Yes the GOTY award is a big deal....we should not be rewarding companies for selling broken products...Look at the ps3 version ffs.

I didn't say anything even remotely like what you try and represent. If you had an honest bone in your body you would have realised that before you typed your reply. I said I realise it is difficult to make a new patch and them taking their time is cool. I think 1.2 should be pulled in the meantime though.

It has more to with quality customer service than a 'sense of entitlement'.

Apologists throw that sense of entitlement stuff around like candy like they even have a clue what it means. Bethesda doesn't need cheerleaders.

you say broken rest of world says needs patch for some issues.

as for 1.2 since it fixs some other issues anyway and im not bothered about resistances for now it would be worse for me i think to run stock version but some people would rather go on about how they are on 1.whatever then compalain they have issues they probably would if they had updated who also would probably of not been bothered by reistacnes issue.

Does 1.2 actually fix anything? I never downloaded it. 1.1 for 360 is fine. From what I understand the texture issues and the install/don't install issues are still present in 1.2

Seems to me like the only real signiifcant change 1.2 made is to reverse magic resistances and turn them into wekanesses.

The communication i was referring to wasn't an apology but as has been said a known buglist and a working on this buglist,something that'll stop people having to keep revisiting the site just to know if it's worth rolling a new toon or if theres a chance that last weeks patch will appear.
Sgt Butter my point was neither i nor you gave the GOTY award so whether it gives the game esteem is entirely in the consumers eye,other than that it's just free advertising revenue from sites such as the BBC.

The 1.2 patch for the PS3 helped with save file bloating but at the same time people report that it made thier games freeze more often and the other things you know about like the backwards dragons and resistances and on the 360 it was supposed to fix the texture problem but it's being said the problem is still their. All in all the 1.2 patch for PS3 broke more than it fixed pretty much.

ah well im on 360 so dont care about ps3 to be honest or pc . each will have its own issues as with any game.

since he posted about the PS3 version I just thought I'd let you know what exactly the patch did for it so you understood what he meant about the PS3 version being broken ontop of the lag issue.

You do know Bethesda don't have to do anything in the area of patches right?

It's a PRIVILEGE not a RIGHT.

The only reason any company releases updates and patches is because it keeps faith in them and the games they make and get them money. And moaning aimlessly helps no one, because you're not providing anything that could help them fix it faster. Which is what you and other users want right? A patch as soon as possible?

So wouldn't it make sense for people to look for a solution and, if it doesn't exist, explain the problem or find there own solution? Seriously, you sound like a bigger whinger then anyone I have come across CockneyCharmer.

oh yer didnt mean anything by it, just ps3 will have issues not the same as 360 and some will be same. but this goes back to the bbc news of game of year, one issue on the news page was save file which was fixed in 1.2 for most people on ps3

The PlayStation version is not the only version having major issues, and I'm glad its getting negative press. In no way shape or form does this game deserve GOTY. I'ts good when it runs right great even, but sorry it's not running properly. Broken magic resistance is a big deal, a game mechanic broke because of a patch....that's just sad.

if the Game Engine is so complex, and can't run properly on day 1 they should have waited at least another year before releasing it. Unacceptable.

"Unacceptable..." but I bet you still bought it, and are still playing? Or is your game "broken?"

Charmer one thing you fail to realize is that this is a business and not a complete fan service they don't work their asses off for months on in so you can get 100% of everything you ever wanted. They do it to make a [censored] living for themselves. They can't know every single little bug in the game it's just not possible to do that. The game did not ship out "INCOMPLETE" it was put on the market for business reasons. You bring up some excellent points for sure and I can agree on most but in reality a game of this magnitude it can't be helped.

You said it yourself, not everyone but a good amount of people can't play. You can't really expect a business to know who and what problems specific people are having and you can't expect them to be fixed so easily. You FAIL to understand that they are trying to do it and that they didn't ship this game out telling themselves that it is a bug ridden mess. No because it isn't for everyone and some people experience things other don't. You see a lot of complaining on the forums because those are the people actually suffering. The rest are still enjoying this great game. I don't blindly defend the company. But for me personally I have experienced almost NO bugs at all literally completed every quest I could with zero problems. So for ME the game is 100% GOTY period.

Should we start awarding GOTY to games that run smoothly but have OK stories and OK gameplay. No we shouldn't and if you weren't so blinded by your mindset that bethesda has let us all down you would be able to understand how big and amazing the game is.

They fix one thing and something else can happen over somewhere else that is just how it is period. You can sit here and point out how bad of a job they did and point out how it should have been done but that is completely meaningless and pointless because you can't compare the problem to anything else. Bethesda made this game and Bethesda is fixing the game. Trying to say HOW it could of been done or how it should have been done is mute.


They deserve game of the year because the game is a damn good game period. A few hundred thousand people who are having issues with bugs doesn't take away what the game is and what it has done.

Get over your self centered opinion that [censored] needs to be done RIGHT. When you have no clue what is going on back doors in their offices and studio.

Thank you

Wait. So if I buy, say, a car, and it runs when it wants to and stalls in traffic and the heat or lights work interittently, a fix to that car would be a privelege? Are you out of your mind? Theyd' be sued. Now this is entertainment not a car, in understand that, and it's orders of magnitude different moneywise, but what if I bought a toaster, and it froze the bread instead of toasting it? Would I be upset? Would it be an inconvenience to have to return it? Or wouldn't I expect it fixed?

When someone sells something, and it is advertised to do x, y, z, one has the expectation that it DOES x, y, z, or they either a) get their money back on return or it gets fixed. That's what "capitalism" is all about. Or the next item someone sells won't sell and the company will end up in receivership.

Now, if a bunch of people got bit by a bunch of bugs in previous bethesda products and then bought this one anyway, shame on them. But the last Beth product I bought was Oblivion and it was a GOTY package by then and it came with a huge official patch. (And the pc version has a huger unofficial patch).

That works fine so long as you know that completing certain quests first might corrupt future other quests so you watch out for that. That's what the UESP wiki excels at helping with.

But to tell people that their money, be it $59.99 or 45 pounds...is just thrown away because the company has no requirement to deliver a product that actually does what it is advertised to do? You need to get some schooling me thinks about economics 101.

People are upset because they spent real money. Maybe they shouldn't have. But they do have the expectation that their money bought what was advertised for it. That's a LAW in most places. Or they have the expectation they can return for a full refund for not getting what was advertised. I want 2 whole shoes with soles when I buy a pair of shoes. Not 1.5 shoes. Not a shoe missing a sole. If I buy leather, I want leather, not plastic. I have that expectation.

It's not a privelege. It IS a right. Nuff said. Check out your local commerce laws. Ymmv depending on where you live.

I think its quite sad, that in 2011 it has become acceptable and even excusable for developers to release such bug ridden games to market, have problems discovered and take time to resolve it even if its their own patch thats made the game worse.

Its also sad, that peoplel even think that its "OK"...for people to have issues, some preventing them even playing the game after putting in so much time to it, and for the developer to be rewarded with media awards despite those people not being able to play the game.

You see, its a simple logic, based fully on common sense. People have bought the game.....the game, for some, doesnt work as intended, there is currently no solution to their issues. Some are at the level of how the game works, some are at the level or how the game is played, all are making players unable to have the gaming experience that they paid for, wanted or was promised when they picked up Skyrim

I dont buy games like this for the very reason that they end up having bugs or issues that take you out the gaming experience. With all the hype for this game, the initial enjoyment my friends had with this game on launch I picked it up when Bought AC Revelations and Halo CE Anniversay, two games I was able to play through with no bugs, glitches or game problems at all.....but then theres Skyrim. I held out for the 1.2 patch, because before I even unsealed the game, reports were coming in about texure issues if you did the basic thing of installing the game to the HD and caching issues if you played other games. Texture issues that show up easily if you have a decent size tv, having a 50" I didnt want the visual experience on this late 2011 game that had been in development for years, to look rubbish. So, playing from the disc and to begin with, was loving the game and the world it had. Learning how to play the game and a style of game that to me was refreshing, I couldnt get enough of the game.

Then the problems showed up....quests that couldnt be completed, having to revert to an earlier save game, erasing an hour of gameply, just to reload the game and bypass those quests totallly took me out of the game experience, coming to this site when one of those issues angered me so, Ruby Claw Puzzle door in Deadman's respite not working, trapping me in that area and losing another hour of gameplay, to see if there was a solution....I didnt find one, what I found was a part of the Skyrim community shouting as loud as they could for all the issues they were having and with no response from Bethesda at all. Reading through the issues people were having, and not seeing any of them recognized.

Then...the 1.2 patch.....and we all know what that did. Just knowing the fact it made unintentional changes to how the game worked was enough for me to put the game away, delete all things Skyrim from my console after taking a back up of my save games...and wait,wait for it to be fixed or at least put right to before the patch messed it up. For me, the gaming experience was over...I dont like broken games, I dont want to play a game to find an issue to have to back track to avoid it, hadnt had to do that with Batman Arkham City, AC Revelations or even a ten year old HD remake in Halo CE Anniversary. Before people bang on that those arent the same games as Skryim, you are right...different genres altogether. But....they worked, and the game experience at no time was broken up because of a bug, a glitch or a bad title update

The article is responding to the feedback from those having issues, mainly focused on the PS3 platform, who are unable to have the gaming experience that Bethesda won awards for supposedly giving people. A broken game, that cant be enjoyed by "everyone" who bought it at a basic level doesnt deserve to be rewarded whilst that imbalance stands.....really is common sense, why people cant see that is down to them and well, I feel sorry for them, I will be restarting from scratch with 1.3...and if i hit more issues then this game will just gather dust in my collection either until they fix it..or i need a new drinks coaster

Ok...lets see here, you have had zero problems and completed all quests ok yet you are in the technical support area designed for people who are having problems with the game, some of which have been acknowledged by Bethesda so they are "legit" problems with this game. Fair enough

You see, I like many others you have seen in this thread, forum area, other websites and reported by the BBC...have had issues with this game, issues currently unresolved and by Bethesda's own words wont even start to be looked at, Quest issues, till January...two months after release, TWO MONTHS. Now, as someone who hasnt had any issues you really cant understand the feeling that the problems stopping a person from having the same experience that "you" have had wont be fixed, or attempted to be fixed until January of 2012, bit of an annoyance dont you think, just at a basic common sense level?

Now you say the game was not released incomplete or that Bethesda didnt intentionally release the game with bugs...but bugs it does have, not just talking about book shelves that cant be used, or thanks to the 1.2 patch dragons that fly backwards...but game development level issues, the lag on the PS3 being blamed on the architecture of the console despite it being the same all the way through development so should have been spotted in testing. The texture issue on the 360 if you installed the game to the HD but made the mistake of playing other games, could have issues so to avoid it you should play from the disc, the only time I have had to do that since buying an elite years ago, of which have moved up to the slim model.

I am not failing to understand anything, I am simply not accepting that a problematic game for many people deserves to be rewarded with commercial accolades, whilst the most basic technical issues exist...thats it in a nut shell, and that backlash for myself and other people is what was reported on. If the issues being reported were not real, and were not acknowledged by players, bethesda or the gaming press then it would be a tast of what happened on Meta Critic and MW3, but they do exist, they still exist and until Bethesda sort them out...they shouldnt be getting Studio of the year when other games are working fully for all who play them

Thank you for your comment Thanllin, hope my reply explains my standpoint for you to clearly and fully comprehend, have a nice day

This is goty, deal with it

You call it impatience, I call it two months waiting for balance issues and quest bugs to be corrected that are glaringly obvious and have been reported all over this board and many others. All in the meantime they release mini patches which progressively make the game run worse.

Please since you seem to understand coding and the developement of games more than I explain to me these basic bugs etc etc and for that matter what a basic bug is in general since I seem to have no clue as to what is complicated or basic when it comes to bugs.

Also I wasn't flat out saying it's ok for people to have buggy unplayable games you still failed to freaking understand that simple point. MY point WAS that they can't see every bug that is going to happen and they can't help that some people will have more problems than others. When they work on a patch and fix things and test for other bugs that might turn up it isn't a full proof thing.

When the patch goes up and someone downloads it. It can have different effects than others and that is something that they can't help sometimes. Something can glitch and bug out during the DL of the patch it's just that way. You can't reem their asses for something they can't really entirely help.The game is huge and complex and much larger than most games. There are just too many variables to take into account with a game filled with this much "Clutter".

I do Understand where you guys are coming from it's not like This game is the only game to ever have bugs. I have bought a game come home to play it and can't due to bugs and I know how it feels. But you can't sit here and say a company that built a great game shouldn't deserve awards for their product because some people have bugs that can't be helped until they fix them. You miss this point entirely, bugs happen AFTER the fact and then they have to fix them. When they fix them something else can pop up that they couldn't see.

And I repeat, you can beat around the bush all you want but YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING AT THEIR STUDIO. They didn't say they weren't going to start fixing things till a month after They said that is when the fixes will roll out. They are probably working on them now. You know those kinds of things do take time? It truly is a shame some people have to endure a crap experience but you can't completely blame bethesda for this kind of thing.

[censored] HAPPENS

Understand?

It has nothing to do with people lowering their [censored] expectations or any of that nonsense it's just simple understanding.

which you can't seem to do and are letting your personal Bias get in the way because you can't play the game you were promised.

Sorry for that but it doesn't mean the game doesn't deserve GOTY and I'm sure the majority would agree.


PS. I would love to point out one simple thing and that is that just because the game has a possibility to be [censored] doesn't change the fact that the game at it's fullest is a piece of art in it's own right.

You can not agree to them getting studio of the year, that I can completely agree on if you didn't like the way they handle their fixes and patches.

tried to explain my reasons for my view as clearly as I could...you not being able to either understand that or accept it means little to me

Using the "oh since you obviously know so much about game development" line is just meh....I know a product should be stable so everyone has the same experience, if not then there is an issue..its that simple, as it stand right now...no patch is available just to put the game back to pre 1.2 status, which in itself needed patching...so please, dont go all "you have no idea what bethesda are doing"...I know what they did, I know what they have yet to do....and they have my money for the game, wonder if they would say "look just give us a tenner now, then each month you can give us a ￡5 till you have paid it off ok"...but I am expected to buy a game then wait for weeks or months whilst they release incremental updates just to get the basics of the game working??

I still think its a sad fact people are so accepting of problematic games at the end of 2011....but hey, if your happy for it fine, I wont be buying any other Bethesda title on release, same as many other people...it might not make a big difference in the grand scheme of things..but Bethesda should still care

They won't, they created a masterpiece which has won game of the year and sold bucketloads, a few people throwing a tantrum won't hurt them in the slightest. In fact, charmer, the only person you're really affecting is yourself mate. In a few months time all this will be fixed, your lack of patience with them is your own shortfall. Lots of people are playing fine, I have a few issues since 1.2 but I'll put up with them, the game is worth it to me.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the way you go about it really doesn't help your cause in my view, but then what do I know.

lmao..how I am going about it?

lets see, I am discussing the common sense reasons behind my view which agrees with the reporting in the BBC Article. Others, like Thanllin above, exhaust themselves by trying to use personal insults and lame dismissive comments to put down myself and my view

You call it a masterpiece....you say in a few months when its all fixed.....do you not see the irony in that line alone my friend? Lack of patience means little to anyone in this case, as we have no choice but to wait however long it takes for this GOTY masterpiece to be fixed. But what we can do, like advlts and grown up gamers, is discuss the issues at hand in a sensible manner..or at least try to. I am simply replying to comments aimed at me and my view on the subject of which i am sharing.

Its the people who accept that games with problems for some people is just acceptable, that because either havent had any problems or dont see the problems that are occurring as important, it means people should just sshh and be happy they bought a game that for them doesnt work or cant be played as intended. Thats just a little silly

Cockney, get off the high horse, meng.

Relax, take a deep breath, it's gonna be alright. You've made your opinion loud and clear, the game will be fixed soon.

I've been playing on patch 1.2 since the patch came out. Honestly, I didn't even think the game needed it. I admit I jumped on the texture bandwagon, initially, but since playing 80+ hours, I've changed my tune. The game is fun, hands down. It's ridiculous how much enjoyment you can attain from letting go of any notion of what the game is "supposed" to be/look like and just play it. Play it through, man and have fun!

Yes the game is harder without resistances. There are ways around it, if you're a keen player.
Yes there are occasional bugs, they'll usually go away by loading up a previously saved game ( so, save ALOT).
Yes, it's possible to break quest, destroy the story and keep playing. This is what makes the game INTERESTING, and awesome.
Yes, sometimes the textures pop in and out. So what? The game still has a beautiful, unique environment that is completely immersive.
Draw distances?? That's pushing the nit picking a bit too far. Remember Oblivion? If not, go play for a few hours and then talk about "draw distances" in Skyrim.

And yes, Cockney, Skyrim does deserve GOTY, not because it dazzles us with the immaculate graphics, or because it is a perfectly fluid game play experience (sometimes it does neither of these things, I'll be the first to admit it), but because the game is so freakin rich and addicting! The story is unreal in its depth, and there are a thousand things to do!

So, we know you're upset, but it's not the end of the world. Just the beginning of your new and improved Skyrim experience.

Lastly, unless you're game freezes on start-up and doesn't allow you to do anything at all, then is is not broken.

Also, this is the XBOX section of the technical issues forum, so PS3 issues need not apply.

id rather pay money for a bugged game that will get patched, than a crap game that will just stay crap. lots of dev get away with that, i bought borderlands because i like some of what was said about it having rpg elements(ha) and afew friends convinced me, i could punch gearbox for making a such a fool of me. Personaly im happy to pay for beths games, all games pretty much cost the same yet beth put years behind a title, yet most games get like a year of good dev time, are mass marketed and just svck, or give you like 10 hours of content then exspect you to pay ￡10 for each dlc...

lmao...all is well with the world, nothing is a problem even problems.....and the thread topic is about the BBC reporting on the backlash from those with issues against Bethesda winning awards for a game with so many issues using the PS3 area as the main focus

Always love it when people start of a reply with a personal Insult then proceed to give advice, you gotta love this community, able to discuss like grown ups