-this-.

mAges use potions in EVERY game ever, so why you wouldnt use potions in this game, is beyond understanding.

Actually there is a Charm Equivalent... isn't it Harmony?

That's Calm and Frenzy.

Charm is gone.

The full trade is this: Skyrim gives you seven new spell effects, three new casting methods, and dual-casting in exchange for removing 22 spell effects and all spell creation.

The grass is always greener on the other side....

I see many posts listing out all the abilities that mage have to defeat enemies and how boring it is. I can assure you its many more abilities than my warrior has as it boils down to:
-run up to enemy and shield bash/sprint attack
-swing weapon
-power attack

rinse and repeat.

I love my warrior as I think its super fun and there is nothing better than chopping off an enemies head after they say some snide remark. However playing my mage is a bit more strategic and open as I can decide on multiple ways to kill an enemy or group of them. Its a challenge that the warrior does not offer.

The same goes for my archer/assassin. Yes it is cool to one shot things from stealth with my bow but it also gets old as its the same scenario emost of the time.


Bottom line roll up a few archtypes and enjoy each one for what they are.

Oh I agree with this too. I hate that we have to use enchanting and alchemy to be viable. I have said ad nauseam that magic should stand on its own if we do not wish to use a crafting school we should not have to. The magic system in this game is preposterous and you have to have certain builds and use certain skills to be successful as mages. We need our old spells to make all of our magic schools more versatile and we need spell creation to open up our options to make our magic users even more versatile, with that we will he able to create and craft several useful spells. Magic in this game is lacking on all fronts sure its pretty but its just pretty bones and that's it.

I understand about the trade, the NAME charm might be gone, but it was really replaced with spells like:
Calm
Pacify
Harmony

The effects are essentially the same:
Creatures and people up to level 25 nearby won't fight for 60 seconds.

No, it's not.

The effect you described is 100% Calm. Pacify and Harmony are simply two upscaled versions of the same Calming spell. Calm worked exactly the same way in Oblivion and Morrowind: creatures/people up to X level will not fight you for X seconds when cast. Call the spell whatever you like, the effect is what really matters, and those three spells you listed do exactly the same thing in different magnitudes.

Charm made NPCs like you more when used (it affected reputation). But since Skyrim has abolished all reputation and disposition, well... I could actually put that one as an obsolete effect.

Yes, I cannot wait to get a PC so I can make this game what I want. Then the game will be at my whims on what I feel is viable.

I know its not constructive. That is why I say nothing about nodding on my console its not going to happen.

I just feel that certain elements should not have to modded in like spell creation the flag ship feature of the magic system and the old spells we lost. Bethesda should add to existing features and mechanics and upgrade upon them.

The charm spell was fun and useful. I wish we had the reputation system back with the NPCs disposition. It's one of the many effects I wish we had back.

In morrowind and even Oblivion for that matter it was very easy to get your ass kicked if all you did was use destruction and not utilize other skills.

exactly.

The same thing happened with Civ V.. Tons of features (read: complexity and depth) from Civ IV were simply removed such as religion, and espionage and many other features were 'streamlined' such as diplomacy and victory conditions. It reduced the number of play-styles that were possible. Not that dissimilar from what the allegations are here regarding magic in Skyrim v. magic in Oblivion. At the end of the day, the game sold $21.9M on steam in 2010 (source: http://www.gamefocus.ca/news/12732.html). Not bad given the game was released in September of 2010!

Increasingly, video gaming is opening to a broader market. In order to appeal to that broader market, complexity is removed. Most video gamers simply want to log in, shoot some stuff, and log off. It's actually quite amazing to see a CRPG in the high-fantasy setting do as well as Skyrim has! Sure, this trend towards 'simpler' can alienate the existing fan base somewhat, but at the end of the day they make more money. It's a win/meh situation for bethesda/the hardcoe fan, but meh is better than fail

Not really. Spell Creation.


Nope, Spell Creation.


Also, Banish isn't new, it was in Daggerfall. And one of the 'new' casting methods, Rune, which is basically just a trap spell, was viable in Oblivion with spell creation. So its even less.

I did not know about Civ V I stopped with that series after four. I have no reason just stopped playing it, the series lost ky interest I guess you can say, its a good thing if the feature set was cut in five.

I know what Bethesda is doing appealing to wider audience. Now that they have that audience they add content back in along with its depth complexity. There is no reason for any more streamlining, wmthey have garnered a massive audience with both Skyrim and Oblivion, so now they can add. I am hoping with the first expansion they rectify what they have done and add back in the old spells and spell creation. Hopefully a retooled attribute system with general perks added in. I hope they expand upon the laughably short guild quest. Things like that is what would make this game better.

Ah, here we are, another ignorant complainer, there's so many of these that continue to plague these forums. But don't worry, it's not your fault. I had the same trouble, but I didn't give up. If you were like me then you probably thought to yourself "To hell with the Companions, I'm going straight to Winterhold," to tackle on the college quests. #1 mistake right here. I had the same trouble you did, when you are tasked with ascertaining the location of the staff of magnus by going to Mzulft, I too had trouble taking on multiple Falmer, Chaurus and single Dwarven Sphere Guardians. I would assume you're talking about the Mage questline(or some questline), because otherwise you weren't strong enough to beat and you're just being extremely stubborn. My advice, don't take on the College of Winterhold questline until you've reached atleast level 15. I found alot more success with this after resetting my Pure Mage character. Other than this I(and you should) got my enchanting up to 60 at an early level and created very useful enchantments that fortified the cost of my Destruction spells. In addition, I like to play more of a Conjurer's role at higher levels(+25) but I like to use mainly Destruction from the get-go, so I boost my Conjuration respectively with my level: 50 at 15, 65 at 20, 75 at 25 and 90 at 30. The rest I bring up myself, but at that point conjuring Atronachs doesn't boost Conjuration too much.

Alternatively , If you play on PC, there is a mod that makes Destruction Magic scale and increases Magica regeneration when fighting enemies. Magic is far from svcky. Sure it could use a buff, but I wouldn't dare call it underpowered.

-this- or enchant your armor and robes yourself. Works wonders.

I think the issue is the fact you can plow through everything with just a sword.

Magic is excellently implemented imo... Bethesda have done a rare thing and tied some of the lore aspects into the gameplay mechanics.

Magic in and of itself is meant to be the wise man's weapon, the thinker's tool. If you think and strategise well as a mage, you can be nigh on unbeatable. If you do what every other playstyle allows and just run in / sneak behind enemies and engage at close range... well you're going to get butt******.

Magic is the most difficult playstyle, but also the most rewarding (unless you unnaturally level up any one school, e.g. Enchanting or Conjuration, and destroy with high level spells). Also, it's worth noting that difficulty has a large bearing on your game experience as a mage. On my warrior I play on Expert or Master because it feels more realistic. Magic, however, particularly Destruction magic, has very limited scaling, and has been balanced for use on Adept difficulty (and has been balanced well, tbh).

There's a kind of unspoken expectation that a dual cast Incinerate fireball, which fills your screen up with flame, should send that Frostbite Spider etc into orbit. The fulfillment of these expectations is achieved very well on Adept - the things that should die, die... the things that should keep trucking will keep coming.

Uh, not really. Actually a lot of lore regarding magic was tossed aside.

Did you read the rest of my point? You just addressed the introductory sentence, without the explanation.

That's all I needed to read. You said it tied magic to the lore, when at every turn Beth has tried to bastardize the magical lore, with gimmicky mechanics, cutting, or simple disregard. In fact, the rest of your comment really doesn't say anything about lore. Since the only thing I wanted to comment on was the lore aspect, I selectively quoted you.

Consider this me being generous, then.

So in reality we have 2.5 new casting methods (if I assume correctly, you could imitate a Rune spell's effects in Oblivion rather well by just casting an A-o-E spell on the ground nearby your target), six new spells, and one old spell brought back, in exchange for 22 spells removed as well as spell creation. Oh, and don't forget the pretty lights, wouldn't be a Bethesda innovation without the pretty lights.

Thanks for the clarification, but I'm sure you agree with my overall point.

Which lore in particular are you talking about?

I made a few mage characters and they are all powerful,maybe you just don't know how to select the correct perks? That or...you just svck?