This is meta-gaming. This is the opposite of the way some of us like to play. As a roleplayer, I don't want to be required to look up information on the internet to figure out some devious little work-around in a desperate attempt to avoid being railroaded into joining a faction that my character would never join. The game should provide options to my character in-game, if options are available.

Most of you are missing Blade Watcher's point. If one plays the main quest normally, one is extremely likely to become a member of the mages guild. This is unacceptable.

Meh, I was bothered a bit that everyone started with a Flame and Healing spell, it's kind of hard to restrain yourself from using them in the beginning if your given the choice to use them.
I much preferred making a class in the beginning and sticking to it like Morrowind and Oblivion,
It never really bothered anyone that they had to restart if they changed their mind about their skills, Not like they really had anyone to blame for their choice o.o

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought there was an option to gain entry to the college by using a dragon shout and you could attend the class and RP that they taught you to use a ward spell if you decided to take the class.

Double post sorry

The game isn't meant to be completed. It's meant to be explored. You don't need to read game guides or look up work arounds if you explore and find things out for yourself.

Kind of funny really, how some of the same people who complain about 'hand holding' and 'dumbing down' don't find other things out for themselves.

Not if you use the back door Though you do own the room in the College from the start


Not enough quest markers

I"m the same way. If I make a warrior, I don't want anything to do with Magic. But at the end of the day, it's really not that big of a deal. The game's not ruined. It's a very small minor detail in a gigantic game. It's amazing how so many people critique this game, write essays on how horrible it is, ridicule it, yet everyone still plays it.

Another pathetic whiner who feels "forced" into something.

OP... do you realize that everything you do beyond the Helgen Castle is a choice? A choice that you make. A conscious decision, made by you to do... or not do... something.

Forced?

Pathetic.

I have no problem joining the mage college for main quest.

But i thought the same too when i proceed MQ, i wish they give me an option to just walk in the library and gain information. It is non sense if you wish to talk to somebody in a college and you got to take a course before you can enter.

A. You're not forced to do the Mage College quests.

B. It's a MAGE COLLEGE. What kind of college would they be if they let you participate without ever touching on the curriculum?

Theres two starting spells because because theyre thought of as such basic low level spells any moron would know how to cast them... Even a pure barbarian... They would just choose not to, like i have chosen. Flames and healing in the ES universe would be like riding a bike in the real world. Pretty much everyone knows how to, some just dont do it

You can proceed directly to Septimus Signus' Outpost without taking a single step into Colleage of Winterhold. Let me be clearer, you can complete the main quest without ever obtaining the COW POI.

Let's think about this for a moment.
Most colleges don't let you use their resources unless you're a member, and they don't let you become a member unless you display at least a little knowledge/aptitude. I don't even see how this is an issue, the way the game has it set up just makes sense. All you have to do is show that you're capable of performing a spell, you never have to use it in battle and you never have to go near the college again.

Well, please tell me which college need you to apply a course before you can enter and talk to somebody in real world? It just doesn't make sense.

It is weird when you encounter the girl at the entrance, you are missing an option to say, "I am here to talk to..." "oh you are not going to join the college? You may enter but don't do anything stupid!" or "you are not allowed to enter even just talk to somebody if you are not a college student..." That's all I am asking, I am fine if it require to join Mage college for MQ, but it don't make sense what happened on the entrance if you are going to do the MQ
only.

Oh god...

Ladies and gentlemen! We have now offiacially reached the point where the hardcoe RP guys, who are always complaining about hand holding in games, need big glowing quest markers themselves to find an alternative entrance. It seems like 2012 will be the end of the world after all.

Seriously, what kinds of warriors do you guys RP? Does a nord warrior have to do everything some [censored] tells him to? It's not really "in character" for me if you do everything people tell you to. If I'm at the same bus station as you and ask you for cigarettes, you won't run to the next store and buy a pack for me, do you?

You don't need it either. If you don't want to do something in the game, just don't do it. The solution is inside the game itself, no need to use tricks. Generally you just have to look better or to talk to people. The op doesn't need to become a member of the College, he just have to explore a bit further and find another way inside. That's it.

Judging from quests and loot it seems that mage is clearly a class more favoured. Most of the loot are mage robes and not nice armor for melee, and most of the weapons are staffs. I have lost count on how many robes and staffs I found in chests. And like you said, the part of the the mq where you have to join the college is irritarting, because even if you can enter without having to cast a spell, you still get the quests of talking to someone who will show you around. And there are way to many quests focused on mages too, the quest Lost Legends for example can't be finished unless you are a mage.

You don't get it, it is just plain stupid when you are looking for some guy inside a building, you are not given an option to tell the girl you are there not for joining college but wanna to meet someone instead. Why would I need to hide my intention but to sneak my way into the college instead?

I didn't mind that I had to pass some stupid little magic test to enter the building to talk to the librarian, I just shouted the blizzard away, it was pretty epic.

I was bothered by the fact that all of the guards in Skyrim thought that I was a wizard, or "that one from the college" when in truth, I had probably spent at most 2 hours (in-game time) at the College of Winterhold.

All I did was talk to the librarian. I didn't do any quests for the college, and yet, as far as the game was concerned, I was a wizard.

On the topic of going directly to Septimus: Why would I do that? As far as I was concerned I was travelling to the mages college to get advice or to learn about where to find an Elder Scroll, I didn't know that there was some kook out in the ocean who happened to be an expert on the matter. Also, you shouldn't have to join the college to speak to it's members. If I wanted to discuss something with a professor, I would probably send him a message requesting that we meet over coffee or something, to discuss whatever topic it was I was interested in. I would also indicate generally to what ends my research was for, in an attempt to convince him/her that I was worth their time.

One spell doesn't make you a mage.

and the Oscar for whiniest SOB on the internet goes to...

It's not because a spell or what to make yourself a Mage, it's because the game consider you joined the Mage college and people around you think you are Mage.

If continue the MQ got to be an official college Mage, fine, just tell me to join in the quest log! Otherwise, I really want an option or another lead to follow in stead of enter the college.

If you want to do the Legend of Gauldar you do.



Long story short, there were quite a few things I felt forced into doing in the game.
So I feel ya, OP.

Boo on those within this thread who are being downright rude.

I was just about to post a very similar thing.

As I tihnk about it, I've found that in both OB and Skyrim I've done less "thinking around" an issue, less trying out different ways of doing a quest, and more doing the straight path... maybe that's more about having less time now thant I did when I played Morrowind, than it does game design.

Just read through this thread and I have to wonder... at first I thought this board was very civil. Did I just arrive during a chilled out week or something?


In terms of not being told by the game that it can be done a different way: the thing is in a lot of quests the only way to do it is to do exactly what you are told. There's no real indication of which quests want you to think outside the box. If I am playing a game in which I'm given hardly any hints throughout the entirety of it then I will investigate and attempt lots of variations. However, if I'm pretty much told what to do for most missions then I'm going to subconsciously expect the same from every quest. I've had to remind myself to poke about with each quest to make sure I'm not missing something. I think it is pretty natural to imagine that quests work the same as each other in basic mechanics. My vocabulary died halfway through this paragraph so if I'm using the wrong words then forgive me.


Also, town guards commenting on you being from the college when you only visited very briefly is a valid complaint in my eyes. Yes, you can ignore it when the game is being ditsy but I don't think it is unreasonable to be annoyed at it.