Agreed. I'm sure that even the folks at Obsidian, being veterans of the FO1/2 combat mechanics, want to return to this as well. Of course, we have a whole new portion of the fanbase now that absolutely cringes at turn-based combat, not to mention high review/publisher expectations following Fallout 3's style of play. I guess they should just use both the real-time and VATS systems of Fallout 3, but VATS has to be severely overhauled to be more semblant of the original system.

Oh! The other possibility is, for real-time, to use the system in Fallout: Tactics. I don't remember the specifics, but it, like FO3 combat, found a nice way to blend standard turn-based combat with regular combat, by having your AP regenerate in real-time and the like. Not sure if it'd be much of an improvement, but it could work...


It's not outdated - it worked just as well, if not better, than the Fallout 3 system. If you get rid of player preferences, it was certainly less broken than the current SPECIAL implementation.


The game is going to be in 3D, obviously. This debate concerns the combat system.


hardcoe Doom and Quake fan here, which may help to break the stereotype that us turn-based supporters are just too old fashioned and cursed with slow reflexes. It's not that I hate realtime, so much as the FO1/2 system has been proven to work and FO3's has not.

I'd rather have Fo3's style, for the most part. Improvements to the dialogue, storyline, and the SPECIAL/skills system would be fine, I would never say no to improvements like that. But flat out 2D, turn based gameplay? Nooooooooooooo way. It ruins the immersive aspect of the game, and it's tedious after a while to just click on the options on menus. I did NOT like Final Fantasy for that, and I haven't ever tried out more than one because I didn't like the story enough to where the turn-based gameplay wouldn't bother me. (The story actually wasn't very good in my opinion)

One thing I loved about Fallout 3 was how you could explore, and it didn't feel absolutely fake. Isometric views and, especially, 2D/turn-based gameplay aren't very good for that sort of thing. No offense to those who like that sort of thing.

Sure. Who didn't think waiting for 15 rats to slowly crawl across the screen was fun when you were like level 15 and your mere looks should have killed them?

Fallout 3's system may not have been perfect, but don't for a second think that Fallout's or Fallout 2's system was perfect either.

real time combat is the future of gaming.

the only reason FO1/2 and BG 1/2 style ever existed is because they didn't have the capability of real time combat like we do now. even squaresoft knows this which is why they are prolly gonna make the next final fantasy a real time sandbox as indicated in a recent interview

nah sorry dude but its outdated, hell it was outdated when oblivion came out. just so you know i'm an old baldurs gate fanatic myself but i know when to let an outdated system remain outdated.

sure the FO3 system was crappy but its only because it was lazily done and it didn't have to be. theres nothing wrong with the concept of real time RPG and its the way that the entire biz is going, in fact i have confidence that obsidian is gonna be the first to do it right ( as long as lucas arts is far far away).

my main complaint is how the challenge aspect that made baldurs gate so endearing has become an alien concept to devs as they are becoming more and more slaves to marketers

Please stop branding your opinion and taste in games as blanket factual statements.

it's pretty much 100% confirmed its fallout 3 style...

if this game was fa1/2 style ide be so peed off. but its the same as fa3. first or third person (depends on what you like. i myself play on 3rd person)

if the old fallout gameplay was in NV it would have to be degraded by 500% from fallout 3
I just dont think that will happen for some odd reason. :mellow:
but no matter how much you may want it to be like the old style its gonna be like FO3 so nah nah nah na boo boo stick your head in doo doo =P

It will have to be first person perspective, or it won't be for me.
LOL, the only way I can play GTA IV is using a mod that puts the player in first person. I just can't play a game any other way. I'll lose interest within minutes.

Fallout - 1997

Doom - 1993
Wolfenstein - 1992
Quake - 1996
Diablo - 1996
Warcraft 2 - 1995
Daggerfall - 1996
Super Mario 64 - 1996

Yeah, I know what you mean. We're lucky Fallout 1 wasn't text based!

You can't be serious. Real time combat has been around since the early years of electronic gaming. Turn based is a design decision, nothing more nothing less. You may not like turn based and that's perfectly fine, but saying it's outdated is just asinine.

First post so I expect to be flamed for something ignorant- pardon me if I didn't read the thousand posts on this forum yet.

On topic- Wasn't VATS slighty turn based? I'm not saying like you shot a bullet, then your enemy did, then you did, etc, but you had action points and could do certain actions while your enemy was doing them at the same time? NOTICE I SAID SLIGHTY SO DONT BLOW MY HOUSE UP. It felt like a combination of turn based and real time for some reason. But maybe that's just me.

If F3's gameplay returns (I read it is), I just hope they make it better looking. I don't want my guy to slide across the ground, I want him to actually walk.

i didn't. my statement is obvious with the slew of sandbox real time combat RPGs that have been released since oblivion (RPGish). and like i said even square realizes this since a honcho over there mentioned that they were looking as western studios as a platform for the next final fantasy. hell FF12 is a blatant examlpe of even the japanese getting jumping on the wagon

the point is that old school turn based systems only existed because they didn't have the capability of producing fun real time RPG battles, its outdated and lazy to produce an "RPG" with turn based battle in 2009

ha don't worry dude i haven't seen a whole lot of flaming on this board so far, in fact i've seen very few controntational posts whatsoever. anyways i agree with you that VATS was turn based, even more so since you were impervious to damage while in VATS. also, i too wish that 3rd person POV hadn't been so lame. its almost as if they slapped it in just before production

Thats comforting, thank you for the heads up.

i was talking about RPG real time. not FO1/2, BG 1/2, NWN2, DA:O, or KOTOR.

turn based is absolutely outdated for modern games and theres a reason why the japanese are jumping off that sinking ship. they lived their life, gave us great games and need to be put to rest

I much prefer first-person view and real-time. It's much more immersive and realistic. I really dislike the isometric view, I can't immerse myself in something that I see from a bird's eye view. Everything becomes tiny, distant and without details.

I know that New Vegas will be FPS type.


But I would pick Fallout 1 and 2 type of gameplay anyday.
It is far more tactical than real time action, and your character skills would really matter.


And why everyone say that Fallout 1 and 2 style is only 2D? Never played newer UFO games? They are 3D and still turn based.


Even if they would use same engine what they used on Fallout 1 and 2 it would be far more superior game over Oblivion engine.
Yes, isometric 2D graphics FTW!

edit - and I'am dead serious

I lol'd.

It will be a FPS, First Person Shooter. Thank GOD it's not Turn based and Fo1/Fo2 gameplay

^agreed.

I've got too used the falllout 3 style to go back now. I like aiming for the heads of molerats MYSELF and blasting it off. It adds more of the dreaded IMMERSION into the game world for me. Although, I'd like the FPS elements of the game to be improved GREATLY. I can't be bothered to explain why.

To me, immersion in a RPG isnt due to a camera angle or the style of combat. Its due to the writing, and how good or consistent it is.
I personally found the older games to be far more immersive than Fallout 3 could ever hope to be. It cant really even be nostalgia. I played Fallout and Fallout 2 for the first time in the 2000's.

I've played Fo1 again last year and it was a much more memorable experience than Fallout 3.

Hell, the game that made me really emotional about my companions was Arcanum: Of Steamworks And Magick Obscura, not some FPS.

Virgil and Sebastian. <3 Magnus was great too. Man, now I have to replay Arcanum again.

There were plenty of real time RPGs before Fallout.



Tell that to Sid Meier; he'd probably laugh in your face. You're free to have your own opinion, but don't be surprised if I strongly disagree with you. The reason turn based games aren't as common anymore is because the industry has gone completely mainstream, and publishers and investors are only interested in a profit margin and thus they refuse to fund "niche" games. It has nothing to do with turn based games being "outdated".



People keep telling me that I need to play that game. Alas the only Troika game I've played is Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines, but since I consider Bloodlines one of the best RPGs of the last decade I suppose that I should try out Arcanum sometime.