Wiping out the Dark Brotherhood just feels so pointless, No-one will notice they're gone, they live in a cave and nobody even knows they're there!

Now taking out the Theives Guild and that cow "oooh im immortal you can't touch meee" Maven, thats a job worth doing!

Just break in and kill everyone you can. Assuming you can get into their den without joining.

I too was disappointed when I figured out you could not take down the thieves guild, and I play a sneaky backstabbing Khajiit who couldn't wait to join the guild! But, not being able to take the thieves guild down (especially after all the hints you get in Riften that there may be a quest for that) was a huge disappointment for me.

If it were possible to take them down, that would make building them up so much more rewarding for my sneaky Khajiit because it would be my choice whether to help them or destroy them, and that is what Bethesda games are suppsoed to be all about right, giving the player as many choices as possible about how to play the game?

Skyrim has the whole civil war quest where the player can choose which side to fight for, why not do the same thing with the thieves guild? Hopefully there will be a DLC that allows players to fight on the side of good and light and clean up Rifton and all.

Heck, I might even have to start up some kind of good guy character just to see how that would play out. It's good to RP different characters now and then.

ah i like the dark brotherhood! Yes they kill, but they normaly kill people who deserve it anyway! at least there is some honor to their profession. The theives are just scumbags!

These essential NPCs are making me very impatient for the CK. Once it's released someone will make a "Destroy the Thieves Guild" mod.

LOL!! @ GT409, that signature is genious!

*genius. Pet peeve, don't mind me.

While were on this topic of essential npcs, why can't we clear the Imperial or Stormcloak camps?

Yeah, agreed. My regular hero would go through these scum like a knife through butter, just to clean the place up a little.

If it wasn't bad enough, the MQ actually strongly leads the PC into joining the guild, with all dialogue options meekly bending to the will of that sleazy little merchant guy.

This time around they're an actual criminal organization, like a mafia, which is what everyone wanted after the fruity little Robin Hood thieves in Oblivion. How do you even build a group of criminals that steal things from other people into something more "nice"? Furthermore, why would you even want to?

The problem with the Thieves' Guild is that I joined the guild to steal. Apparently though, Bethesda thought that when I joined the Thieves' Guild that I wanted to be a thug who threatened to kill peoples' families, beat them to a bloody pulp, destroyed their prized possessions in front of them, ruined peoples' business and put them in jail for life, and killed people with reckless abandon. There's no fun in stealing if you can just kill everyone around you and then take the object. It's stupid. Oblivion's Thieves' Guild was the most fun to me because it was really a challenge, and you had to think about how to go about doing anything. In this guild you can just kill everyone. In fact, the quests are designed to make you do that. It's stupid.

You still don't have to join. You can still get to the location and talk to Esbern without ever talking to Brynjolf or deal with the guild in anyway

Me and my budy Mjoll "cleaned" Riften, with the help of a certain mod the lifts the essential flags.

Doesn't help people on consoles. The best I could do is start a fight in the ratway pub, lure them to the secret closet door, and knock them into it. That opened up the secret thieves guild, and every character inside can be killed except for Mercer. All in all, I probably wiped out 60% of the thieves guild. They don't react to it, and it doesn't make a difference, but my "good" character go on believing that she sent a loud message.

Literally never killed a single person while doing a Thieves Guild quest. Ever.

And they should make it so you shouldn't, that you fail each quest if you do, in my opinion.

Well that's not very "open world" now is it?

I joined for the same reason thinking it could be fun to sneak around and steal things as part of a quest line. But I seemed to spend most of my time threatening and killing people. After a quest breaking bug, I reverted to before I joined.

Now I just want DLC to take them down and clean up Riften.

I suppose I'm the only one who finds the whole concept of "Skyrim FORCES me to do this, so my solution to the problem is proposing that Skyrim FORCES me to do that" completely laughable?

Rather than "Destroy" it should be more like "Bring the Thieves Guild to Justice!"

Personally, I would like this option as well.. That way if you needed their help for certain quests you could visit them in jail. I didn't care for the thieves guild quest line, and I've avoided it on all my characters since my first one so an alternative would be nice.

I not only want to off Maven.... I want to off her good friend Lilith too.

Since this is the spoilers section , I'm just gonna say it.I played a good guy , it svcked everything was a little bit harder to do. I chose to go imperial with that one , seemed like the good guy thing , I get back to riften and guess who the new yarl is? MAVENS SITTING THERE WITH HER SPOILED BRAT KID AS STEWARD.

Oh but hey be a bad guy and you're rewarded with being able to stel,cheat, slimeball your way into and out of EVERYTHING in the game.And to add to this , there's absolutely no recogntion or reward for being an upstanding Thane of your community , nothing you do has weight , but if you're just really bad with everything you get more stuff and the same titles no matter what as long as you pay the occasional fine?I do hope this bethesda didn't outsource the making of this game to life behind bars prisoners , because it has that feel to it.But it's only one of many failings in the story and yes , meeting Mjoll for the first tiem you really get the feeling that she's almost beaten and tired and just needs some help.

SO yeah you can be a complete scumbag , do a little quest for Mjoll , be the guild master of the TG and marry her.It's like some sadistic almost-pedophile Hannibal Lector was overseeing the story lines for this game.The more I read the more I feel more justified that I would for once in a game like to consider myself truly good.But no , apparently society in general wants to really be murderers and theives that get fame and fortune with almost no consequences , in a game touted as having consequences.

Yeah , there's consequences in this game , just TRY playing a totally good character.The game is much shorter with way less for you to do.Oh and everybody will totally ignore you do anything good and still taunt you.Like I said great game I really like it , except for the story writing.I'm beginning to feel like the story was written by computer geeks that never actually interact with anybody outside their.......... OWAIT NEVERMIND.Steal , cheat and murder your way to the top , besides the best artifacts and some armor and cool stuff you have to do some REALLY low crap to get.There's no opposite comparable quest line for some of it.And for the love of god! Every single guard in the game knows you're carrying around azuras' star except Boethiah?!I went to that shrine trying to get to a mine for ebony , and there were these bastards fighting each other and her shrine so I killed them all because I didn't like what they were selling , only to have the god pop up with an evil proposition , would it have been an incredibly huge leap of imagination when my champion of good and order stumbled across these evil people and shrine to maybe oh , I dunno , have azura my Patron pop up and give me a proposition to wipe them out and destroy the shrine in some epic battle for a piece of armor equating to the opposite of the ebony mail?Noooooo we can't do that we're too busy rendering ANTS ON STUFF.

It comes down to this I just want to stop the Thieves Guild in Riftin...just Riftin. Also, I would be happy for any number of quests that would either build them up or break them down. I would be perfectly happy to merely increase, reduce, or leave their influence the same. But I want to do something so that the people of Riften Please continue, my good sir..

The PROBLEM is the NPCs use dialogue to say, "This is terrible, this is horrible, we need to clear them out..." but then the game does nothing about that. It could be DLC...in fact give the dialogue people use in Riften it seems like it will be DLC.

It sticks in my craw that there WAS or WILL BE a mission in there that is alluded to in 10 ft tall letters that they have either abandoned or left out. It is a glaringly obvious mission that they leave undone.

Just dont join them. It wont actually take them down but you wont hear anything about them unless you go into riften and realistically they would be gone within 2 months because of whats going on down there

That sounds like too much work for beth.