I'm sorry, but I think DA2 has more depth than BG even. /heresy i know

I mean, when it came to characters. Everything, not even close to a fraction. I'll agree there.

The whole game is more about working through friends problems than anything. It's hardly about being a hero. And not with too many soap opera moments either. The problems I encountered with my friends in that game were much like ones I've encountered in real life.

EH Throne of Baal had TONs more party interaction then DA2.

How do you separate the two? Storytelling is storytelling. I look at "story" as encompassing everything, including the contextual storytelling in the world.

Well... so did FF tactics.

I tend to think its a relatively simple equation, there is only so much time to develop a game after all.

Truly Open World - Character Build limitations - Quest linearity - Consequences for player + Enjoyment +/- Main Quest = Experience

The narrative involved in games can be a positive thing or a negative thing.

Sometimes it just gets in the way.

A minor gripe I had with MGS's gratuitous cutscenes.

I'm guessing you never had romance goign for Viconia, Jeheria AND Arie goign al lat the same time. you get TON's of back and forth there.


I'll elbow you in the ribs at this part, and jus tsay Branching quest wit hmultiple endings isn't "linear" and can still give the player C&C and be fun.



I want banter between companions on this level.

Not talking about the amount of interaction. I'm talking the subtle problems going on with them. Like Merrill's issues have a lot of depth. She reminds me of people I've tried to talk out of doing drugs. She has that same "invincible youth" syndrome. And you can choose to either be a hardass, or be what Alcoholics Anonymous calls an "enabler" by being nice to her. It hit close to home, for me at least. I've been a drug addict myself, and on both sides of the fence.

Well like I said BG had tones of that each character wasn't the same, that all had lots of stuff goign on too. Turning viconia away from the path of evil and gettign her to actually trust you. Helping Jeheria over come the loss of her husband and so forth Aerie lots her wings and cant return to her people and was a slave and so forth.

DA2 had some characters I liked (Merril was adorable she was the "Tali of DA2" and Varric was just awesome with his stories and manipulations. there was jus tmore in BG.

Varric is indeed awesome. He's at least 50% of why the game is considered good at all.

The whole mage-templar conflict had promise but was set up very poorly in DA2, where both factions are constrained by plot stupidity and given various forms of mania. I was so sick of it by act 2 that I can't even imagine playing another game with that as the conflict. Of course, I was dumb enough to have Fenris and Anders in my party. Act 3 just made me throw up my hands. *puh puh, begone foul memories*

Contrast to the civil war quest line in Skyrim, which has reasonable people with legitimate clashing interest on both sides, and just enough ambiguity to make a truly grey choice. And you can actually participate in a faction, although I would like to have seen more consequence.

Try playing it being a mage, you end up having to fight both sides anyway no matter who you are and wha tyou pick. XD

Not sure if you were friendly with Anders, but his rivalry personality was deep. Whether you let him go in the end or not, you get see how much he's losing himself better that way. It actually made me sad.

eh Anders was one I didn't like the way they made him, he went from a fairly cool mage and joke cracker in the expansion, and then he turned inot a gay cry baby in DA2. XD It was almost as if he was a totally different guy with the same name.

I will use a simple anology to compare the two:

It′s like comparing a football simulation (like FIFA) with a football management simulation (such as Football Manager). They are both about football, but involve completely different approaches as to what you need to do in order to win games.

Yeah Varric is 50% of why the game is good Merill is 50% reason why the game is bad it evens itself out.

DAO has a deeper more memorable story and characters then Skyrim period .So does DA2 , KOTOR, Mass Effect and Jade Empire for that matter. Bethesda just doesn't put the emphasis on story and characters that BioWare does, something they need to work on imo.

One thing Da's conflicts have going for it is that I don't feel limited or shoehorned into being one race or caring about one about the fate of one race (Nords). The civil war is too much with the damn Nords. It can't grab me from another angle, unless I focus on Nords. It's not general enough.

You could mention the Thalmor is a threat to everyone, and it is, but the game doesn't really address it. It's Stormcloaks vs the Empire, for all practical purposes.

there are very few things in which i can honestly say were completely different with one exception and this is one of them. the only way they are alike is that they are rpg's, even each games conception of what quests are different.

Chalk and cheese. Bioware games tell you a story, with branches. Elder scrolls give you a framework to tell your own story. To be perfectly honest, the best way to enjoy Bethesda games is to add a sprinkle of 'let's pretend' on top of what they give you. If you do that, and in a way it is doing some of the devs' jobs for them, no one comes close. Beth give you the worlds, Bioware give you an interactive movie with branches of your choosing. Let's be honest here, Bioware choices boil down to do this, or this, oh, you aren't a rogue, you missed out on that chest with a crap shield at level 30. Maybe I am in the minority here, but a linear world with anything lootable glowing, or the ability to ignore all the quests and still have fun, in a world in which you can pick up all the plates and cups; you can get the first anywhere, you only get the second from BGS. Anyway, hope everyone enjoys 'A' for awesome, story mode, and day one dlc and pre-order bonuses, I will enjoy BGS's playgrounds, while weeping for what DA3 might have been.

Assuming both are "RPG" movies.

In DA you are the main actor.
In Skyrim you are the main actor AND the director.

I agree with all of that.. TES is a kind of platform for your own story. But to add to my post above, this one is a bit more focused. Your dealt a pretty heavy hand on the Nord thing. I don't dislike it or anything. I have Nord characters. I just feel like the other characters are soulless. It's partly my own imagination's fault, and partly the setting. And it doesn't apply to every race btw. For some reason, I can build a good story and basis with a redguard, easier than I can with a Breton. Maybe because they already have a shared enemy and conflict. The only real nod to Bretons in this game are forsworn, and 1) they're not exactly Bretons and 2) helping them out is halfassed anyways.

I had an Altmer planned, stayed with the same character for 250+ hours. I was lucky, though, I had in mind an Alinor noble who rebelled against her father, when I found out the Thalmor were in-game, it was as though they had designed the game for me. I do agree to an extent, though. Oblivion, for all it's faults, is imo the ultimate 'playground' game, Skyrim requires a lot more player interpretation for some builds/backgrounds.
My main gripe with DA, if it was like mass effect, and you had a trilogy with your Warden, with saves carried over, they might have had a modern classic. Instead, someone came up with this refugee story, thought it was cool, and that's what we were stuck with. Why the hell did they think what works for ME wouldn't work for DA?

skyrim isn't JUST a first person RPG... you can go third person at will.

Skyrim has a playable catman. nuff said.

DA1 is nothing short at all... I sank so many hours into that game with all DLC. DA1 surpasses Skyrim easily in story and characters. I jsut care for it more in DA1. Skyrim on the other hand has great freedom, you got more freedom to choose how to play and it's much much bigger.

Especially with mods you can look exactly how you want. The combat is realtime though and might take some time getting used to but it's not hard at all. Set the game to easy and you dominate enemies with relative ease.

Play Skyrim for exploring a world with your character, play DA1 for a great storyexperience.
True