Ulfric isn't a good strategist. (possible spoilers) : V - Skyrim

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:53 pm

His business is the war, the only reason he was brought there. In no way was he involved with the Emperor's visit.

Just like if Obama went to Afghanistan, the Generals wouldn't be in charge of his safety.

Are you kidding me? Of course they would. Tullius is imperial governor. Governors are not just generals.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:33 am

When was he captured before?

The Dominion managed to catch him in the Great War.
He was arrested and thrown in jail after the Markarth Incident.
Tuliius caught and very nearly executed him.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:22 pm

When was he captured before?

By the Thalmor during the great war, and I've heard about 1 other time on the forum but since I haven't found proof of that I didn't officially say 3, either way though he's been captured at least twice.

Edit: Oh right Markarth. How'd he get out of that one? lol

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:13 am

Are you kidding me? Of course they would. Tullius is imperial governor. Governors are not just generals.

SECRET SERVICE. They are in direct contact with the President and they protect him. Just like how commander Marro was in charge of protecting the Emperor.

Of curse Tulius would send men to help out, but he's not the one coordinating the defenses, he's not the one in charge for it. That's why they had Marro..

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:53 pm

Tullius is the imperial governor in Skyrim. If your emperor is in town, it's your business.

Um, Tullius is not the Imperial Governor. He's just a general.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:27 am

Um, Tullius is not the Imperial Governor. He's just a general.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsRA5BG3N8E

Skip to 3:20

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:52 pm

With Ulfric holding onto Markarth he gains money, silver, and also keeps all that from the Legion. Ulfric can just ship the silver near Falkreath where there are Stormcloak sympathizers, up the mountains past Helgen, up to Ivarstead and then on to Windhelm. The Silver caravans would be VERY heavily guarded by mercenaries and Stormcloak soldiers. Forsworn may be barberians, but their not stupid. Even if Ulfric did not ship it out of Markarth, he can keep it out of Legion hands, while using the coin to hire mercs in the Reach to attack and harrass Legion forces and caravans leaving Soitude, and by doing that would deny the outlying Legion forces of reinforcements and supplies.

The Legion being in control of the Rift meanwhile would have very little advantages other than being close enough to use it as a staging area for an attack on Windhelm and being able to attack and harrass Stormcloak supply and reinforcement caravans. Riften is a highly corrupted city not unlike Markarth, but Riften has no economical value due to the Thieves guild being based there and bribable guards.

I'm not an Imperial sympathizer and think the war is stupid but I disagree with this.

How can he realistically ship it to Falkreath? The majority of Falkreath is either Neutral or pro Empire. Not to mention that the convoys would be so big that it would be pretty hard to sneak past them without the Legion noticing. All it would take is someone to warn the Legion and the convoy is done. Plus Falkreath+The Rift is a long march back to Windhelm. No matter how many soldiers or mercs Ulfric has to protect the convoys the Forsworn will attack them. The Forsworn wants their land to be theirs again. So they're not cowards and determined. Though it is true he may keep it out of Imperial hands but Ulfric will suffer more from lack of resources then the Empire will. Despite Tullius wanting the Silver.

Now it is true for the Legion controlling Riften but they have more advantages. The Rift Borders Cyrodiil. The Legion could easily send reinforcements from their and establish better communications with Solitude.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:01 am

Um, Tullius is not the Imperial Governor. He's just a general.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwuhVL1J1fQ

SECRET SERVICE. They are in direct contact with the President and they protect him. Just like how commander Marro was in charge of protecting the Emperor.

You think the Secret Service wouldn't coordinate with commanders on the ground while in hostile territory? Anyway, you're proving my point, which is that if all you care about is proving a bias, you can twist anything to make one side look good or bad. Ultimately, if Ulfric is such an ignoramus, it makes the empire look that much worse that he's able to bring the empire to a stalemate.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:51 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsRA5BG3N8E

Skip to 3:20

"Military governor."

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:06 am

This went from Ulfric being a bad tactician, to Tulius being incompetent?

There's a big difference between the two...

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:24 pm

"Military governor."

He's an Imperial Military Govenor.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:25 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsRA5BG3N8E

Skip to 3:20

It's Military Governor Not an Actual governor. A military governor is just a commander of a groups of soldiers within a region. So Tullius only has the power to use the Legion and the militia of supporting holds. So he dosen't have the responsibility of protecting Titus Mede then say an actual governor. Who would be Elisif more or less but some couls argue she's a puppet thus handing the responsibility of Mede's safety to Maro.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:29 pm

It's Military Governor Not an Actual governor. A military governor is just a commander of a groups of soldiers within a region. So Tullius only has the power to use the Legion and the militia of supporting holds. So he dosen't have the responsibility of protecting Titus Mede then say and actual governor. Who would be Elisif more or less but some couls argue she's a puppet thus handing the responsibility of Mede's safety to Maro.

Exactly, the question is on who's responsibility it was to protect the emperor, and it most certainly wasn't Tulius'.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:19 pm

He's an Imperial Military Govenor.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:37 am

Well the Empire can't even protect their own leader. Why would i support them. :biggrin:

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:30 am

Just out of curiosity, just what sort of manpower does the Stormcloaks have?

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:48 pm

Well the Empire can't even protect their own leader. Why would i support them. :biggrin:

If I'd been asked to assassinate Ulfric, he'd be dead, too.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:53 pm

Well the Empire can't even protect their own leader. Why would i support them. :biggrin:

I'm pretty sure if someone put a hit on anyone, the DB can get to them. That's the whole point of the DB.

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:14 pm

It's Military Governor Not an Actual governor.

Because Skyrim is under martial law. I've never heard of a military rank called Governor. That's why he can order executions even of private citizens.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:08 am

If I'd been asked to assassinate Ulfric, he'd be dead, too.

But then all i would hear around Skyrim would be, "Did you hear Ulfric killed an assassin, with his VOICE! Shouted him apart!" :banana:

» Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:22 pm

Why are we debating on if Tulius is at fault? He ISN'T.

Do none of you remember Commander Marro???

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:14 am

Why are we debating on if Tulius is at fault? He ISN'T.

Do none of you remember Commander Marro???

Because the buck ultimately stops with him, and if you're going to make arguments that Ulfric is a bad strategist because he was ambushed, Tullius allowing the freaking emperor to die while on his watch is a pretty big fail.

My original point is that I would never use such a silly argument.

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:49 am

But then all i would hear around Skyrim would be, "Did you hear Ulfric killed an assassin, with his VOICE! Shouted him apart!" :banana:

Except I'm not some young whelp like Torygg. I have a Thu'um of my own. And mine is stronger. As evidenced by when I kill him after he loses the war. :biggrin:

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 4:44 am

Except I'm not some young whelp like Torygg. I have a Thu'um of my own. And mine is stronger. As evidenced by when I kill him after he loses the war. :biggrin:

Touche! I'm glad you took that as a joke as well. :cool:

» Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:29 am

Because the buck ultimately stops with him, and if you're going to make arguments that Ulfric is a bad strategist because he was ambushed, Tullius allowing the freaking emperor to die while on his watch is a pretty big fail.

My original point is that I would never use such a silly argument.

It WASN'T his watch, he was never ordered to watch the Emperor. Could you imagine the emperor telling him "Oh hey Tulius, I know you're busy with the Stormcloaks, Dragons, and Dragonborn, but can you protect me personally too?..."

No, because Tulius' main objective is to win the war.