I don't believe StahlFaustus was suggesting that at all, but he'll have to answer for himself.

It's a common mistake that people equate PC and console architecture and try to extrapolate conclusions from that but they're really totally different. The discussion above of the weirdness in the PS3's architecture should give you sufficient hint of that. Consoles also have the advantage of providing more direct low-level access to hardware which is something you can do when 100% of your target audience is on the same platform, so things cut both ways - while console hardware is slower on paper, that lower-level access can make up for it, particularly in cases where API overhead is a bottleneck on PCs. Where API overhead is not a bottleneck (or the bottleneck is sufficiently lower) PC pulls ahead.

Read this: http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=61567 (the second post is particularly instructive).

My own experience in PC space is that AMD are significantly stronger at geometry throughput whereas NVIDIA are much better when it comes to fillrate. I've seen simple screen overlays or render to texture passes pull AMD down to half performance whereas NVIDIA barely even blink an eyelid at it, while start pushing polygon counts to stupid levels and AMD come to the front, being able to take extremely high counts that bring NVIDIA to their knees.

For a more balanced test that stresses both, I can push 1,000,000 fully dynamic particles at 15fps on Kepler but same at just over 20fps on Northern Islands, so even in that case AMD can still pull ahead, even with previous gen hardware vs NVIDIA's current gen. I still prefer NVIDIA for driver quality overall, but there's nothing like some hard figures to wipe away any fanboyism.

The plural of anecdote is not data however and it may be the case that my private benchmarks are sufficiently limited to only be reflective of other conditions prevailing when I've run them.

Oh ya, They do have their pros and cons indeed, they are both different. Whether or not GPUs perform any different on a console, I have no idea. On the PC side I do know that ATI has always had trouble with their drivers. Whether their card is better in a raw test however, no one will ever know for sure because of that fact. I guess I should have clarfied myself better

I doubt sony restricted them from allowing Doom 3 BFG to be installed on the hdd. I mean the game isn't nearly the size of RAGE and a partial install would've helped tremendously.

And yes I did notice the lack of flashlight shadows, missing blood spatter, missing imp shadows/plasma gun shadows right away.

I hate to break up the coding and preformance talk, but in all honesty the minor graphical issues don't really seem all that important to me when playing a game from 2004.

The control issue, on the other hand, is a very big deal. How hard is it to add a few lines of code to let players swap out the sprint button? I love Doom. I have since 1993. I bought this game for my PS3 day one, and it has been sitting on my shelf after a day or two of play the Doom 1 & 2 ports because Doom 3 is basically unplayable with the sprint button mapped on L3.

Id.... Bethesda... anyone? Can you just please fix this? I'd really like to play this game I bought.

Yep, that is another huge issue I have with the game. It seems ridiculous they put the flashlight on l1 when theres an unused circle/B button right there.

Nope. I just say that the 360's gpu is a better design than the PS3 gpu despite lower floating point performance.

Most people are focused on calculations per second when it comes to performance but this is only one half of the story.
Bandwidth is more important today with these large amounts of data that have to be rendered.

The internal 10Mb rendering buffer of the 360 GPU has a much wider data bus than the external PS3 gpu.
Increasing the data buses on a motherboard from chip to memory is heavily limited due to physics. Longer data bus = higher resistance.
On a chip die, the databuses are much smaller and shorter and therefore less affected by this problem enabling the possibility for much wider data paths.
But die space is limited and on-chip memory is usually much smaller.
Additionally, external memory has far higher latency than internal.
That's why all main processors have second level caches.

Some math for rendering a single frame at a resolution of 1920x1080 at 32 bits colordepth:

1920x1080=2073600 ( number of pixels per frame)
2073600 pixels x 32 (bit per pixel) = 66355200 (bits per frame)

66355200 / 8 (to get byte) = 8294400 = approx 8 megabyte per frame

Means you can render a single frame on the 360 gpu without ever having to access external memory.

The internal rendering memory of the 360's gpu provides a 32 gigabyte per second data bus.
The frame rendering bandwidth on the PS3 GPU is limited to 22.4 GB.

So despite having approximately twice the floating point power of the 360's gpu, the PS3 gpu has significantly less bandwith to it's external memory.
The bandwidth is the PS3 gpu's bottleneck.
That's why fillrate is lower and leads to less pixels rendered at the same time.

Result: Lower framerate, lower texture- and sometimes even lower screen resolution to cope with this.




Perfectly right.
Drivers are a necessity for pcs with interchangeable graphics cards to connect those to the apis.
Drivers are practically nonexistent on consoles.
Ati fails at the driver support. So this is no issue on consoles.

Totally agree. The bad habit of not making the controls configurable seems to be contagious.
Although customization to the player's needs is a very important point in making a game accessible.

I guess "bethesda mode" only works for skyrim.

It doesn't seem to work for anything id - sorry - there is no merit to bethesda's way of doing things based on skyrim's success. Ofcourse they can do that when they have 1000 people in forums all day that keeps everyone busy.

So where's our patch Bethesda? Ubisoft is issuing a patch for AC3 on Thanksgiving. What's the problem here with an 8 year old game?

This is [censored].

Honestly, the wait time for these bug fixes is atrocious. It is a smack in the face to the doom community. Complete dissappointment.

So wheres the patch?

Here is Id Brian Harris Steam profile : http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197971402380/ And He play with Doom 3 BFG Edition PC 335,8 hour and He have 0/65 achivements so MAYBE HE VERY VERY TEST THE NEW PATCH ! And He uploaded the pic for Steam "flashlight shadows looks like ass" but We see that pic in Twitter so nothing new.....

So wish I'd just bought the boxed edition so I could flog the buggy mess. It's been well over a month and nothing except more tripe to milk people with and even that is sub par.

Such shoddy practices, it truly is.

How the mighty have fallen. And to be frank if this is how the treat consumers they can poke Doom 4 where the sun doesn't shine.

Awful.

He doesn't even respond to questions about Doom 3 BFG Edition on his twitter anymore. I've given up on the idea that they care and are making a patch honestly. Zero communication with the fans who bought your glitchfest is disrespectful.

0 achievements? It sounds like it's mostly idling in game or something..

Which is kind of a weird claim considering he replied to two questions on 23rd November.


Or else he has the console enabled.

I said questions about the Doom 3 BFG Edition. Or any word from Bethesda about the patch. (If it even exists at this point)

why should he? Do you answer questions about your job that people ask on twitter?

Yes, and both of them were about BFG Edition. Your point is?

Well if you are paying for a good or service, then yea you have the right to complain to those who made the game.

I ask Gstaff about the Doom 3 BFG Edition ! And He answer Me !

Question : Hello any info new patch ? Brian Harris ?@idBrianHarris say on Twitter this : Flashlight shadows look like ass, but we're adding the option anyway.And He link this : http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=104299880 on October 23 !
So new info ? Patch release date ? Master levels for Doom 2 and Final Doom come for Doom 3 BFG Edition purchasable DLC ? New achivements come ? pls answer !

Answer : Should be soon. stay tuned.


So cool ! I can't wait ! Don't hate me about the question or the DLC ! I just want that expansions for My Doom 3 BFG Edition and free or not free I do not care I pay for it ! And yes I want more achivements ! Don' hate Me ! Ahh and I hope We have chose to change the color in multiplayer marine ! And hope We have Multiplayer online for Doom 1 and Doom 2 in PC BFG Edition !

You can have multiplayer color anything you want in ZDoom and its derivatives

I don't like mods but thx ! I want a normal Doom 3 BFG Edition Doom 1 and Doom 2 online PC Multi !

Very brief and vague response. Typical. When is soon? Why do companies always say soon when it's not actually gonna be soon?