Wait a second? Is this thread discussing a mod?

Reported. Next time post personal opinions in the general or spoiler forum. Damn it deeps good to be back!

On topic....
It's utterly hilarious to hear someone say acrobatics is not needed as a skill, then later in the same statement suggest combining Smithing and lockpicking. I think some people are better suited for playing games, rather than brainstorming ideas for them. In not trying to be a dike, but I think you are terribly incorrect in both suggestions.

Combining sneak and pickpocketing is more on the right track, as I see it senseless for there to be a stand alone pick pocket skill. But thats just me.

Perhaps I am the one who should stick to simply playing over brainstorming.

So what you are saying is that it is not acceptable to discuss the scope of a mod or what kind of mod one should make?

What exactly is unacceptable again.

Topics in the modding forum don't need to concern themselves with specific mods. Just wait until someone fires up the unofficial "character screenshots" thread like they had for Morrowind and Oblivion - it was always in the modding forum and had little to do with specific mods. That should really have you seeing red.

I think Acrobatics should be in but not as a separate skill. It should be part of a larger skill called Survival which also includes Athletics, cooking, tracking, sleeping and other perks. Lockpicking and pickpocketing should be combined to make room for this skill, which would fall under the Thief archetype.

This mod would, of course, be perfectly matched with a "basic needs" mod to make the perks more relevant and useful.

Certainly the only one in the Mods forum.

i wants spell making

Looking forward to your mod Imp! CK can't come early enough.

But why the need for two bars? Long term stamina seems to me to be represented well enough by max stamina (reduced by exertion, recoverable by rest, etc) and short term by available stamina.

(Btw, what happened to your avatar? )

@Jebach
I agree that unbalancing by spamming can be mitigated by a little self control but somewhat limiting that by my attrition idea is just an incidental effect. My real aim was to make every activity affect the player even in just a small way and giving more choices (mana fatigue for healing, etc). Goodness knows we need more C&C in this game, if not on a world level, then at least on a character level.

I almost reported the thread too, just because it's so inflammatory in nature.

We don't need people saying "I don't want mods to do X or Y" and "Modders shouldn't do X or Y, because I don't like it."

Now, actual brainstorming and looking for ideas, that's fine. But there's really no need to be an ass, and come in here guns blazing telling people what they should and shouldn't make.

It's the same as coming in here and being utterly demanding that someone should make exactly what YOU want for a mod, and being all demanding about it. Nobody is going to react well in either case.

My basic concept for an athletics skill (which would actually combine athletics and acrobatics) would level on a system similar to how many spells now work: only in-combat uses count, and moreover, only uses which actually cost stamina would count... so jumping, at least regular jumping, would not add to the skill, and neither would running, as both cost no stamina. The skill itself would improve in three ways:

1. Sprinting in combat.
2. Acrobatic Stunts in combat (see below).
3. Successfully climbing a surface you've never climbed before (see below).

There are a few types of acrobatic stunts, all made available with an early (level 20? 30?) feat, possibly two. One type is a mid-air flip, accomplished simply by pressing jump a second time while already jumping, which lifts your feet into the air, giving you more clearance. In effect, this is a "double jump" though you aren't actually jumping off of anything. This will give you the extra height you need to clear an opponent's head to land behind him, for example, or land on a ledge you might have otherwise missed. The other types are the side-roll and the back-roll, which are executed by tapping sprint while holding back or to one side, a stunt which will allow you to dodge melee attacks.

Climbing would be something of a minigame: upon finding a climbable surface and hitting the "use" button, you sheathe your weapons and begin to climb. Using your right and left hand buttons you select handholds leading you up towards the top. Handholds are unevenly spaced, and correctly choosing the sequence with which you choose your handholds is the major challenge: if you ignore a handhold low and to your right in favor of a handhold higher up, you may find the higher handhold doesn't lead to another, and you've hit a dead end, while the lower handhold had another close beside it that lead to a more navigable path. You have a ticking clock, as well: your stamina bar will slowly deplete as you cling to the wall, and reaching for a new handhold will cost additional stamina. If you run out of stamina, you fall. If you try for a handhold you cannot reach, you catch yourself on your last handhold but expend additional stamina for the error. Climbable surfaces are labeled novice, apprentice, adept, expert, and master, based on their difficulty. Once you've successfully navigated a climb, you gain an amount of exp depending on the difficulty of the climb, and that climb is mastered: you climb it automatically without need for the minigame from then on, but receive no additional experience for doing so.

Climbing would act sort of like lockpicking in terms of gameplay and the narrative: it will allow you to access shortcuts and exclusive areas, even allowing an alternative means of entering homes via upper-story balconies and chimneys. It would make clearing mountains less of a hassle as well, and provide an alternative means of getting to locations like, for example, High-Hrothgar. Also, ways to enter cities beside the main gates by climbing over the walls. Climbable surfaces may include protruding bricks or masonry on a building, stones jutting from a cliff, vines or ivy hanging from a terrace, or the branches of a tree.

Perks for the tree might include an increased chance of a critical strike after an acrobatic stunt, with a unique kill animation, the ability to jump while sprinting for a long-jump, the ability to attack while jumping, the ability to attack while swimming, the ability to divert falling damage to stamina instead of HP, greater reach for handholds when climbing (eventually allowing you to literally leap from handhold to handhold), better sprinting speed, and so forth.

Levels in the skill itself would simply allow for greater stamina-efficiency for sprinting, climbing, and acrobatic stunts. The most basic, bottom level multi-tiered perk would be where you'd get more jump height and better movespeed.

No, that is not what I said nor meant.

The op does not even mention modding or mods. It literally has nothing to do with creating or discussing mods, and doesn't even mention it. It's an opinion. If we all post in each forum sub type describing our personal opinions of the game, this forum will fall in to complete and utter dismay. It will become a complete trash fest.....

Oh wait. Who am I kidding. Continue.
I forgot this was the skyrim forums

Climb to what exactly? All the places that can be accessed can be accessed by roads anyway.

Do you guys mean like climb a wall in a dungeon. That will expose all the unfinished meshes (that lack a top for instance)

and myself I appreciate threads like this. By already being a bit off there is chance for more freedom in exchange. This forum needs http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,156484.msg3761695.html#msg3761695 ... though I suspect it would never survive. On Taleworlds Tha Thread was a kind of catchall thread for everything off topic.

[edit] moved to the general forum ... good bye thread.

I just see no point in a topic that says "there is no point for this in the game"

It's not a suggestion. It's not a solution. It doesn't have anything to do with or relate to any current mods. It simply says I dont like this, and i dont want it. It doesn't even mention being pointless to mod it in to the game. The op simply says the game doesnt need this.

We can sit here all day and post things that shouldnt be mods....not sure what benefit thay serves but hell lets go for it. But if none of us so much as mention the word modding it simply does not being here.

We definitely need acrobatics in vanilla Skyrim. It adds play style and build RP potential. There's a console command to raise acrobatics, and Ive been using it on my appropriate RPs. Its excellent. Making a quick escape on the rooftops is as amazing as its ever been. Just need to mod in acrobatics fall resistance appropriate to a hypothetical "level".

Some would simply be shortcuts: High-Hrothgar is the best example of this, I think. Same with all the times you need to get to the other side of a mountain range and struggle to find a path. When/if i work on the mod I would also add exclusive areas, places you can't easily get to without climbing, just as there are places you can't get to without lockpicking. There are many dungeons where the "secret way out after the boss" is simply a drop: in some of these cases, I'd add a climbable (if difficult) surface allowing a deft athlete to skip to the end of a dungeon (just as a character with high speech can skip over entire chunks of some quests)

As for areas not meant to be seen, these aren't actually very common. In the case of walled cities, the climbs onto their walls would actually be zoning points: once you've navigated the climb, you go to a loading scree and appear in the city atop its wall. For other areas, part of the labor involved in making the mod would be fixing these areas up to make sure they look presentable at any hight you can climb to. Keep in mind, at least with my concept, climbing is not available on any surface in the world: I, the modder, would place these surfaces in the various maps and dungeons, so I'd be able to make sure none of the areas accessed would cause an issue.

double post

We don't necessarily need acrobatics however it would have been nice if they had added some sort of climbing skill to the game that could have incorportated acrobatics with athletics. I think this skill should determine just how high you can climb up into mountains. Avalanches would have been cool too and should occur based on your skill at climbing. A survival skill should also have been included and the cold weather should effect players who pay no attention to the survival skill. In the end, these will be modded into my game so I won't complain much but still, it would have added good flavour for the setting had they been included in the original game.

We need acrobatics. Fortunately there is a console command to add it back in. Although you have to do it every time you reload.

For realism's sake I guess, in reality even aerobic excersizes tire you out eventually. It'd take some research, and a bunch of play testing, to see if they were necessary and, if so, how best to implement them. The more important part for the stamina component is the threshold value, the number that determines whether an action is going to wipe you out in a few seconds, or be something you could do all day. Here's are some examples of how I'd want the different values to come into play:

1. You run from Whiterun to High Hrothgar, and have to battle a frost troll along the way. With a stamina bar, you might actually be tired from the run and have some actions, like dodging, become unavailable, encouraging you to travel by horse.

2. You're a two handed warrior. In your inventory are a 28 pound Daedric warhammer and a 16 pound elven greatsword. You can do about 10 power attacks with the greatsword before you've depleted your power bar, but only 2 with the Daedric warhammer. As you become stronger though the warhammer becomes more viable, until eventually you abandon it for a giant's club.

3. You're about to dive into your fourth dungeon of the day, but instead decide to set camp and wait for the morning, because attenuation has caused your stamina and power bars to dwindle to a quarter their usual size.



I was away from these forums for a while, I think they changed the way the pics were handled (didn't you have to host the files yourself at one point?) Anyway, fixed it.

Because as a thief it's incredibly fun to actually be able to jump over fences, run really fast, be able to jump down off of bridges and other long falls without taking major damage. Gimping everyone's movement speed, carry capacity, fall amount, jump height was a horrible design decision, while wasting perk trees on lockpicking and pickpocketing was too. Making long jumps from clifffs or houses was always fun too. I'd assassinate targets from roof tops or ledges nobody could reach, it was fun and felt right.

I can get by without acrobatics, but really it severely limits "be who you want" like they advertised. They ruined horses, so it would be nice to be able to at least run really fast, without having to spend all your points on stamina.

While I never particularly liked acrobatics, it would be nice to have a lot more skills than we currently have. If it had some cool perks and the game had areas where it required high acrobatics to reach, it could be quite useful and fun. It would be especially useful if the height that you got fall damage from was severely lowered.

Do you hate on this game 24/7? Every post I have read from you seems very negative and it seems like you post about 50 times or more throughout the day. Your life must svck.

A fan of the series can criticize. When I lose build types, I'm not happy. I'll voice my opinion with the power of logos on my side.

Im a fan of the series too, all my build types still exist in Skyrim. I can play a Bard, a Healer, an agent, an assassin, barbarian, warrior, mage, spellsword, mercenary, rogue, thief, dark knight, murderer, paladin, cleric, etc. I could probably name off about another 20 unique builds but no point to it.

Your cynicism has probably blinded you. Maybe you should take a few years off from gaming and try again with a new attitude.

Nope, I miss the builds that are no longer there. Coupled with spell creation, Skyrim has been limited. Ad Ive posted my positives right along with my negatives, but on the whole, I feel like the series is headed in the wrong direction. Thank god for mods. Although I want all option for all people on all platforms.

who in their right mind would think knowing ow to fall and jump whiel trying to traverse a mountain (which is vertical) or revine or something along those lines. i ound many times it would be useful, and it is the most fun skill. not to mention i have found a lot of places i could have used it in