I watched for good 10 minutes as the dragon destroyed the captain every time he got up. Eventually I got bored and left. Wouldn't be surprised if they're still fighting...

....Anyone else find it sad that we're forced to resort to exploits to fix these mistakes?

Respawning of those camp leaders should have been very possible. I can only assume that the 'essential' leaders were from some idea that they left out for some reason

Nine nine nine!

Oh sorry Herman, I mean 11/11/11

I think Herman the German would rather say "nein nein nein", but then again, he served Uncle Sam during the war, in China, and his name wasn't even really Herman. But enough history nerdorama, it does stink that I dutifully wipe out Imperial camps (leaving the wounded alone of course- I'm proof that the Empire is wrong about us being lawless beasts, ect), only to have to pound down the Legate and then run away before he gets his wind back

I suspect the same. Same with the empty Thalmor headquarters. Same with the diplomatic path for Missing In Action.

For RPG purpose I just kill the normal soldiers and Rout the commanders. Cowardly commanders always run when they have no more bodies to throw at you.

Won't all of this be modable very soon?

You can simply open up console command, click at the Legate (or whatever the Stormcloak equivalent is), type this:

set essential to 0

Press enter, close the console command, and decapitate the bastard

No need to wait for mod, really.

True

I've been reluctant to do this for fear that they won't respawn

Yeah but for me at least I don't wanna open up the console everytime I want to do something that the game itself should have allowed me to do in the first place. I don't wanna think about the underlying code while I'm playing a roleplaying game.

Why should I rely on mods to bandage the devs mistakes??? I am so tired of heaeing this. What about the poor console gamers whose computers arent advanced enough to run skyrim as well as their xbox? Should they be forced to spent hundreds of dollars on a gaming PC to be graced with a game that works??

I was talking to Soltaro, who could've achieved the desirable effect without actually doing any "waiting around", should he actually want to do it. I wasn't not talking about fixing the game in general, that's Bethesda's job.

Because, if you're that irritated with the damn Legates, it's time to act. Bethesda should've allowed us to kill Delphine and Esbern (or at least tell them to f**k off our Temple) past a certain point, but they did not, so either you act by yourself or wait around until Bethesda programmers came down with a working patch

Looking at how Bethesda operates in the past, however, it's pretty unlikely. Even Blood on the Ice is still not fixed.

Sorry, I actually quoted the wrong person. Turns out what I thought you said was in the quoted box, and I just rushed to respond to it. Sorry about that. It's just that the general sentiment of "MODDERS WILL FIX IT GTFO" aggrivates me and appears on every page of every thread of this sort, and it gets old fast.

Aren't there mods that make everyone unessential?

Think nothing of it. While I'm lucky enough to be a PC owner, it does get me everytime we need to finish Bethesda's job. There are simply too many things left unattended, and it shouldn't have required hundreds of basically free labor to get what we should've gotten, especially when it's not a technical issue like hardware limitation

...........Maybe, but like I said: that's something the devs should fix and not third party modders. Anyway, I also agree about Delphine and Esbern. It's idiotic that you can't kill them. It's shameful really that they wouldn't even think to allow is to turn the tables on them. Want me to kill my dragon friend? Or you wont be my friends anymore? Yeah right! Screw you! I'm the dragonborn. This is MY temple anyway! My goodness. It's idiotic, baffling design choices like these that make me wonder where this industry is going.

I'm not really bothered by it because even though I'm level 55 I haven't advanced really far in the MQ or Civil war one. I'm just doing my own thing wondering about.
Also because I haven't yet used the console once I'm reluctant to start for such a trivial matter. Though when I need it to fix an obvious bug I won't hesitate, but reading up on many things before you undergo the quest helps preventing most bugs in the first place.



While I get your reason why it's annoying, you do have to realize that the forums basically consist of 50% whine threads (the other 50% praise threads ) about certain bugs and what kind of answers do you expect for Xbox/PS3 users? "Reload an earlier save" is about your only answer in many cases. Of course people are going to respond with fixes that involve the console because often it's the only way to really get the job done properly.






Well Raestloz already posted the simple console command for that. If you only need to do it once before the game starts then it's no problem. Selecting specific NPC's to remove their essential tag is more work and immersion breaking to do it yourself all the time during play, which is why a mod for that would be quite nice.

It's not the people giving advice that bothers me, it's the idea behind many of the comments. Thinking that it's ok to dish out a half finished game because modders can bandage it for the developers is absurd. I'm not talking specifically about you, but anyone who thinks this is an acceptable business practice, and any consumer who is fine with this.

I noticed this too, it is annoying, but, Its not game killing for me.

Yup, two mods that should make almost everyone unessiential, http://www.skyrimnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=2570 or http://www.skyrimnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4864 . Yeah the generals should have been unessential after the war, but they aren't so mods are needed.

Game breaking? Not at all.'Reflective of the overall shallowness and laziness of this game? Especiallymafter the other things I mentioned in the original post? Yes.