Skyrim based on LOTR films? : V - Skyrim

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:45 am

Oblivion was ( said by Todd himself ) not really in skyrim imo .

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:21 am

I don't believe I made any comparisons between Morrowind and Tolkien. I just said that Morrowind's creativity doesn't borrow from Tolkien. So hold your horses and capitalize your letters.

And if you looked into the lore surrounding Morrowind, you would have to concede that it has more narrative complexity, esoteric and intellectual depth than Tolkien's straightforward stories of heroes and gods. Tolkien may have described the minute details of certain places in his work more thoroughly, but does detail and description make a work inherently better? Does making a fantasy world bigger make it better? In any case, Tolkien never really laid out the beliefs, social structure, religion and economy of a truly foreign culture the way TES III does with the Dunmer.

Morrowind was a video game, not a novel, so it aimed to tell stories in a different way. You can't compare its narrative intent to LotR.

If it has pointy eared elves its Tolkien inspired prior to his works the elves were god like of folklore. Tolkien's works still stand with the most in depth description of lore that actually stands by its lore can't say for TES sadly they change it every game to noticeable degree on certain levels. So again everything fantasy game in the sword and board era hell any era can be and has been Tolkien inspired not copied but inspired including Morrowind again not copied but inspired some way or another. Can't blame them it certainly not a bad thing it gives those a base to start on and rework it and fine tune it to create its own world.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:34 am

I'm sure every person on the Skyrim team has read the Tolkien books and seen all the movies. So of course a good chunk of their inspiration for the art and whatnot is bound to come from that. Which is fine. Being inspired by great stuff makes for more great stuff. But it's not a 100% thing, obviously. There are plenty of differences, and as far as using orcs, norse-style races, elves, etc, etc., those are some pretty standard fantasty/fiction/art subjects, and not at all derived just from Mr. Tolkien's works. Inspiration comes from a lot of places, usually.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:35 am

If it has pointy eared elves its Tolkien inspired prior to his works the elves were god like of folklore. Tolkien's works still stand with the most in depth description of lore that actually stands by its lore can't say for TES sadly they change it every game to noticeable degree on certain levels. So again everything fantasy game in the sword and board era hell any era can be and has been Tolkien inspired not copied but inspired including Morrowind again not copied but inspired some way or another. Can't blame them it certainly not a bad thing it gives those a base to start on and rework it and fine tune it to create its own world.

I don't know enough about TES lore to really comment on whether or not the game is inspired by Tolkien. However, saying everything that has pointy-eared elves is inspired by Tolkien is just silly. Santa has pointy-eared elves, and I'm pretty sure they had nothing to do with Tolkien.

Oh, and lore changing over time? That has to do with time passing. For example, we know a hell of a lot more about history now than we did 200 years ago (which is the same amount of time between Oblivion and Skyrim), and that is because of archaeological discoveries, improved methodology, and more accessible historical documents and scholarship.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:00 am

I have been meaning to post this for a while and now I've got all the examples I can find I will post! I'm sure other people have realised this and I'm sorry if it's already been posted, but has anyone else noticed Skyrim is based on the LOTR films?

Examples:

Moria orcs are VERY similar to the falmer!
Whiterun is almost identical to Edoras (and Rohan), it's on top of a hill in the middle of a vegetated field ect.
The designs in Whiterun are identical to the designs on the swords and building of Rohan
Looking from the side at Whiterun you can see mountains in the background just like the films
The wood elves could be based on the ones from the films and books
The stone carvings/designs in Dwemer ruins are exact to the Dwarven ones in the films
--EDIT--
The elven armour is exactly the same as the films, except the colours!
ALSO NOTE: I didn't mean based 100%, i just mean they must have taken a lot of ideas from the LOTR films :smile:

I dont think any of that is the same as the films. Try viewing pics side by side and see if you still think the same.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:47 am

Aside from some of the music I think Skyrim has more in common with the Conan movies than it does LOTR.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:33 am

Most, if not all fantasy, wether its books, movies, video games, Im sure draw from LOTR for inspiration. It's not suprising, or unexpected, but it's by no means based on it, or after it, I think that's just mere coincidence, but it's no surprise similarities can be found, Im sure they draw on plenty of other material for inspiration and direction as well.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:41 am

I wish they did a LOTR's game in the same vain as Skyrim though ,free-roam and create your own characters story along the way. all the LOTR games have been bust's to me.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:12 am

I wish they did a LOTR's game in the same vain as Skyrim though ,free-roam and create your own characters story along the way. all the LOTR games have been bust's to me.

That would be so freaking awesome.

on being busts, I really enjoy the PC Battle for Middle Earth series, and War in the North was interesting.

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:58 pm

I wish they did a LOTR's game in the same vain as Skyrim though ,free-roam and create your own characters story along the way. all the LOTR games have been bust's to me.

yeah i have always felt the same way. there is a project called MERP. Middle Earth Role-Playing Project.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:31 am

yeah i have always felt the same way. there is a project called MERP. Middle Earth Role-Playing Project.

They had better not be making a $%^&* MMO

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:08 am

Everything, book, comic books, film and song...everything with Elves and dragons, is LoTR. Everything. Tolkien didn't invent Elves in literature, no. But like Leif Ericson discovered the New World a couple of hundred years before Columbus, it was unimportant, and nothing came from it. Not until Columbus. Tolkien is the Columbus of all fantasy fiction. It's why there is an entire section dedicated to fantasy in every book store.

That didn't occur in literature or film until Tolkien. He didn't make it up, but he was most important. By far.

(Yes I know "A Midsummer's Night Dream" was all about Faerie, and Shakespear is the most profound influence on English literature...but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien) :smile:

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:20 am

Everything, book, comic books, film and song...everything with Elves and dragons, LoTR. Everything. Tolkien didn't invent Elves in literature, no. But like Leif Ericson discovered the New World a couple of hundred years before Columbus. But it was unimportant, and nothing came from it. Not until Columbus. Tolkien is the Columbus of all fantasy fiction. It's why there is an entire section dedicated to fantasy in every book store.

That didn't occur in literature or film until Tolkien. He didn't make it up, but he was most important. By far.

(Yes I know "A Midsummer's Night Dream" was all about Faerie, and Shakespear is the most profound influence on English literature...but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien) :smile:

I really doubt that

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:27 am

If it has pointy eared elves its Tolkien inspired prior to his works the elves were god like of folklore. Tolkien's works still stand with the most in depth description of lore that actually stands by its lore can't say for TES sadly they change it every game to noticeable degree on certain levels. So again everything fantasy game in the sword and board era hell any era can be and has been Tolkien inspired not copied but inspired including Morrowind again not copied but inspired some way or another. Can't blame them it certainly not a bad thing it gives those a base to start on and rework it and fine tune it to create its own world.

Here's a little fact that you will blow your mind.

There is not a single reference in Tolkien to pointy-eared elves. A lot of the fantasy cliches that people attribute to Tolkien were actually solidified by people like Gary Gygax of D&D fame. The classic fantasy elf wouldn't fit in Tolkien's universe at all.

The environment and culture of Vvardenfell is not even remotely inspired by Tolkien.

You are making very silly assumptions and taking them too far.

but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien)

Anyone else want to handle this one? Or is it too ridiculous to even bother?

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:02 pm

I am pretty sure that there is some influence by the LoTR films on Skyrim as well as long before then by the LoTR books on the entire series.

How much of the TES games went into the making of the LoTR films is the more interesting question.

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:17 pm

Everything, book, comic books, film and song...everything with Elves and dragons, is LoTR. Everything. Tolkien didn't invent Elves in literature, no. But like Leif Ericson discovered the New World a couple of hundred years before Columbus, it was unimportant, and nothing came from it. Not until Columbus. Tolkien is the Columbus of all fantasy fiction. It's why there is an entire section dedicated to fantasy in every book store.

That didn't occur in literature or film until Tolkien. He didn't make it up, but he was most important. By far.

(Yes I know "A Midsummer's Night Dream" was all about Faerie, and Shakespear is the most profound influence on English literature...but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien) :smile:

Have you read his (Tolkien's) essay on fantasy and fairy tales? It's a a bit of a drab read if you don't enjoy essays, but I would recommend it all the same if you enjoy his fantasy.

I really doubt that

It's true.

To whomever mentioned Conan: I just watched again the first Conan film and I couldn't even pay attention because all I saw were bits and pieces of Skyrim everywhere, lol. Conan and Tolkien have pretty wild love children..

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:43 pm

http://images.uesp.net/b/b7/AyleidLanguage_example.jpg

Ayleids are not the same as Dwemer.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:17 am

The giants and mammoths reminded me of the a Song of Ice and Fire novels.

But then again, most fantasy works draw from the same pool.

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:35 pm

Have you read his (Tolkien's) essay on fantasy and fairy tales? It's a a bit of a drab read if you don't enjoy essays, but I would recommend it all the same if you enjoy his fantasy.

It's true. :tongue:

To whomever mentioned Conan: I just watched again the first Conan film and I couldn't even pay attention because all I saw were bits and pieces of Skyrim everywhere, lol. Conan and Tolkien have pretty wild love children..

In the Eurocentric tradition, maybe (but I still doubt it, Tolkien did not invent dragons and there have been myths and legends about dragon-slayers for centuries); however, there have been Chinese writings about Dragons for as long as we have Chinese writings.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:08 am

Anyone else want to handle this one? Or is it too ridiculous to even bother?

Beowulf (dragons).
The King of Elfland's Daughter (elves)

Orcs do seem to originate in Tolkien, though.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:53 am

Everything, book, comic books, film and song...everything with Elves and dragons, is LoTR. Everything. Tolkien didn't invent Elves in literature, no. But like Leif Ericson discovered the New World a couple of hundred years before Columbus, it was unimportant, and nothing came from it. Not until Columbus. Tolkien is the Columbus of all fantasy fiction. It's why there is an entire section dedicated to fantasy in every book store.

That didn't occur in literature or film until Tolkien. He didn't make it up, but he was most important. By far.

(Yes I know "A Midsummer's Night Dream" was all about Faerie, and Shakespear is the most profound influence on English literature...but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien) :smile:

...... wow don't read much do you?

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:29 am

Everything, book, comic books, film and song...everything with Elves and dragons, is LoTR. Everything. Tolkien didn't invent Elves in literature, no. But like Leif Ericson discovered the New World a couple of hundred years before Columbus, it was unimportant, and nothing came from it. Not until Columbus. Tolkien is the Columbus of all fantasy fiction. It's why there is an entire section dedicated to fantasy in every book store.

That didn't occur in literature or film until Tolkien. He didn't make it up, but he was most important. By far.

(Yes I know "A Midsummer's Night Dream" was all about Faerie, and Shakespear is the most profound influence on English literature...but there were no books about elves, dragons or orcs) before Tolkien) :smile:

There were books and stories about Dragons way before Tolkien: Chinese Dragon tales date to 16th Century BC ( thousands of years before Tolkein was even born).
There were stories and books about Elves way before Tolkien: These are from Norse/German Mthology from the 11th Century. (again, thousands of years before Tolkien).
As for Orcs. He is credited with that.

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:23 pm

In the ME series, orcs were elves that were twisted by the dark powers, so there are plenty of folk legends of dark/evil elves and fae in general.

» Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:12 pm

I'd like to think that Skyrim is based off LOTR too, but then again, LOTR is also based on something else before its creation.

» Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:31 am

Everything was inspired by something before it. Skyrim is inspired by a lot of things, not just LOTR.

Yes, Skyrim did borrow some stuff from LOTR. Just look at Whiterun. They didn't all get that from Norse Mythology, they got that from LOTR. Just look at the design of the place. It looks almost exactly like Edoras. Also, the green tree of Whiterun? Come on...

Hey, there is nothing wrong with that. Diablo 3 borrowed from LOTR too. The "Golden City" looks a lot like the White City of Gondor.