Sheogorath plot gap? [Oblivion and Skyrim Spoiler]

Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:20 am

So I have just done the Skyrim Sheogorath quest and it got me thinking...

In Oblivion the Hero of Kevatch became Sheogorath, so does this mean when he appears in Skyrim he is the Hero of Kevatch from Oblivion?
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Alex [AK]
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:05 pm

Debatable, but whatever you believe. Beth likes to do that to us.
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Jennifer Rose
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 3:34 am

It is possible that he is and it is possible that he isn't.All depends on what you did as the CoC
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JUDY FIGHTS
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 4:59 am

Short answer: Yes CoC is Sheo
Long Answer: Use the search function and checkout Sheo Wikipedia page for info related to that.
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Emma Louise Adams
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 6:24 am

Debatable, but whatever you believe. Beth likes to do that to us.


It really is NOT debatable. Expansions in TES have always been cannon.
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Robert Jackson
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:17 am

Everything in reality is debatable buddy.
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Mizz.Jayy
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:40 am

It really is NOT debatable. Expansions in TES have always been cannon.

It's cannon, we did it. But maybe it was just Sheogorat playing tricks with the CoC mind. :P
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CArlos BArrera
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 3:29 am

Its canon that someone did it.Not necessarily the CoC
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Ricky Rayner
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:35 pm

Sheogorath is Skyrim IS The Champion of Cyrodiil.

Listen to what he says when you first meet. "No wait.. That Martin fellow was my favorite! He became a Dragon-God! You know, I was there for all that... Severed Head (DBH Questline, remember that head), A Fox (Gray Fox), Butterflies (Beginning of SI QL), and cheese to die for!"

Something like that.
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Margarita Diaz
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:54 pm

It really is NOT debatable. Expansions in TES have always been cannon.

The story is canon history, but it is not canon fact it was the CoC who mantled Sheogorath.
Its fine to believe he was, and its fine to think he was not.
This ambiguity about a lot of Elder Scrolls lore and what standpoint people take in it is one of the more interesting things about it.
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Silencio
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 6:00 am

Yes its the CoC, kinda hard to debate agaisnt it. Heck he practically says it himself

You are the best Septim that's ever ruled. Well, except for that Martin fellow, but he turned into a dragon god, and that's hardly sporting...You know, I was there for that whole sordid affair. Marvelous times! Butterflies, blood, a Fox and severed head... Oh, and the cheese! To die for.
(Referring his time as the Champion of Cyrodiil, he refrences he was there for when Martin became the avatar of Akatosh as well; Butterflies referring to the CoC's first visit to the isles and the butterfly room, the Fox being the Gray Fox and the head is that of Mathieu Bellamont's mother)
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Juanita Hernandez
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:48 pm

Yes its the CoC, kinda hard to debate agaisnt it. Heck he practically says it himself


(Referring his time as the Champion of Cyrodiil, he refrences he was there for when Martin became the avatar of Akatosh as well; Butterflies referring to the CoC's first visit to the isles and the butterfly room, the Fox being the Gray Fox and the head is that of Mathieu Bellamont's mother)

Which means he was aware of some of the events during the Oblivion crisis.
It does not prove he is the CoC.
He is the Daedric lord of madness and as such is 'present' in the mind of every mortal.
Im not saying that is what he meant, its a different and equally valid explanation.
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James Potter
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:51 pm

There was rumor the Neravarine went to Akavir.
Mine didn't he hung around the only strip club in Tamriel.He would pawn off various dadric trinkets for lap dances and food til one day there was a loud bang and a volcanic eruption.

So you can believe things that are said or not.Your truth is the truth in most cases.
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Rachel Tyson
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:13 pm

I thought the exact same thing but no its not the CoC its the same Sheogorath. you see if you understand the lore and if Jyggalag was freed he would have destroyed the other daedric princes by now and that would be it no more daedric princes except for Jyggalag of corse.
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willow
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:51 pm

I like to learn about Bethesda's Default Heroes and it seems like the Champion of Cyrodiil became Sheogorath.

More Evidence: The Original Sheogorath prefer to use his staff as a walking stick and always have it on him. Skyrim's Sheogorath DOESN'T use his staff; maybe the Champion of Cyrdodiil prefer to use it as a weapon instead of a walking stick?
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Tanya Parra
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 6:33 am

Also, Oblivion Sheogorath had a beard, Skyrim Sheogorath doesn't. Makes sense that Skyrim Sheogorath is CoC since you couldn't make a bearded character in Oblivion.
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Kahli St Dennis
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:12 am

I thought the exact same thing but no its not the CoC its the same Sheogorath. you see if you understand the lore and if Jyggalag was freed he would have destroyed the other daedric princes by now and that would be it no more daedric princes except for Jyggalag of corse.

That...no, just no.
Jyggalag has no way to gain power, no plane of Oblivion, no armies of daedra to conquer with. Jyggalag is freed, we saw it happen, he says it himself. Saying he wasnt freed is like saying SI never happened.
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Samantha Pattison
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:50 am

That...no, just no.
Jyggalag has no way to gain power, no plane of Oblivion, no armies of daedra to conquer with. Jyggalag is freed, we saw it happen, he says it himself. Saying he wasnt freed is like saying SI never happened.
Exactly just like Bloodmoon (Hircines quest in Morrowind) never happend. It seems the daedric dlc quests are non relative to TES canon.
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Alexxxxxx
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:18 am

Exactly just like Bloodmoon (Hircines quest in Morrowind) never happend. It seems the daedric dlc quests are non relative to TES canon.

Everything in the games and all expansions and DLC are cannon, whether you like it or not.
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Chloe Lou
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:24 am

Exactly just like Bloodmoon (Hircines quest in Morrowind) never happend. It seems the daedric dlc quests are non relative to TES canon.

What makes you think it never happened? There are no books about it because it was only truly witnessed by one individual who ended up in Akavir. I guess there is also a small northern village of Nords that witnessed small parts but odds are that by the time those stories travel to any scribe it will sound like there was a werewolf attack (very VERY common in Skyrim lore) and some Nord got drunk at a mead house and told a great tale (also very common in lore)
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Adriana Lenzo
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:57 pm

Which means he was aware of some of the events during the Oblivion crisis.
It does not prove he is the CoC.
He is the Daedric lord of madness and as such is 'present' in the mind of every mortal.
Im not saying that is what he meant, its a different and equally valid explanation.
My thinking as well.

Ive also read that as the mad god, the power of maddness corrupts whoever holds it, turning them into sheogorath over time. So Sheogorath can technically be anyone and everyone who ever became the mad god.
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Marcus Jordan
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:25 pm

My thinking as well.

Ive also read that as the mad god, the power of maddness corrupts whoever holds it, turning them into sheogorath over time. So Sheogorath can technically be anyone and everyone who ever became the mad god.

Kinda wrong to look at it that way. Those that mantle gods become those gods but they also stay themselves as well. Tiber Septim is Talos, but he is still Tiber Septim. CoC changed his appearance not because he didn’t have a choice, (daedra change appearance/gender at will) but probably because it was a lot easier to mantle Sheogorath and gain all of his power if you have his looks.
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Shannon Marie Jones
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:06 am

according to TES lore....

trying to understand the Deadra of madness is FOOLISH

he is crazy, who knows maybe he wanted to mess with your head maybe he is the hero form OB maybe he is half man half god half pig ...etc

the point is he is crazy stop trying to figure him/her/it out
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Laura Ellaby
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:34 am

In my case, my character who played Shivering never played the MQ, and vice versa. I think it's canon that Sheogorath is the player of Shivering Isles. If, in your case, that's the CoC, that's canon for you. In my case, it's not.

Bethesda has never strapped the player down and force-fed them one version of facts.
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ZANEY82
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:03 am

according to TES lore....

trying to understand the Deadra of madness is FOOLISH

he is crazy, who knows maybe he wanted to mess with your head maybe he is the hero form OB maybe he is half man half god half pig ...etc

the point is he is crazy stop trying to figure him/her/it out
In my case, my character who played Shivering never played the MQ, and vice versa. I think it's canon that Sheogorath is the player of Shivering Isles. If, in your case, that's the CoC, that's canon for you. In my case, it's not.

Bethesda has never strapped the player down and force-fed them one version of facts.

Exactly.
I think it would be unbelievable and therefore silly to assume the hero of Morrowind did everything the game has to offer, likewise for Oblivion and Skyrim. In my opinion, I consider the main quest alone to be attributed to the hero of the games.
Someone else may think that such great feats of accomplishment makes for an epic tale.

The great part about TES lore is that it can hold both these views.
I make a distinction between lore and canon.
Lore is everything, including out-game developer texts and (some) fan thesis.
Canon is very little, it is the events but not the people if you will. No doubt that someone stole an elder scroll and saved the thieves guild from a curse, but who it is is not recorded.
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Lilit Ager
 
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