where did you take minecraft? i said nether. ammo has worked in every mmo i've played.

*shrug* only thing i could think of that some are crazy enough to actually consider an MMO. Again, is it an MMORPG? i highly doubt it.

it's a horror survival shooter. think of dayz/warz.and as i said you wouldn't consider it as an mmo.

now get back to topic.

The fact that other weapons don't have to do that? Not rocket science here.

It's lazy to expect a level playing field in a competitive MMO? Right. Us casuals are just tearing this game apart.

AS has been said countless times, this has been one continuous loop. My offer still stands, however. Prove me wrong. Give me a reason why the bow tax is not inequitable.

lets make other weapons have some "penalty" as well then? you'd like that? i'm sure i would.

Which will never happened, nor is it part of lore anyway, so you are going against you only argument (which is not much of argument to begin with)

This is what everyone has been saying multiple times to you and you just keep dismissing it. We would all be fine if they incorporated features in the game that made ALL weapons/skills require two different resources so that it balances it with archers using arrows.

If I was forced to have to sharped my sword after "x" number of fights to keep it's damage up, or I had to replenish my little bag of magic dust, so I could keep casting spells, then I would have absolutely, ZERO, issues with the game having limited arrows in it. But, since neither of those two things are being added to the game, then the game needs to be balanced around the fact that all weapons should only require ONE resource.

Yep, and again I covered that in the last thread. These consumables would need to be of different types that do various levels of damage per item. Oh, and they need to be retrievable. Any ideas that you feel are lore appropriate?

Give him credit though. This *might* actually be progress.

I have read your reasons. they are just all bad reasons.. If ammo was bad in MMORPG's then why has everyone single one of them that ever had an archery mechanic, had limited ammo? You really got nothing to go on. The real reason behind wanted unlimited ammo is so that you can sneak around pvp areas and sniper off enemy players without ever having to restock. That is not a good reason. None of your reasons are good ones. Archers throughout real life history and in gaming history have an advantage over non archers. And that is why ammo has always been limited. Thats why guns are better than swords. they are a much more efficient killing weapon than a sword, but is limited by ammo. Sure, if you happen to run out of ammo before your all sword wielding enemies die, your in trouble. Thats realism.

I dont even know why this simple concept even needs to be explained. its like.... common sense.

Its like the difference between a heavy 2 handed weapon vs a dagger. Why cant the 2 handed weapon strike as quickly and as often as a dagger? They are both melee weapons, but the 2 handed weapon is slower than the dagger. Why is this? Shouldnt they be equal? Should we cry foul and have a poll?

Its the same with archery. The advantage it has over short range weapons is balanced with limited ammo. Has been forever. The damage a 2 h weapon does is balanced by its slower attack speed. The fast speed of the dagger is balanced by its low damage.

There is nothing else that needs to be said about this topic, by either side.

but it is almost definitely not happening, so it matters little.

What MMORPGS had limited arrow that are still around today? all i can think of is ultima, and that is BARELY alive.

EDIT: and DDO, but people are always complaining about the ammo (since they have so much they might as well have unlimited) anyway.

Well, since there isn't all that much new information coming out on the game right now, we are just having people rehash the same 5 threads every few days and we just keep having to use the same arguments over and over again.

ok so if what leperchans is saying is true: you all are FINE with penalties being pushed to other classes?

if all classes require 2 resources its not a penalty, its balanced

For the most part, but as said it is NOT happening, nor is it lore-friendly at all (which is the only even somewhat argument you actually had) AND it would push away people who would hate to micromanage and they are trying to attract customers not push them away.

well in that case i would agree with you on this balance thing.

let's have zenimax make bots for this game and sell them for the people who cannot play the game or have too little time. i know there's a botting crowd out there, why not cater to them as well?

Heh, I ask another question, and again it's ignored. White flag. I am, once again, done.

this one?

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Magic there's plenty of lore to make mages use a second resource. what comes to fighters just make them repair their gear every now and then or something.

Limited and retrievable. Nothing wrong with that. Long as its possible for the devs to pull off.

Mages do not need a second resource. They are already balanced by their weaknesses.

all classes have to repair their gear anyway

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Magic

Do not see anywhere where it says that MAges tended to use other resources other than their own magic.

Some of the first recorded uses of magic were by the http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Ayleids of the http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:First_Era. Through the saluaging of fallen fragments of Aetherius, they attained great arcane power, which they used to enslave the early http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Imperial.

• http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Ayleid_Ruins - These special stones can be retrieved from various ruined sites of the now extinct http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Ayleid civilization. They are said to be made of meteoric glass (which in turn is supposedly part of the body of Lorkhan). When activated, they bestow certain magical effects upon the user. These are:
  • http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Welkynd_Stone
  • http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Welkynd_Stone
  • http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Varla_Stone

1. that was thousands of years ago

2. that was to have greater magical power then they already had,

3. There are very few welkynd stones left, the only place they appear are in the ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil

4. varla stones are useful only for weapon enchantments and have nothing to do with using magic your self

5. DArk welkynd stones are explicitly traps created by the Heartland High Elves.