I don't think the civil war is really over when we take the enemy stronghold, I mean it can't be over until the Jarl Moot and a new High King is selected.

I have become convinced that this will be the first major DLC, by choosing a side you stacked the deck, filling up the Holds with Jarls that support either Ulfric of Elisif. However, I think when the DLC drops we will be offered a 3rd option, becoming High King/Queen ourselves.

I mean we are the Dragonborn, and what have the Dragonborn done for thousands of years? Ruled the Empire.

Skyrim, I think, is about history repeating itself, the first dragonborn fighting Alduin, then going out and creating an Empire. Now we have to fulfill that function and create a new Empire. It will be like Shivering Isles but with the whole of Skyrim.

I can almost sympathize with the Empire. It's in a terrible position.

But that is no excuse. The greatest duty of all men of arms is the protection of the innocent. Those who raise those arms against the innocent, or sheathe them when others do, should have those arms removed.

Oh, and I'd like to support any Thalmer DLC. There's no way Bethesda crafted this new enemy without eventually giving us the opportunity to smash them.

Heck, that works for Imperial and Stormcloak supporters, so it wouldn't even conflict with the ongoing story.

Itkovian

If that is what you read, you have no comprehension.

He read that the Thalmor supports them - even unknowingly - that is good enough evidence to see that the Stormcloaks fighting the Empire is a win in the Thalmor's eyes.

Ulfred is not in contact with them, and not an active agent of them. He is being used by them yes, but not knowingly as he inferred.

I can only agree!

The Empire may have it's flaws. I mean we don't have Democracy in Tamriel, it is a medieval setting. We must keep that in mind. But with all it's flaws, indeed the alternative to the Empire is racism everywhere. In the Empire race didn't matter. Everyone could become someone! But what I see in those Stormcloaks is indeed mostly "Skyrim for Nords" racism. Since I always supported the Empire in Elder Scrolls as "personal friend of Uriel Septim VII", it was a clear decision for me anyway. For a while I had sympathy with the Stormcloaks, until I saw a bit behind the curtain.

On top, if the Nords of Skyrim really delcared independence, the Aldmeri Dominion would simply conquer the human kingdoms one by one. And how far will they go anyway? Until every tiny village is it's own kingdom? See how Ulfric treated everyone they felt belonged to the Foresworn. Nah, the Stormcloaks are just selfish racists.

Long live the Empire! ^^

So because one Officer is incompetent you let all of humanity fall under Altmer-Nazi rule? Great...

the man-races are kinda lame, so I'm ok with this

So the game doesn't force you to join either one? Rawk.

Considering the fact, that the people playing this game that are into the lore and read all the books in the game say, "join the empire the thalmos want the storm cloaks to regain skyrim. So they have one less faction to fight when against the empire".

When you see the Thalmos roaming the lands they tell you to get away they are on a important delivery and if you dont they will attack.

I would say if you want to go along with the lore join the empire, but if you want to have fun join the Storm cloaks because they attack citys.

It explicitly stated that Ulfric maintained contact with the Thalmor until the "Markarth incident". Try to sound like less of an asshat next time you try to correct someone, especially if you're not entirely sure yourself.

as already said, they do not whant that.
they want them to fight each other but a stormclaks victory must be avoided.

imo who win is not that different for them, if the empire win they'll become stable again and will be able to fight the thalmore.
if the stormclaks win, they'll fight the thalmore (sorry i don't think they can just watch as their neighbor get detroyed w/o doing anything) as soon as they'll invade the empire ( since they know thalmore is the real enemy. the second in command say it during their quest line )

From what I've read and heard, I believe the Thalmor would rather the Stormcloaks win the war than the Empire even though they don't want either of them to win. Even if the Stormcloaks win, they will be in no position to fight the Thalmor since the war would have taken it's toll on their armies. If they were having trouble with a Legion that was at less than 50% strength, how could they be victorious against the Aldmeri Dominion which crushed 3 Legions?

The entire Stormcloak cause is undermined by the fact that Ulfric's a total tool. Their cause isn't necessarily bad. They've just had the misfortune to rally around a [censored].

Although I still sympathise more with the Empire because it needs stability right now to combat the far more important threat of the Aldmeri Dominion.

The redguards fought the Thalmor (by themselves?), and won their land back, and freedom. The empire has to realize the position it's in, things are never going to be the same again, you can continue to fight it, weakening themselves, and the other races, or they can accept their new reality. That being to allow the nords to also secede, but in return gaining an alliance with them, and hopefully with the redguards, high rock, and possibly some bosmer and khajiit, to defeat the Thalmor.

Being an anarchocapitalist, I can't agree with your statement. Anything that has any sort of central rule is foolish.

The Empire outlawed Talos worship because of the White Tower Concordance, and let the Thalmar execute anyone they think worships Talos. So screw the Empire, we'll fight the Aldmeri Dominion on our own if we have to!

It seems to me that the two sides arn't Good and Bad like black and white, They both have many shades of grey.

Put this into perspective. The empire is the only one keeping the damn Thalmor at bay while their emperor risks looking like a coward and traitor to save his people and Ulfric is just another usurper king trying for power, candycoating his goals with "Freedom fighting" . Also note not even most nords want outsiders gone. Its just the stormcloaks and their supporters.

For me, the decision came down to who was more of an [censored]. Imperials had no evidence of criminal activity, but decided to behead me anyway. The Stormcloaks are racist idiots. One was a case of unfair justice, but the other is a faulty ideology. I'm offended by both sides, but at least the Imperials have a chance for long term success; the Stormcloaks are just making a mess.

they took the realistic approach
no such thing as good guys

think I won't do any of the 2 qeusts and just kill imperials and stormcloacks whenever I see fit
all power hungry bastards in my eyes

Wait, because they want to expel an army of foreign invaders who are imposing their own laws and customs over your own, that makes them racists? The Empire isn't a democracy, it's not particularly enlightened or benevolent. Without benevolent rule or consent of the governed, what's the legitimacy of their government? You could make the point that Tiber Septim was a Nord, and thus the founding dynasty would be a legitimate rule of Skyrim, but the heirs of Tiber Septim's body were slain in 3E 53, and the throne was usurped by the the Dunmer, as described in 'The Madness of Pelagius'.

So, you've got an empire that's run by and for foreigners occupying your homeland, for no better reason than the throne they usurped once belonged to a man who came from your country. Seems to me like the Stormcloaks are entirely in the right.

I don't understand... is Skyrim and the empire at risk of falling under invasion at some point in the game? Or are all of you just following lore and assuming a staunch role to play? Could a war with the dominion be possible DLC or something and whatever you chose have an effect then?

Alot of you guys are saying how skyrim needs to remain under Empire control in order for humans as a whole to survive but perhaps you guys should consider the possibility that skyrim could still hold out against the Thalmor through divine intervention and that the empire would not be needed at all!!!

Perhaps with skyrim under Stormcloak hands reintroducing Talos worship, Talos might intervene and stop the Thalmor extermination of all humans