People used to use this logic to justify making suits of 100% chameleon armour in oblivion. "The game mechanics let me make a suit of armour that renders me completely undetectable, and impossible to attack, therefore it's an intended feature - I am so awesome!". In the end it's a single player game, so do whatever floats your boat. Just don't try coming to me and telling me it's balanced, because TES games are about as balanced as a fat dude on a see-saw and the primary aim when gearring up should be to make the game play FUN, that may mean making yourself invincible, it may mean being able to spam fireballs, it may mean being vulnerable and not overpowered - it's up to you.

But just because "you can" it doesn't mean "everyone should", nor that you need to try impsoe that view on everyone else.

OK regarding what you were talking about: that's not an exploit either. The game is designed this way.

It's not an exploit because it uses up EIGHT enchanting slots to accomplish, which means that it costs you all of the things that you could have put there instead! You're giving up quite a lot of things in order to achieve zero casting cost on just two schools of magic. You still pay full price to cast on the other three schools in that case!

I'd much rather have 50% casting on four schools, than 0% on two. To me that is much more useful ... would that make it even more of an exploit to you?

There is no way to cheat if you are using destruction magic, I do think that if you design a character around using destruction magic that you are a masochist. You can even use a restoration exploit to give yourself more oomph and a pointy stick will still out DPS you by leaps and bounds.
Other schools are more tolerable.

I hate the idea of "balance" ... it's the stupidest thing I've ever heard of, and I've seen game after game in MMOs get ruined by companies chasing after this illusion. Because balance is stupid. Why? Because players all have different skill levels and preferences on how they like to play at any given moment, and what they expect out of the game. Plus players love to whine, especially the ones who realize they can convince devs to alter things in the games by whining enough. So then the game gets skewed by people who have no lives except they have all day to whine on bulletin boards. Meanwhile people who just enjoy playing the game get it ruined when the devs nerf all their favorite things and make the game all crappy. They have done it to almost every game I can think of. That's why I like Bethesda because they don't bother with trying to do "balance" or nerfing things. They don't give a crap, they just give you a difficulty slider and a range of options and say "balance it yourself."

But, it doesn't make magicka obsolete. It just means that you can cast one or two schools for free. The rest of them cost you full price.

How is that any worse than getting four schools for half price?

Magic is underpowered for the PC.

NPCs get stronger versions of the spells. PSB ftw.

its not cheating, but it should be. it is remarkably easy to achieve within the normal constraints of enchanting, so it is, as everyone refuses to even consider, an imbalance. an exploit is something you achieve by breaking the constraints of intended play and/or metagaming, like the duplication glitch of oblivion. some TES players have adopted some kind of defensive mechanism twisting the definition of words around in their head so they can ignore the fact that perfect bethesda just makes buggy games. to them being open-world and singleplayer can excuse just about anything in the name of "freedom".

so no, enchanting isnt cheating, nor is using it for its intended use of making you stronger "abusing" it. if bethesda intended enchanting to break difficulty, then it is an intended imbalance, but an imbalance all the same.

1. You honesty don't need to be constantly casting more than 2 schools

2. You can create 2 sets of gear, and easily swap.



I'm sure bethesda intended for the magicka mechanic to actually be used, what with magicka potions, magicka regen gear, and +magicka items....and the magicka stat on level up.

The 100% reduction is an oversight, and and if not an exploitation which trivializes the game into easymode pointlessness, certainly an imbalance which does the same - much like Alch/Ench/BS looping.. It might not be called cheating, but it sure results in the same thing. I just wish that cost reduction wasn't so heavily required on Master Difficulty; making any other choice obsolete.

But with the current fail magic system, you can't really completely playa-hate on people who do this trick.

Lame discussion.
It says it in the description, "a complete virtual world open for you to explore any way you choose."

For you purists that wanna play with forsworn, steel, iron, without magic.- GREAT ( a choice)
Why is sneaking ( walking around while sneaking till 100) with a couple arrows in between, perked up to kill, a non cheating method play too? makes u a Great thief Yah? able to cast judgement on any who dont.- GREAT( a choice)
Magic svcks in this game. Enchant all you want. if u become a god, switch to robes or a different armor, a different weapon( 1 or 2 handed or all staff), or use only a woodcutters axe etc.-GREAT (a choice)

You have a choice, play how u want. no one method is better than another. Why wine bout what others do cuz u think ur the answer to ES. ur like music snobs. who u like bieber or sinatra? LOL

the game was designed, not by you, by people that do it for a living. There may be some probs (N Major ones) I admit, but throw ur hat in the ring or stop whining. "Play how u like, we'll make more."...

Its a big diff between npc mage and player ones

Magic cost reduction is not cheating no, neither is magic cost elimination because the game allows it, but the latter is poor design imo.

It is cheating. If you are meant to cast freely without any worry to mana, then there shouldn't be a mana bar.

However, I am willing to give the benefit of the doubt, and believe that magic is underpowered. But cheating doesn't make it right.

Y poor design? u a thief, warrior,or want all in line with ur actual physical world. any problem with combat that u have can be figured out with one or another skill. I can imbalance the game with sneaking and archery perks @ 100. Maybe throw in a little Heavy armor +100 n ur F%$#@. Magic gets a bad rap, and its terrible. cheers.

I for [censored] and giggles decided to use Flames (the first constant fire spell you get) with no Destruction perks and only use -25% magicka cost amulet, helmet and ring along with my 400 magicka pool.

And uhm...
I could spurt fire for like 3 or 4 minutes.
I just summoned two atronachs and attacked the people in Dragonreach then ran around like a neverending flamethrower until they were all dead (apart from the two marked as "essential").


The point?
I dunno, since I use a lvl 1 spell with no Destruction perks and only a medium pool of Magicka along with -25%x3 I'd say that I became pretty OP.
So using a higher lvl spell "with" all destruction perks along with -25%x3 magicka cost then I think one might become a bit too powerful.

Then again, I thought archers were so biased against that I got +40%bowdamagex4 just so that I could have a fair chance against the gigantum health pool NPCs so it might be balanced.

It's not an exploit as you can actually buy 4 items with 25% less magicka cost each, totalling 100%. No exploit, just buying stuff from merchants. It needs to be changed. Right now, the zero cost for spells is completely destroying the magicka attribute and all perks in the magic schools that reduce cost that show you've become proficient in that magic school.

Why? Its a lame argument since its a non multiplayer game. U dont like it dont use it. Its like oxygen. If u dont need it dont use it (pun intended). if u wanna make it harder do so. If you want it easier do so. figure out something real to do with the game piz....

Not cheating, enchanting designed for it. 4 items, all of which can be forted 25% at 100% enchanting level, no cheat involved.




Well said. Over a period of time I've seen this creep into games. Whingers, whining, and mewling like babes because they demand something "their way", and all too often, some empty suit at head office reads all these posts by cretins, and what do you get? Not only do you tend to get nerfed games, the latest thing is the "mid-level superboss", where all of a sudden, you're having a good game, and then the fist of freaking God strikes you down because, well, a whole bunch of people on the internet (the last bastion of the lunatic and the relentless complainer) have complained that they needed a "challenge", so you get a stupidly overpowered one. They're gimmick battles, made to appease the vacuous minds of people who seem to think they're "serious gamers". Gotta appease the "serious gamer".


Rubbish. You can enchant items to varying levels, giving you any sort of fortification level you desire. Stop asking Bethesda to remove options from the game. Too many people doing it. Starting to piss me off. No spellmaking in TESV, next, no smithing, enchanting or alchemy. Can't upset those "serious gamers", eh.

Bethesda are one of the few companies that give you the unfettered freedom to make your gameplay as hard or as easy as you wish. You can do something about it. Asking a games studios to remove content from their game is not a solution. At all. Ever. Worst of all, you're taking content away from ME!

Of course they are. It's an oversight, and they never intended us to be able to swing a weapon for free.

Yeah from now on when game makers break their game they should just tell people to just ignore it, it makes total sense!

It's.

Not.

Freaking.

Broken.

get 100 archer n sneak w/ heavy armor n tell me its still unbalanced for mages only...exploit that. IIm whiny now n shut up.

If you have to exploit the game so much why don't you just put it on the easiest setting? It's obviously too hard for you the way it is.

dumb comment. follow the posts.

I don't think for a nanosecond, that Bethseda 'overlooked' this possibility. Thats like saying they overlooked the possibility somebody might sit and craft all day for daedric armour early in the game.

Of course they know, and heres a secret.. they did it on purpose. Its that wacky zany choice thing they like players to have. Always have done, and hell, its practically a defining feature of a TES game.

They don't ask for you personally to like it, all they ask is that you use the game and its wide options to choose the game you want to play. If you want to play a fireball spamming maniac.. go for it.

Frankly I could give them a hug for giving me the option.

This. Of course it's an oversight, as it invalidates all 5 of the "Cast [Novice --> Master] spells for 50% less magicka" in one fell swoop.