Oh, be still my heart - that could be the most awesome game ever if someone could be trusted to do it proper justice.

(I'm still waiting for my turn-based Car Wars open-world RPG, though...)

I'm not sure where you're getting the "any normal person" bit, since that's more or less the only thing I ever see anyone mean when they say "mature." It's hardly a conceit of CDProjekt alone.

yeah, CDProjekt red has to be one of my favorite game companies out there. They put lots of care into their games and remove all forms of DRM from them

I actually wouldn't agree with you there, while they do include nudity in their games, the whole part of it which really makes it mature is the use and understanding of politics you must have. Games like the Witcher expects you to AT LEAST be mildly intelligent when making decisions. Their games don't ALL have to do with teenage six fantasies.

I suppose you've got a point, now that people are co-opting the entertainment industry's standards for "maturity". ("Oh, you're 30? Sorry, babe. You're too 'mature' for the role.")


I somewhat agree with you here, but the "mature" aspects are really rather basic. It's nothing someone in their late teens or older would be wowed by.

It's like the difference between ... Terry Goodkind books and Robert Jordan books. (I'm not bringing George R R Martin into this, because I have no illusions about having that level of complexity in a video game for the foreseeable future.)

Bioware is Terry Goodkind, and CDPR is somewhere between Terry Goodkind and Robert Jordan. (George R R Martin won't yet exist for at least a decade.)

If they use Cyberpunk 2020's rule system (which system I hope has some kind of alley for finesse and diplomacy; can anyone verify this?) and spirit, then they might just be able to graduate to Robert Jordan status. But I'm not holding my breath, since, you know, CDPR seems to like the level of "maturity" it's at.

Which level of "maturity" is, as I said, dandy; but, again, it's not really "mature".

P.S. Hopefully that anology illuminated more than it confused.

Woo an RPG that isn't some generic magic fantasy bs.

I think Witcher 2 surpassed Martin a long time ago. He made it clear there would be no happy ending. It's just meaningless conflict ending violently as Rorsarch might put it. Why watch the spectacle when everyone knows the end? Why get attached to these characters when you know he'll force you to say goodbye to all of them. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DarknessInducedAudienceApathy sums it up well.

Heh, when you put it that way, The Witcher games are kind of the anti-Martin, considering it seems that their express purpose is to undo the incredibly bleak ending of the books.

I haven't finished The Witcher yet (too many games this year, not enough time to catch up on my backlog.) But isn't focusing on the game's six cards and such (ie, "teenage maturity,") kind of missing the point of what people are actually talking about when they consider the game to be "mature" in a more meaningful way? Because I thought the choices and consequences I've seen thus far in my playing of the game were really quite thought-provoking; and at least a refreshing departure from the standard "this is the good choice, this is the arbitrarily evil choice" binary decisions that you tend to see in RPGs these days.

I mean, I like to think I'm a pretty "mature" person (and really now - Robert Jordan wasn't bringing anything to the table that I couldn't cope with as a young teenager when I first read them.) But that doesn't mean that I'm above a little bit of T&A to go along with my terribly fascinating ventures into the realm of fictional moral conundrums and various shades of greyness...

Anyway...

Lots of questions remain for this game. Saying you're basing a videogame on a tabletop set isn't giving me much to go on, really. I mean - what sort of RPG are we going to be looking at, here? A pre-set character like in The Witcher? OR can we make our own character? Cyberpunk was very much about building a party and how the classes interacted symbiotically - are we dealing with one character or a group of them?

Will the Lifepath feature in any way in this game? Cyberpunk's ruleset was fairly standard fare for the most part - what was a big standout with that company was it's concept of a Lifepath: a kind of flowchart that semi-randomly built up your character's backstory, from upbringing, family, various life events, acquiantances, etc - up until the time the game starts. Really useful tool for a GM, as whenever I was in the lurch for a story I could just bring up something from a player's backstory and quickly work up a session from that.

I would also really hope for a wide variety of cybernetic upgrades. I mean, I've got like 4 supplement books of nothing but upgrades for that game, not counting stuff from all the other source material. Par for course in a videogame like this (when it's featured,) is that a cybernetic arm is a cybernetic arm - what was neat about Cyberpunk is that there were many brands of arm for sale, with their own characteristics - and that's not even getting into the upgrades layered on top of that.

Also a standout feature of the game was the concept that more cybernetics lowered your Humanity score, which tied into your social-based skill roles, and represented a loss of human emotion and attachment as you became more machine. Sort of a central theme was balancing your humanity with the need to stay competitive in this world. I think most players have had at least one character they've brought to the brink of Cyberpsychosis, and still found themselves wanting just one more upgrade. So it would be nice to see that concept play a role in the game, as well.

They are by no means happy, but they are livable and they aren't entirely meaningless like Martin. His books are boring, more or less just a misanthropic view of the world. Been there, done that, and it doesn't explain anything. Being somewhat of an Anti-Nihilist his work bothers me. No we don't all get to grow up to have bad lives and then wisk ourselves away on some dramatic adventure. We stay normal, grow up, and help others. No I am not out to conquer the world. Yes! For the last time check my resume, no parents. Yes the world is grim dark, but I don't have time to be bothered with it. Some of us have things to do, like have fun. Or do all the work while your wangsting in a corner.

Edit
I feel like this http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0854.html sums it up quite well. Reasonable people talking things out. He would be out of a job I guess.

Edit2
I wouldn't have such a bone to pick with the series if people didn't take it so damn seriously. I swear one of these days I'm going to say the wrong thing and find a knife in my spleen as a warning.

Agreed.



They did say in the conference that you will be creating and developing a character and that that will be a departure from the Witcher games - the way he phrased it forwards the assumption that you make one character and not a party. Other than that, everything is pretty much... unassumptionable.

I hope they have a detailed face sculpt tool. One of the best I've seen is in EvE online, it's just a pity it has to be wasted there. No one will see your face. This is going on my too watch list for sure.

That sounds a lot like Shadowrun. I'm happy with that.


It (the grimdark/misanthropic/nihilistic setting) doesn't have to explain anything. Just because it's "dark" doesn't mean it's mature. What I was referring to was the complexity of the plot, the politicking, etc.

And ... you're kind of arguing against the cyberpunk genre here, too. Cyberpunk = Noir + Sci-fi. A dystopian setting is pretty much mandatory. How could you possibly enjoy this game if you dislike "dark" narratives?


I love TOOTS!

Every few months I'll visit and marathon what I've missed.

There is another game based on Cyberpunk, which was released for mobile phones back in 2006. It's kinda like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashback_(video_game), and very good compared to the majority of mobile java games released back then.

Anyway, I greatly look forward to this Cyberpunk RPGs are a rare breed and yet the genre I like the most. The last cyberpunk RPG I played as Paradise Cracked almost a decade ago, but unfortunately it svcked.

I would also love to see an open cyberpunk game, kinda like Fallout 3 with a cyberpunk setting (I don't really care for the post-apocalyptic setting much)

It says in one article that it has classes from the game, but doesnt elaborate on anymore details on whether you'll get npc party members. They had many books on gear, a broad choice, was always alot better than shadowrun, in which i dont think they really knew themselves, and alot of the technology seemed a bit low for setting, but theyve fixed alot of that and got closer to cyberpunk, but the full body replacement would be insane.

I love the idea of adding Cyberpsychosis, it made alot of sense and especially since in cyberpunk being chromed was the thing to do, and the more chrome you got the more you lost your humanity, i added it into my shadowrun sessions, in which they had essence instead, that would be great in a computer game, maybe its part of the choices they suggest ingame.

There is a difference between darkness, and so totally pitch black I want to nuke the planet and be done with it. Martin is the later, pointless conflict. I do like plots and intrigue, Dune is one of if not my most favourite books. I do also like Martin's world building. It's impeccably historic and detailed. If I try and explain this to fans of the series it must surely be heretical. I think its the only reason I read as far as I did and bought season 1. It's impressive in that regard. There can be plenty of reasons to read a book besides it being grim dark and full of politics. I guess people just don't realize this.

As for cyberpunk? I seriously doubt it will get so grim dark to get me to stop caring about the characters. Even then it's more of a backdrop. Where as Martins world is in your face, it's not about lesser nobles or even commoners finding their way amidst this chaotic time. It's a game of thrones, your in the conflict itself. I suppose in that way it is separated.

Edit
Let me put it this way. In World of Darkness I was faced with an unimaginable evil. Think Cthulhu, now most people would just give up. Oh its the end of the world. Me? I blew that [censored] up. Staked a wendigo in the face with bullets, and started writing a bestiary of all things that go bump in the night. I can certainly say I am not the kind of person to just mope around uselessly. Suffice to say my GM was exasperated that the world of darkness soon became the word of dim. I was just a plain ordinary level 1 commoner with no special traits other than some quads as a Krogan might say, a 38. special, and some cars. Oh and later some explosives. All of those are dirt cheap.

I guess this goes here. http://i.imgur.com/cdnfO.png

So was this in the GOG announcement thing today.

Yes.

It takes some gall to title something after the genre itself ... so we'll see how that goes, eh?

Edit: ooh, Cyberpunk 2077 will be a sandbox-y openworld type of thing. Bethesda, prepare to defend yourself!

Ooh, ooh, http://i.minus.com/ixfYBmIhrEnsH.jpg http://wpc.4d7d.edgecastcdn.net/004D7D/www/cyberpunk/img/1600x1200_GIRL-CP77.jpg.

Ugh, I wish CDPR would stop the blatant exploitation but, Poland, eh?

And http://www.abload.de/img/1920x1080_art4kp4i.jpg?

Edit: this "for mature audiences" schtick is getting old. Lots of swearing and naked women, then. How mature. Hopefully that's not how "for mature audiences" translates again ...

How can they defend themselves when they have nothing in the Cyberpunk Genre.... unless that is what they are doing here in Austin.

Also there were http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1399263-game-sales-and-deals-steam-gog-gamersgate-impulse-desura-etc/page__view__findpost__p__21667785

We should read it as "more mature than the competition". Nakedness aside, I prefer Witcher-style maturity to Bethesda and Bioware's recent productions

I missed the announcement... I think they have it on Youtube though. I'll have to see.

You'll get no disagreement from me on this.


Sorry, missed this. I just mean, if CDPR do this well, Bethesda will no longer be the only one doing open-world gaming. We'll finally have something against which to compare Bethesda.

There's http://n4g.com/news/1104371/debut-teaser-for-cd-projekt-reds-new-game-cyberpunk-2077 too. Too bad it's still very early, so it explains absolutely nothing.

I'm getting extremely hyped about this game, even though there isn't really any information available. Ever since the early 90s I had this "dream game" in my mind, an open dystopian cyberpunk RPG. No game really done that even though there been two decades, and now CD Project announced it will feature sandbox elements. Yeah, hyped is an understatement

Now I only wonder if it will be first person or third person like The Witcher. Not a big deal, but I'm hoping for first person.

EDIT: I also like it takes place 2077, hundred years after I was born