Aren't there other ways of balancing things than just remove stuff? The Alteration method could be limited to a rather distant perk with a skill req or something.

Very true. I look forward to whoever puts that mod out.

And a diesel works different to a petrol version but both are engines.

A spell by any other name is still a spell.

But while it may be more 'realistic', at the very same time there is no option for a Mage or a Warrior to open chests. I can understand not including bashing the lock, [its very stupid not too and would be very easy to implement compared to other things], but completely removing a spell that many wanted for balancing purposes isn't right. As of right now locking picking isn't balanced and the perks are completely useless. I thinl that they should of balanced the perks more and kept the spell in. It's just Bethesda being lazy.

They can actually do that? Oh, goodie, I am so going to have to check that out!

Well I think the answer to why Bethesda removed the open lock spell is pretty obvious, if you cant figure it out then there really is no hope for you and I wont bother explaining it to you, but I will agree with you in saying that the College of Winterhold was pretty lame.


Ok what is so "hilariously out of character" about your character picking locks? Is your character a ham fisted clutz with fat fingers? Does he have some sort mental deficiency that prevents him from learning how to pick locks the good old fasioned way?

No, its not. Its a greater power and works differently than spells do.

Mainly because it made lockpicking redundant.

I never denied that. Thank you kind sir for pointing out the obvious. The op wrote in the title that beth took that feature out, but they didn't.

Yes, they did take it out. There is no longer an unlock spell. there is an open expert lock once a day greater power, that is it. Not the same thing, at all.

anyway, we definitely need it, and all of the the cut spells back. Magic in Skyrim is a joke compared to previous titles.

How did you know?

Your logic is invalid. Greater Power =/= Spell

Its a spell with an extra long cool down. Your just being pedantic.

LOLZ, this ^^^
Then balance and fix it. If not, leave it in, gives more choices.

No, its not a spell at all. spells are subject to silence, greater powers aren't. Spells require magicka, greater powers do not. unlock spells go up to master, this greater power doesnt.

Well, it really makes it so that you can choose whether to handle locked objects via magic or via the lockpicking skill. A bonus for having the costs of spell go way up here is that you could easily do lockpicking without any perk investment. However, if you use spells, you'd need to have some perk investment or equipment to have an affordable cost for the spell -- well, they could make it that way in terms of mana requirements.

Advantage then of lockpicking? You can get more gold, better treasure, etc with its perks (maybe the lockpicking perks would need a buff, maybe not).

In general, I don't see a problem with having a magic way to do things and a mundane way. As long as each has its own benefits and costs to make them more or less balanced with each other.

Overall I don't think theres a big reason we don't have lockpicking via magic with costs of say 100, 300, 600, 900, 1200 mana for novice, apprentice, adept, expert, and master locks. I think those costs would make it fairly prohibitive if you didn't do significant investment in alteration. Well, I would say they should probably get rid of 0 cost spellcasting (cap the reduction from items or make an overall cap like with resistances).

They did. They made it a greater power that can be used once a day.

Maybe not the best decision I know. But that's how they chose to balance it.

I don't really see the need of an unlock spell in Skyrim. That would make lockpicking even more useless than it is now (you can open master locks by spending no perks or having a high skill number in it). But I agree magic is really dumped down in Skyrim.

Pretty funny
Though, I'd suddenly expect mages to be smart and know all about locking mechanisms. I dunno.


Is this going to be like how Imperials have no +Speechcraft, but they have Voice of the Emperor and Imperial Coin Luck? Totally breaks old lore

Its called choices. It wouldnt make anything pointless. different skills and proficiencies for different builds. With your logic there's no need for any melee weapons other than swords, or no need for more than one race.

Stop arguing over whether is a spell or not. The matter of the fact is there ISN'T a spell that you can cast that will open a door multiple times a day. That is what we need.
That's not balancing it, thats removing one feature and leaving in a old feature. And it's horrible balencing to remove somthing that wan't broken

I think you don't see my point. Only because we are having a discussion does NOT automatically mean that I have the exact opposite opinion of yours.

It wasn't broken per se, but I think the reason it was removed was because having an illusion spell you could cast continuously to open master locks would make the whole lockpicking skill, along with its entire perk tree, completely redundant.

Not saying I agree with the decision to remove it by the way. Luckily because the effect still exists as a greater power, it has not been removed, so we modders can add the spells back to the game without too much of an issue when the CK is out.

It's a limited unlock greater power. Spells can be cast at any time, greater powers cannot.
The original poster wishes for an unlock spell which can be cast at any time. That's quite simple to understand, really.
And there really is no reason for Bethesda not to have added it. They already had a limited version within The Tower greater power.

What point? Different options for different builds. unlock spells wouldnt make lock picking redundant, or useless. What makes lock picking useless is Beth giving the ability to anybody, to open any type of lock regardless of character skill. and for RP reasons, its still not useless.