I'm interested in your take on Skyrim, since I'm still actively playing Modbliivion (a heavily modified version of Oblivion).
What are Skyrim's strengths or weaknesses versus the previous TES entries, especially Oblivion?

(Bonus points if you've also played Daggerfall and/or Arena )

heres my take, don't feel like rewriting everything
http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1334143-now-i-see-what-people-are-getting-at-about-morrowind/page__fromsearch__1

Well here is my review i put up at Gamespot for the Pc version of Tes V Skyrim-


I dont know how Bethesda does it but ever since the first rpg in the ELDER SCROLLS series was released ARENA way back in the early 1990s this rpg series has been the most wanted and sought out with each new release for roleplayers everywhere. It is like pen and paper dungeons and dragons boardgames come to life with ones imagination feeding the world with its reality. Thus the player enters a world where they can be themselves or anyone or anything else in alien worlds which feel familiar yet totally new.

And so SKYRIM enters the scene a revolutionary evolution of past ELDER SCROLLS games. As always Bethesda makes it seem as if we only paid ONE DOLLAR for their work due to the infinite immense game world they have created which never gets boring. Even now there are countless people still playing the likes of TES 2 DAGGERFALL due to its huge scope. So it seems shall SKYRIM also be.

GRAPHICS-
The most buetiful i have seen in a rpg. Landscapes and characters which look like paintings out of 1970s art books by classic artists such as Frank Frazetta, Boris Vallejo, Brom, Simon Bisley and so many more. And thanks to the great character creation process in SKYRIM you can make your ingame self look just as epic as CONAN THE BARBARIAN or as seductive as VAMPIRELLA and enter a world where such fantasy/horror characters will feel right at home.

The user interface is very easy to learn and naturally fast especially during combat switching items or taking potions etc. For a pc using a console ui everything came out working incredibly well. The Perks screen is very intuitive with all the info one needs to know what does what. The sound effects are also very nice when checking out the different perks. The new 3D map helps to keep immersion in the world of SKYRIM strong with its realistic mountainous terrain and misty cloud filled setting with quests points and places you've heard about or visited displayed on the map. Fast travel is possible but only if you have visited the area once before.

Music-
I have not been so thrilled and emotionally moved the way i have been with the music soundtrack of SKYRIM since listening to the haunting scores of TES 2 DAGGERFALL. Truly music which captures all the harsh and buetiful tones of life in SKYRIM where death can come at any moment and at any time. Jeremy Soule did some very unique work here and quite different which hits the player with plenty of audio impact full of joy, horror and inspiring heroism.

Sound-
It doesnt get any more real then this. As soon as i started playing as i was being taken to be executed i felt myself disconnecting from the real world and entering the game reality of SKYRIM. From the harrowing howls of wolves in the wilderness to the fearsome roar of a Dragon or the wintry arctic wind sweeping the plains you will feel the presence of SKYRIM as you have not felt from any other game.

Voice acting is perfect with a very real feel to it as if this what the npcs would say if you met their real world counterpart. And what npcs there are. The variety is staggering how many people you will meet in this game and how alive they seem to be with a sense of each one having a different history and in many cases one you the player can effect through your actions.

Radiant Ai is miraculous with npcs and companions reacting to the players action in a very fluid natural manner. One time i threw some weapons and armor on the street due to being slowed down carrying too much and a guard walked up to me and started complaining for me not to do that. Another time a Queen was talking to her court and as i was walking into the room i started talking to her only to have her tell me not to interrupt her as she went back to conversing with her court on some important matters.

Radiant Ai on enemies and monsters is also fantastic to behold as they seem to show endless variety depending on the situation and showing a good knack for wanting to stay alive. Wildlife is like visiting a wildlife preserve or seeing a documentary on NOVA with very lifelike behaviour among the vast variety of animals from little bouncing ground stomping bunnies to non-hostile moose grazing near a running river alive with fish leaping about further down at the waterfalls edge.

I could go on and on and still not say much about the vastness of everything in SKYRIM. All i can tell you is if you played and loved TES 2 DAGGERFALL then go BUY this game NOW! This is the rpg you have been waiting for. The big Mojo wish come true. The wish upon a star and it happened. The moment of epiphany where answers are revealed!

Thank you Bethesda for being the bringers of joy and making a difference when it comes to things that improve ones quality of life.

Better graphics and animations, more hand-crafted gameworld, better large scale battles, and better level-scaling than Oblivion.

Almost everything else is worse than previous games.

My take is that it's the best one yet.

I find the world far more detailed than Morrowind or Oblivion, you encounter far more things on your travels. The gameplay and mechanics I find to be vastly improved. Despite a lower -number- of skills, I feel that each individual skill gives you far more variety in things you can specialize your character in than Oblivion or Morrowind, giving you far more choice and customization in the outcome of your character.

Truly, I can only think of a very small handful of things that Morrowind or Oblivion do better than Skyrim, and the things that they do better, I don't believe are really anything all that significant.

I agree with this. Not that I'm not enjoying Skyrim, but it seems less like an Elder Scrolls game, and more like an open world action game.

Agree

Vanila Skyrim is an improvement over vanilla Oblivion in about 85-95% of areas. Unfortunately Oblivion+expantions+mods really beats Skyrim silly imo. If I could I would call myself in the past and tell myself to wait till the CK for Skyrim came out, but I really doubt I would listen to myself considering the hype Skyrim was getting. So instead I am telling you to wait a week after the CK comes out to buy the game. I would bet that after a week there will be enough personalization style mods that will let you have an experience that overshadow oblivion and will last long enough for some of the hellacool mods to come out.

Comparing vanilla Skyrim to Oblivion w/ Mods, DLC, etc. really isn't fair.

I'm sure Skyrim w/ Mods, DLC, etc. will be just as better than Oblivion w/ Mods, DLC, etc. as vanilla Skyrim is over vanilla Oblivion.

You are absolutely right


But the OP has access to Oblivion+expantions+mod, but (s)he doesn’t even have access to the Skyrim CK yet. It wasn’t meant to be a “fair” judgment, just an accurate one.

Honestly? its a piece of crap.

the quests? pointless and boring, also I hate the whole "OMG YOUR SO IMPORTANT" for every quest, which is why i love morrowind where they didnt put to much emphsis on your character. also the whole "We give you less so you get more " line is crap, i dont care if i have unlimited amount of quests, they get boring after 5 times and dont change anything,

Now i will admit the graphics are amazing, except the character graphics..they svck, they keep making the faces uglier and uglier,

also the AI, svckS seriously you know how many times i was in a fight and they'd just stand their? pathetic,and the random dragons, go down attack, fly off at a 100 miles per hour, the theirs the whole "gets shot in the head- what was that? oh nothing..." deal >.> i wish we had smart AI that reacts to everything..

the spells? i like the fact that its not a ball.. any more but still, if this is a proper true RP. how can you take away a mages way of opening locked doors? SERIOUSLY

and i wish they let warriors have their own way to opena door also, Js...i can say more and in proper order to, but im tired

Passable for an Action/Adventure game, horrible for an Elder Scrolls game.

At this point we can only compare what we have now with Skyrim to all of our experiences with Morrowind and Oblivion and the others.

I started with Oblivion GoTY edition and played it for 500+ hours before I even found out about mods. It wasn't boring and I hadn't done all the quests. I can't say the same thing about Skyrim except that I have 350+ hours between 2 characters and I can't wait to get my hands on the CK and start making some mods while waiting for the work of the super modders out there to enhance my game.

A year ago I got Morrowind GoTY edition and throughly enjoyed playing the game. So much depth and learning about lore and history.

Each game had its strong points and its weaknesses. In my opinion Skyrim is a beautifully crafted visual game world but is lacking a lot in the way of depth in quests and other things to keep you occupied with the exception of standing on a mountain top enjoying the scenery. However, I can see that given time and a larger variety of mods that will be available that Skyrim will be the equal to the others as well in what it excels as.

Just my opinion.

Indeed, already installed a few mods, the few that there are, mostly texture replacers and stuff, since there isnt much else yet and it is already overshadowing vanilla. Cant wait for the ck stuff to come out, the potential is insane if you see what people can do without it already.

Anyway back on topic, vanilla games morrowind was the best out of these three, oblivion felt to much of a console action game instead of a PC RPG game, skyrim is even worse with that UI, having to pause everytime you wanna switch from weapon to spell or potions ? seriously? Im on the PC dammit, i have numpad and numeric keys, wheres my quickbuttons?
and i miss athletics and acrobatics although i can see why they removed it. Forcing you to make huge detours instead of jumping over the mountains if you cant find your way over em bunnyhopping them.
The AI in Skyrim on the otherhand got a major boost wich is a huge plus compared to both Morrowind and Oblivion.
Vanilla Morrowind #1 Skyrim #2 and Oblivion #3

My MW/OB veteran 3 septims :

Strengths

- great open-world, very wild, hazardous and realistic
- awesome & unique dungeons, random encounters in the wilderness
- new level & vendors system
- dual possibilities
- magic visuals
- radiant quests
- ennemies scale
- epic dragons fights
- the Legion is finally back !
- TG is the best of the 3 games

Weaknesses

- even more dumbed-down than OB
- no classes, birthsigns, attributes, ranks, disposition and others RPG things
- arrow in the quest, no journal
- no spells making, not enough spells
- 27 skills in MW, 18 in SK
- too much 3rd person only features, werewolf == 0
- new horses system is a complete FAIL
- no consequences for your acts, you can become leader of all factions
- no mudcrab convs


I was expecting more or less that when i bought it, but the mods will transform SK into a real RPG game.

I say it's easy to go from Oblivion to Skyrim, Skyrim feel more well polished than Oblivion but not as much as the Morrowind to Oblivion jump. with lots of mods you will probably find it more similar.

Now the main weakness in Skyrim is the lack of spellmaking, as in forget playing as an destruction mage, however conjugation has gotten an serious boost, if you want to play as an necromancer you will fall in love.

The graphics, combat system, and scope of the game are amazing. The quests are rather bland.

Morrowind i played when it originally came out and found it to be a boring chore to play, thanks to a horrible map, horrible combat, and ultra slow walking speed. I gave up on it after 15 or so hours even though i really wanted to like it.

Oblivion i picked up on a whim 2 years ago and loved it. 150 hours on first play through, 160 on second, and 80 on third and only stopped cause Skyrim came out. The main improvement to the combat let me actually enjoy the game play. I loved the world itself, it felt like a huge fantasy world like in books i read, but i could explore at my own pace. Quest lines were excellent, i loved all the guilds i joined, except the Theives Guild which i never finished. Oblivion had some issues though, first level scaling was horrible, I didn't even know Glass and Dedric items were supposed to be rare, cause everyone had them. I loved Oblivion gates, but wish there was more variety in them. Also houses felt very empty, i wanted some kind of friendship or romance options considering there were so many NPCs in the game.

Skyrim has pretty much fixed all my issues with Oblivion, then went above and beyond it with a world so huge and detailed its staggering to me. I love the smithing and enchanting skills. Followers and Marriage are nice little additions if shallow. The new level up system is great and really lets me feel i can create my character just how i want. The only thing Oblivion beats Skyrim in is the guild Quests were longer and more indepth. I find them to be lacking in skyrim, but thats a small gripe overall.

Skyrim has a lot of small issues but I can live with those. I understand Skyrim has to be interesting to a new audience but there are a few things that reallty decrease my enjoyment compared to previous installments (Morrowind, Oblivion).

1. the logbook's quest description. I play without the quest-marker (old school, I know) and sometimes the quest descriptions aren't enough to understand what to do next (such as where to find someone). Besides that they also rarely include an incentive. When I accepted the quest a reason was given to me of course, but this isn't always added to the journal so sometimes I have no clue why I'm doing something or where I should go to do it.

2. Guilds. Guilds seem to become less and less. Morrowind had 11 guilds with tons of quests, Oblivion had 5 guilds with a good amount of quests but Skyrim has 5 guilds with only a handful of quests. Guilds are an important part of how I play the game. I slowly complete them while also doing other stuff on the side. Now there is just not enough to do in the guilds. They wont even promote you because otherwise you'd get a promotion for each quests considering most guilds only have 8 quests... (P.S. there is enough side content in the game, I would have prefered less side quests and more guild quests)

unmodded Skyrim Weaknesses compared to previous TES games:

- no quest descriptions in journal, as it is the journal is just (and only) a streamlined display of quests to easily activate/de-activate the arrows
- no spellmaking, and many useful spell effects have been omitted
- in order to learn an spell effect for enchanting you need to break down an item that already has the effect enchanted, instead of just learning the spell effect through learning a spell
- too few consequences to your actions
- further dumbed down versus previous TES games
- less skills, no attributes, no classes, no (at least not visible) ranks, no disposition (at least not visible) in dialog, etc
- suicidal horses, horses can't carry stuff for the player, horse physics (<- mountain climbing on horse back, anyone?)
- short faction/guilds quest lines (though they're not so bad story-wise), few factions/guilds
- it's easy to unbalance the game by leveling skills and choosing perks, even though this is a "choice" issue it's fairly easy to boo your game if you're unsuspecting
- general balance issues, like giants sending you to the moon while dragons are relatively a pushover
- worsened by some enemies level-scaling while others do not
- NPC's no longer have anything to tell eachother, not even the gibberish they pvssyd about in Oblivion
- NPC's have much less to talk about with the player, like about who they are, what they are, their surroundings, their opinions, etc, compared to previous TES games (in particular Morrowind)
- no first person view while riding a horse, nor while being a werewolf
- low quality textures, even on ultra setings
- graphical oddities like for example the ugly shadows
- the UI seems especially tailored for console controls
- sloppy optimization of PC code
- and quite a bit more

Most of the above will be (and some of it already is) fixed by mods.

Skyrim strengths:
- intensely immersive (imho) open world
- potential for beautiful graphics
- radiant quests
- unique dungeons
- a lot of cliffhangers to the future faith of Skyrim/Tamriel, and as to what current events are in the rest of Tamriel
- 3rd person view (vanity mode) works "better" than it did in previous TES games
- archery and stealth work "better" than they did in previous TES games
- crafting (mining/hunting, smelting/tanning, smithing weapons and armor), even though at high smithing levels you get extremely overpowered weapons
- better combat system, even though it's still not up to par with most other RPG's and Action-Adventure games out there
- and quite a bit more

[disclaimer: the above is just my opinion, not canon fact]

Overall I'm having a blast with Skyrim. Even though it's far from my "ideal" TES game. Much of what I don't like about Skyrim will be fixed with mods however, and with that in mind it may very well become "my most favorite TES game ever", in the future.

I love them all, I play all of them, My only wish is that the leveling was the same as Morrowind, in that game I am level 1138 [old x box]

I pretty much agree with everything you said.

As someone else has said already, the best summary is to consider Skyrim an amazing action-adventure game, but a little shallow as an RPG compared to its predecessors. Perks are fun to play around with, though.

love morrowind. got it a year before oblivion came out and still playing it to this day. it's a harsh alien landscape where the natives hate you. it doesn't have voice acting so to compensate you get in depth text conversations. i love to read and morrowind is my 3d choose your own adventure little slice of escapist heaven. even with the crappy combat (i play mages )

oblivion. i put some time into this game. i made a bright blue dunmer with glowing red hair, joined the mages guild and got stuck in. much faster paced than morrowind, much brighter environment, a lot more humour too. exploration wise, it wasn't uncommon to be up against 4 enemies in a tight corridor at once. i accepted that this was a console adventure game and not a serious rpg where i'd be agonising over skills and gear and just got on with enjoying myself. quest marker svcked a lot of the fun out, but i guess that was a casualty of voice actors (all 5 of them) becoming the norm. the levelling system blew. it meant you couldn't major too many non combat skills. can't sweet talk a level 30 goblin warlord can you? and you can't just outright avoid them either, they're everywhere, getting more powerful as you do.

skyrim. not gonna lie, i put 200 hours in and had to stop. MQ was a chore, so much so that i didn't bother with the other factions. at first it was great. huge, beautiful world, loads of caves and ruins to poke around in, but the thing is, and for an action adventure game this is a fatal flaw, for all the extremely well made dungeons there was hardly anything to fight or do. i'd spend 30 minutes in a place, and unless it had a quest tied to it there'd be 5 enemies in there, all evenly spaced and very likely they'd be draugr. skyrim got old faster than it should of done. don't even get me started on the complete lack of a scaling on magic and the thoroughly irritating characters everywhere. mods will fix it i'm sure, but it'll be at least a year before i go back.

i liked morrowind best, and don't like skyrim so much. My biggest gripe with the series since morrowind is the lack of a strong story, the quest arrow and fast travel from any position. The last two are so terrible they single handedly make the game worse.