Theoretically you could use this perk for a berserker style warrior character instead of the intended stealth build. With a decent amount of health and stamina you could simply charge at an enemy, crouch and then slit their throats, then rinse and repeat on the next guy. Of course this works in theory, but has anyone tried it in practice?

Anyone?

Well, since no one has answered I'll say this: the 1-shot throat slash seems to be based on whether or not you can deal enough damage to 1-shot the target. For example, my Assassin chick can 1-shot bosses and Dragon Priests if she can Sneak up on them because she has the 15x Backstab perk (Assassin's Blade).

My warrior/slasher dude can't 1-shot a boss or Dragon Priest so I doubt I could do that with him; I've never seen the throat slash on my dude. However I do not have the Ebony Mail on him so I can't be sure if that affects the animation. His Sneak is pretty high, but not as high as on my chick (plus my chick has more Sneak Enchantments on multiple pieces of gear).

Not worth it, IMO. As others have said, you don't need it by the time you get it. Also consider the perk cost: Stealth 1 + Muffled Movement + Light Foot + Silent Roll + Silence + Shadow Warrior = 6 perks, and most of them are worthless. Generic enchanted items and/or Illusion magic will be vastly superior.

Actually, Silent Roll is the only perk you mentioned that is of questionable value. Even so, rolling around speeds up sneaking quite a bit. Tell me, if I play a sneak based character, what else am I supposed to pay my perks into? Illusion? Illusion is an alternative to sneak, not a complement. I was skeptical about Shadow Warrior myself but it's a fun toy to have in your tool box.

I think he means for a warrior-type wearing Heavy Armor since Borous was asking about the Ebony Mail.

And, yes, OMFG, Silent Roll is cool as hell. I love using Throw Voice to get a couple of targets who are sitting at a table facing each other to get them to run down a hallway. Then I Sneak up behind the last one, Silent Roll to catch up to him/her, and "Charlie Murphy!" throat slash.

• Stealth 1: is a gimme because you need it for the sneak multiplier stuff, but it doesn't have much merit on its own at 100 Sneak.
  
• Muffled Movement: gives 50% muffle, which you can pair with generic muffle boots for 100% coverage. Custom enchants and the Illusion spell give 100% though, diminishing its value.
  
• Light Foot: can be useful, but it's pretty situational, and you have to take Muffled Movement for it.
  
• Silent Roll: does nothing that I can tell once you have 100% muffle, since you can just walk/run instead.
  
• Silence: more useless, overkill muffle; you could argue that it frees up an enchantment slot but feet are pretty lacking.

Shadow Warrior's effect is also questionable; Alchemy and Illusion both have alternatives. And with 100 Sneak + perks leading up to it, you're not going to be noticed much anyway.

What you would do with these saved perks I couldn't say; I always have somewhere to put them. Shadow Warrior just seems like a novelty though.

I guess what I mean to ask is if you could make a non-stealth character only get all the prerequisite perks to use shadow warrior, then charge enemies and use the shadow warrior sneak attack w/daggers as your primary atack, benefitting from stealth multiplier without ever really sneaking.

I wear custom Enchanted boots (Fire and Shock Resistance) so Muffled boots aren't an option.


Yeah, if you're careful enough it's not a great perk especially since trip wires don't count as pressure plates. I know they're different, but they could've lumped in the ability to automatically step over trip wires.

My Sneak is at 100 with all perks in that constellation and I wear 3 pieces of gear with +40% Sneak on them, but if I stand up too close to a target (even behind them) they become alarmed. Also, I'm not sure the throat slash animation would go off if you're not crouched/Sneaking. ...and I think you have to be Sneaking for the 15x Assassin's Blade to work so it wouldn't be a 1-shot if you're standing upright.

Probably. I do know this: I can walk crouched up face-to-face with a Falmer and they can't hear me - the gear I wear and 100 Sneak may be enough to do that, but I've never tested it.

I don't like having to constantly pop pots and recast spells so I like Shadow Warrior. Plus I've put very little into Magicka, but I do have a ring and necklace of "Inviso-Sneak" that I've Enchanted with Fortify Sneak and Fortify Illusion for out in the open assassinations.

It could be classified as a novelty, but that throat slash animation is really cool.

I'm sure Shadow Warrior would work in that situation as far as the description reads (breaking combat and distant enemies search for you), but if you're wanting to do a 1-shot/throat slash I think that depends upon Assassin's Blade perk. Sorry if I'm not answering your question - I only have Shadow Warrior on my assassin-type and don't know the implications on a warrior-type.

There is the Illusion spell, which lasts for 3 minutes and gives 1100% muffle (not a typo). Its cost is fairly low (<150) which you should be able to regenerate in 3 minutes.

I agree, but alas it does not. With that addition it would have a stronger case as a worthwhile perk.

That's because they hear you; with 100% muffle you don't have this problem. And you are correct, you would have to go into sneak mode just before attacking to get the sneak multipliers.

I will use some spells as an assassin, but my main issue is from my original D&D 'stuff' wherein non-"Magic Users" (original class name) can't use magic. It's hard to break from that and use magic as an assassin/thief or warrior type. I'm trying though.

Oh [censored]. Now I'm gonna be saying "Charlie Murphy!" every time I backstab somebody.

Sorry. I had to spread the pain. "Ebonyyy". (Ebony Dagger for the kill.)

Haha, so just to clarify...as long as I have the right perks, I should be able to run directly up to an enemy in broad daylight, crouch (with Shadow Assassin) hold forward on the directional pad and attack and it SHOULD do full sneak attack damage without ever having to stalk the baddie in question?

Yep.
You fade into a cloud of green-black smoke and appear behind the target.

Edit: I've never been able to make the throat slash animation go off on a seated target or on a target on a stairwell/ladder (probably have to be on even ground).

...sick

Yes...deliciously so...Hail SIthis!

First off I just playtested this and it is immense.

You mentioned earlier that you dual wield daggers when performing this. How does damage get calculated in that situation? I wasn't able to get the sneak attack to work pulling both triggers. If you only attack with one I assume you only get the damage from one, so how does dual wielding benefit you? Or is it more of an aesthetic choice? Or better yet am I just doing something wrong?

Oh, I just dual wield because my play style is fast-spastic. When I sneak up behind someone I only attack with the main hand. With the Ebony Dagger at 154 damage and the 15x Assassin's Blade I only need one strike from one weapon.

I'm pretty sure you get 15x on both weapons as long as they are both daggers... and I think that damage is applied as one attack. You'd have to check me on that one, though. I like Valdr's Lucky Dagger in my right hand and Mehrune's in my left. Both can be smithed up to around 90 dmg without exploits. 2(90x15)=2700=kickass

I have to differ with your assessment. First of all, you can't even count Stealth 1, since it's also a pre-requisite for the excellent backstab line, not to mention the first point is a whopping 20% boost to sneak (which is applied to your fortify sneak potions/enchantments). Second, the intermediate perks are far from useless to a stealthy character:

Muffled Movement - Fantastic early on, when you may not have access to the late-game heavy-hitters such as muffle/fortify sneak enchant, conditioning, unhindered. I don't know about you, but my sneak skill rose considerably faster than light armour, since I made it my business not to be repeatedly punched in the face. Later, yes, it's redundant if you take one of the former options, but the thing about getting to level 50 is that you have to get through level 12 to get there.

Light foot - This might be my favourite perk in the entire game. Yes, traps aren't that devastating in Skyrim, I wish they carried more punch. That still doesn't mean that being able to ignore every trap except tripwires isn't incredibly luxurious.

Silent Roll - This is an ASTOUNDING perk if you're good with your controller. I've rolled right past dungeon bosses to set up my backstab on them, and been able to get to places undetected that I could never reach by conventional tip-toe.

Silence - This perk is the bomb. Getting the same stealth from running as walking? Again, this makes it far, far easier to into position, avoid detection and otherwise run rings around the enemies trying to find out.

Now, you may argue that you could just as easily throw on +120 fortify sneak on your gear and never be seen, but I put it to you that having the above perks free up your enchant slots for stuff that's actually useful, like magic resist, fortify health and stamina, and stamina regeneration, fortify magica, etc. And all the fortify sneak on the planet wouldn't get you a re-stealth on an enemy right in front of you.

And lastly, what on earth else are you going to spend them on? By level 50, you can easily have enough perks to buy enough enchanting, smithing, alchemy, weapon and armor perks to moonwalk through the entire game, with plenty to spare.

You may feel that Illusion may be vastly superior, but it's not in concept for every character, and even if it were, you're still discounting that illusion costs mana (unless you invest in 3-4 items with fortify illusion), and sneak perks do not. Illusion doesn't worth on all enemies without deep perk investment itself.

What I do know is that I did the battle of Whiterun on my assassin, and was able to slit the throat of nearly every enemy I ran into. At that point, what else do I need to justify the investment of a handful of perks? So I can dump a bunch of enchantments and perks into a different tree and do the same thing, just not as fast?




Yes, a double-swing calculates sneak attack damage from both weapons. However, I MUST recommend trying wearing the Dark Brotherhood gloves and getting the x30 damage backstabs, because the throat-slitting animation is unbelievably satisfying. I'll get my act together later and post my ultimate assassin build. It is exploit-free, totally viable from the beginning of the game to the end, and the results are 'Invincible, Invulnerable, Invisible'.

Only problem is a double swing doesn't work in this context. I'd love it if both calculated in that animation, so seriously someone check!

But I think both are calculated if you hold down both left and right for the combo power attack. Maybe it doesn't really matter... In my case, my Valdr's alone would be doing 1350 dmg.

Don't break from it. Spellcasting is what makes an assassin class a prestige class and a rogue a base class (DnD)