Their purpose is variety and options. Is there a purpose to warpaint or scars? Not beyond customizing your character, there isn't. That is it's own purpose and one I would like in the magic system.

As for this thread, I'd like to see more variety in what I can summon. I want to be able to summon more weapon types. Not just a sword, battleaxe and bow. I want to be able to summon more monsters, like other types of daedra, I want to be able to summon animals like wolves, bears and saber cats. Some sort of healbot would be nice, whatever form it would take. Let me summon spriggans. Would I use them all on any one character? Of course not, but it would give options for different types of characters.

Spellcasters who specialize in death and reanimating dead bodies into mindless slaves sure doesn't seem all fluffy bunny to me. =p

Specialize in death? I'd say that more applies to the students of destruction... And when you remove the taboo of "it's the corpse of uncle x", their work isn't that different from building a golem (and definately less evil than controlling one's mind with illussion spells).

Yeah i have to agree with that.The lack of spell variety is disappointing

choices have been lost- of course Conjuration suffers. Look at the poll in this forum, though- a majority of posters thought the pre game hype lived up to the game. That means people are more than happy with the loss of choices.

Turns out the modern gamer didn't want choices after all; he just wanted to choose what color and type of clothing his hero wore, and the hair style on his head.

Yes, if you get over all the moral and gross-out-factor problems involved in raising a corpse, it's totally morally acceptable and not at all gross.

Similarly, once you get over the moral and gross-out-factor problems with eating babies, it's totally morally acceptable and not at all gross.

I like it that you can have 2 summons (with perks) and that there are spells that are permanent summons (until it dies) and I think necromancy has been improved I do however greatly miss the larger amount of summon spells and variation.

Yes, let's compare two completely different things. A dead body is a dead body - it might be gross, but the debates over morality of it's use are a matter of constant discussions on RPG boards. Mostly because it cannot be said to be universally bad when it comes to the moral aspect. Were Dunmer evil because they created bonewalkers out of their dead?

At the same time, eating a baby is an act which will be called evil and immoral in every culture (apart from the most twisted and evil ones).

RE: the OP. In a word yes. But not just conjuration, all magic schools have been reduced in scope from prior games.

I couldn't agree more. Conjuration, with more quantity, has the potential to upgrade alot of RP.

Want to play a druidic character? Smaller wildlife summons and a Spriggan would be awesome.

Rangers would certainly benefit in dabbling if bears, cats, etc. were a potential.

A character based on the Daedric quests? Well, not much available to you in the current school of conjuration until you've all but maxed the skill -- and then for only one kind of dremora.

Paladins? Wouldn't it be great if you could summon past saints, knights of the nine, or heros of lore?

The list, of course, is only limited by imagination, but pure conjuration as a school *needs* variety both for a pure conjurer and to mix with other RPs. It seems they listened to the OB outcry -- "Wouldn't it be sh-ts and giggles to be a necro?!" -- and instead of creating a new school for necromancy, they crammed it into conjuration. Not that I'm against a necro school, I just wish they'd added it as a seperate skill instead of it weeding out conjuration.

TWO Dremora Lords make up for it easily. One of those guys can solo a whole dungeon.

And well, being on the PC, I just made a bunch of spells to spice it up a bunch. I just finished a spell where I can teleport anyone to hell.












I just need to make a cell that I can call hell. But right now I just teleport nasties to Whiterun to be slaughtered by guards.

Agreed. There are a lot of alchemy enthusiasts here, so I don't think that 99% number holds water. And most of what I have read on this forum about Skyrim Alchemy has been pretty positive, especially when compared to Smithing, Enchanting or any of the magic schools.

I have seen some complaints about alchemy. Generally they revolve around being boring (all the time spent collecting ingredients and in front of the alchemy lab) or taking too long to level. That poster, though, is the only person I've ever seen complain that it had too much variety. If I had to put money on anything, it would be him being in the minority. That's just based on what I've seen on these forums, though.

Gosh, those complaints you read about all the time spent collecting ingredients, in front of the alchemy lab, and taking too long to level, well that would be three of the things Bethesda did right with Alchemy IMO. But having a deep and interesting variety of ingredients and potions is good too, just wish you could make a shield potion.

I didn't say I shared those complaints.

Never bothered using it in past games, and with reanimate corpse effect I actually like the skill in this game.

Dead Thralls are already the strongest in game. A forsworn ravager equipped with legendary absorb health swords and legendary forsworn armor destoryed 15 Dragur Death Overlords. Yes, 15, at the same time. That is more than most dragonborns are capable of.

View the Dead Thrall NPC wars report here: http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1333470-complete-character-design-freedom-damage-resist-caps-and-ridiculous-damage-thread-9/page__st__150

Magic in Skyrim is about as deep as a dried up puddle.

Does every conversation have to descend into illogical hyperbole? This place is really becoming an echo chamber.

Conjuration in Skyrim focused mostly on Necromancy in my opinion, probably due to the thousands of people clamoring for a better version than Oblivion's system.

It's got it kinks, sure, but there are literally hundreds more summons because of Necromancy.

I wouldn't say nerfed either, if you want to say that there are less daedric summons or familiars... then you would be entirely right.

Conjuration is easily the strongest school of Magicka in Skyrim and arguably the strongest it has ever been because of perks in the tree, Vampirism + the Resto perk, and the range of Thralls you can make.

These things are not so one-sided as people make them out to be, if you're going to criticize... do it specifically. I'm sure many of you are more intelligent than your comments would have people believe.

Okay, how is this for three specific, non-hyperbolic criticisms of Skyrim's conjuration skill.

One. I really don't like how everything becomes an ash pile after the summon wears off until you get the master spell and can make permanent thralls. Goes from underpowered to overpowered with one skill point. They should have a perk somewhere half way up the tree that makes the reanimated dead not turn to ash piles so you can recast.

Two. They need to fix the bug in Elemental Potency so your summoning staves still work if you take that perk.

Three. They need more variety on the conjuration side. Sure you can reanimate a lot of different dead things, but some of us want to be conjurers, not necromancers. They don't have much variety on the conjuration side. Need bound armor too.

zombies cant even leave a dungeon without falling to ashes anymore, its dumb....very dumb.

Conjuration got the short end of the stick if your asking me.

Not even your thralls?

Conjuration is defiantly in a sad state right now and it's not for a lack of things that could be done I mean you could summon wisps,spriggans and wraiths but for some reason you can't
I don't see why they cant add some kind of mechanist aspect to the game so you could "Summon" the dwarven Spheres,spider and centurion.
And they could also add a stronger taming skill where you could tame spiders,wolves,bears and the like.

It just seems kind of sad, all these things seems like they would be pretty easy to implement too.

IDK about Clannfear, but I'm pretty sure Hunger>Flame Atronach... so where are the Hungers?



Remove it and come back here with an update.