Steam adds so much value to Fallout NV

Post » Tue May 03, 2011 5:16 am

I have had a look at the Steam forums and it seems that Advanced SystemCare can cause this problem of not being able to connect to Steam.
But I use this program but I used it before today. So I don't really see why its a problem now all of a sudden.

I am waiting to be added to the forum there so I can ask why ASC is a problem today & not yesterday before I go tearing off to uninstall it.
Anybody here able to hazard a guess?

[Just as an added point, I have the full version of ASC, not the free version, so I am not very keen on uninstalling it unless there is no way around it. Suffice to say that even if I disconnect my computer physically from the internet and try to force play in Off-line mode, it still tries to connect to Steam... perhaps today's update has stalled half-way through installation? ]

Alternatively my problem could also be because I am in Europe and there seems to be a problem:
We've been experiencing an intermittent routing issue between some locations in Europe and one of our primary data centers in the US since late last night. Packets are sometimes lost between two major internet backbone providers on a hop on the east coast of the US. We've reported the issue to both providers and hopefully it will be fully resolved soon. Unfortunately it's not under our direct control as it's a broader internet routing failure between the two providers at a hop far away from our actual servers.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1592685&page=2

Take your pick. Either way, I can't play my game.
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Kevin S
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 10:27 am

"Just to check, does Steam know you have a 56k connection or is it set (in the settings) to think you have broadband?"

I've never been able to check, because steam has never finished installing itself or the game. It spends so much time updating itself that my computer can do little else - and I don't have that kind of time to waste.
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Max Van Morrison
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 5:19 am

While I understand it wouldn't be very convenient for you to do so, do you have no avenue to temporarily take your PC with you to a sympathetic friend/relative/employer/stranger who has a broadband connection, download and patch everything, and then switch things to off-line mode for Steam and run FNV that way at home?

Think of it as a a real-life RPG quest. 1) Get the quest item, but it won't work. 2) Lug it around to NPCs to get it fixed/connected. 3) Lug it home. 4) Level up.



No legal purchaser of a game should have to jump through these sort of hoops in order to enjoy the game he purchased.

I bought it because they advertised that steam was only required to validate the install. I have had to use online validation in the past, and it is no big deal. Steam is a much bigger problem than that, and in my opinion the advertising on the box that said "validate install" was very misleading.
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D LOpez
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 11:45 pm

"This thread and threads like it are simple a vocal minority defiantly standing on the train tracks in hopes that their complaining will some how stop the train of progress. "

And people wonder why folks say that computer gaming is dying... when customers have to work this hard just to use a product they bought, the industry is shooting itself in the foot. I can understand why so many people have moved on to gaming consoles. I haven't done that as of yet, but it may happen.
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Justin Hankins
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 7:20 pm

Steam was the worst thing for this game. It has completed ruined this game for me.
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Monika Krzyzak
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 1:57 am

No legal purchaser of a game should have to jump through these sort of hoops in order to enjoy the game he purchased.

I bought it because they advertised that steam was only required to validate the install. I have had to use online validation in the past, and it is no big deal. Steam is a much bigger problem than that, and in my opinion the advertising on the box that said "validate install" was very misleading.
"Should" has nothing to do with it. That's a concept that doesn't exist in the real world. svcks that its not working for you, but if you want to overcome hardship and play the game, then do what it takes to succeed. Otherwise, no amount of message board complaining is going to make broadband levels of data flow down a phone line, or make Steam change their business model to support a minority of customers who still use dial-up.

Shouldn't have to use Steam, but you do. It's not right, but it is what it is. Overcome or endure.
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Quick Draw III
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 4:30 am

I can make a video showing how STEAM works with no internet connection. Ill even play some New Vegas for you guys!
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Lizbeth Ruiz
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 8:12 pm

"Should" has nothing to do with it. That's a concept that doesn't exist in the real world. svcks that its not working for you, but if you want to overcome hardship and play the game, then do what it takes to succeed. Otherwise, no amount of message board complaining is going to make broadband levels of data flow down a phone line, or make Steam change their business model to support a minority of customers who still use dial-up.

Shouldn't have to use Steam, but you do. It's not right, but it is what it is. Overcome or endure.


you totally miss the point here. With games being published which force steam activation, your are bound to run into such problems as platform. While your statement that only a very small minority got issues were true before titles were exclusively published for steam, it is not anymore. The box reads: validation through steam. Most customers don't have any idea what it really means and what the consequences are.
Steam is very unstable and unreliable. And even if it works for 90% of the customers, it still fails for 10%. Again, this would be ok if those 10% it is not working for could just move on and use another platform...but now they bought the game and they cannot. When using steam as drm I DEMAND as CUSTOMER, that the platform is stable...steam is unfortunatly not. If this condition is not fulfilled i may in future look for other channels to play the games. Channels which are not only far cheaper but a lot less troublesome.

BTW, Steam added no value or whatsoever to any game i played. Just another program, which is even asking for admin rights every time I start it (there's no need to require admin rights) opening vulnerabilities on the computer, with forced updates when going online and incompetent support (you really shouldnt have a buggy platform AND bad support at the same time).
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Mackenzie
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 7:18 pm

All the Steam DRM accomplishes is making it a pain in the butt for HONEST GAMERS. Any thief with an internet connection and WinRAR can download and install New Vegas in 2 hours and not even know what Steam is as they're watching the opening cut scene. So tell me, how the hell does Steam prevent piracy again??? Please enlighten me. Cause, so far, all I see it doing is inconveniencing me (someone who happily paid $50 for a game that they were looking forward to) while any thief on the planet is enjoying New Vegas for free while not even having to fool around with Steam...Oh yeah, but Steam prevents piracy...
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jason worrell
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 11:40 am

"Should" has nothing to do with it. That's a concept that doesn't exist in the real world. svcks that its not working for you, but if you want to overcome hardship and play the game, then do what it takes to succeed. Otherwise, no amount of message board complaining is going to make broadband levels of data flow down a phone line, or make Steam change their business model to support a minority of customers who still use dial-up.

Shouldn't have to use Steam, but you do. It's not right, but it is what it is. Overcome or endure.


In other words, bend over and grab your ankles? Feedback is what they need to hear and what we need to share to evolve past this. The Steam solution is the Model-T of gaming.
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xx_Jess_xx
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 8:54 pm

I wonder if DRM actually has any real impact on combating piracy. The pirates seem pretty competent at bypassing those measures, then offering a less invasive version of the software through other avenues. There must be a better method to protect the developers from piracy than things like Steam or SecuROM, although I'm not sure offhand what that would be.

It stops those with less computer knowledge (IE: anyone who knows how to burn a DVD is out of luck) but other then that, there is little measurable effect. And of that effect that is measurable, most people who do pirate games end up buying them as well, though I would imagine that NV isnt seeing that so much.

Hell, look at Minecraft. That game has over 600,000 units sold, and yet the game has no DRM. The only thing stopping someone from pirating it is you need to log in via the client after you buy it to unlock the off-line mode. No need for me to share what happens after that.
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Mariana
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 10:52 am

Just some comments to some posts I've seen:

  • Steam is favoured by X amount of people/Steam is disliked by X amount of people: unless you have done any polls I doubt you can be certain about the absolute numbers or making assumptions about it.
  • There is a reason why the latest patches get pushed. From a developer's and publisher's perspective this means that all your users are at the same level when it comes to giving support as well as receiving bug reports. Otherwise, if you add in multiple previous versions it will become one huge mess to test, verify, and fix issues reported.
  • Problems with Steam is not something this forum can help you well with, better to ask that of the Steam fora or Steam's support. E.g. http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=17

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Sammie LM
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 5:09 am

I want to express too my voice against Steam.
I bought the collector's edition, when I put the DVD on, I expected to install the game, instead, first, I had to install Steam, then the game; that's not all, I had to wait 35 minutes when I tried to play the game because a) Steam needed to be updated and the game too; I had a big sign telling me how much I have to wait. Oh, and another thing, I have a hard disk just for games, I like to install them on separated folders, I mean, a folder for each game, with Steam, I can't do that, and please don't come with some workaround, I paid for a game, I DON'T HAVE to go around changing files from some third party thing to get the things the way I want. I have around 30 games and I didn't have to do anything "extra" to install them let alone to play them.
I really hate that poor excuse of the piracy thing. First, the game is already pirated, and not only for PC but console too. Second, there's no need for Steam if piracy is the real excuse, because as I said, the game is already pirated and it does work better, without Steam and without constant CTD. The only reason I would pirate the game is Steam, not money or because it's expensive, I paid for the CE without hesitating but Steam is really pushing me to torrent a working game.
Before the last patch (that Steam gladly installed without even asking me) the worked just fin, since, I have constant crashes to desktop. And yes, my system is way over the specs with i7 930, GTX460, 6gb ram, Win7 64bits. Yes, there might be "fixes" around, I really appreciate them, but is not the user who has to come up with fixes; the developer, publisher or whoever is charging me a good chunk of money for the game, they should be the ones working things out and if they can't come out with a fix, they should be at the fans forums to ask for said fix because for years is been proved that users seem to know a lot more than the overpaid so called developers.
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Brooks Hardison
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 6:18 am


[*]Problems with Steam is not something this forum can help you well with, better to ask that of the Steam fora or Steam's support. E.g. http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=17
[/list]


While you are right that this is not something that Bethesda can fix, gamers are right to let Bethesda & its partners know how well Steam is working out for them - for future reference.
The other thing is that Steam is not offering ANY support on this issue. They are basically denying that it is their problem. They are blaming packets going missing "somewhere" on a number servers and claiming there is nothing they can do about it except wait. Their latest update has cut hundreds if not thousands of gamers in Europe off from their game. Zero support, zero apologies, zero useful suggestions.
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stacy hamilton
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 11:12 pm

I see people with no experience on Steam have too many problems. I myself didn't have any problem so far, even with the so-called problematic latest updates.
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luis ortiz
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 10:27 am

Tanshaydae, the problems with the latest Steam update weren't anything to do with "experience". It had to do a major malfunction on servers that Steam was using. It didn't affect everyone. But it did affect a large number all the same.
Even if it wasn't Steam's fault, it nevertheless exposes the weakness in having platforms like that manage DRM etc of games.
It is not acceptable that legal gamers are penalised for a glitch inthe system.

I can offer this advice to people who have been having trouble since the latest Steam update : utilities like Advanced SystemCare for some reason can cause a problem too. If you are running such a utility consider uninstalling it (temporarily - you can re-install it afterwards) and then try connecting to Steam. It has solved the problem for some people.
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Blaine
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 8:14 am

DRM is a loosing game of cat and mouse. Even Assassins creed 2's validate online every 5 minuets was bypassed eventualy.

Some people like achievements, Steam provides that.
Some people would never patch if it was not pushed on them, Steam provides that. (allowing them to release a broken game)

Steams encryption of the EXE is a well knows process that only a clueless executive would think it would protect against piracy.

Piracy takes time. If you have money and value your time, you dont even think to pirate and buy the game. If you have lots of time and no money then you either save up and support the developer, or you spend time pirating.

I recommend supporting the developer.
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Mr. Allen
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 2:29 am

DRM is a loosing game of cat and mouse. Even Assassins creed 2's validate online every 5 minuets was bypassed eventualy.

Some people like achievements, Steam provides that.
Some people would never patch if it was not pushed on them, Steam provides that. (allowing them to release a broken game)

Steams encryption of the EXE is a well knows process that only a clueless executive would think it would protect against piracy.

Piracy takes time. If you have money and value your time, you dont even think to pirate and buy the game. If you have lots of time and no money then you either save up and support the developer, or you spend time pirating.

I recommend supporting the developer.

I am more then happy to support developers. Without them, I would be bored (Save for Minecraft) but the use of a 3rd party application like this is intrusive. I dont mind what Steam is trying to do, however, I do mind how it is done. And because Steam is required, it is hard to support the developer when you are forced to also support Steam. I dont want to support Steam in this instance, I want to support Obsidian and Bethesda.
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Crystal Clarke
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 11:24 am

I am more then happy to support developers. Without them, I would be bored (Save for Minecraft) but the use of a 3rd party application like this is intrusive. I dont mind what Steam is trying to do, however, I do mind how it is done. And because Steam is required, it is hard to support the developer when you are forced to also support Steam. I dont want to support Steam in this instance, I want to support Obsidian and Bethesda.

The point is, if developers want to use Steam, so be it, but it should be optional. I like to have my games installed on another disk and with its own folder (I know you can move Steam out of C: but that's one of its downside points: you have to tweak it yourself for it to work) not all games inside a Steam folder, it's just a matter of how I want *my* things organized, not how a third party programs decides it wants.
As I said before, I paid for the Collector's Edition, because I like to support developers and I like them giving other stuff like the chips and the deck, but I really hate to do double click on the game icon and wait for Steam to log, check if it has some update etc before I can even see the game launcher. Why pirates have it easy? Because, just in case developers don't know, the game is already pirated and just hours after a patch they already have a crack for it, if they thought that Steam was the "safest" thing against piracy, they fail miserably.
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Gwen
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 11:34 am

Well we can all hope that GoG's plan to release the Witcher 2 DRM free across all regions with store credit given to adjust for currency conversion price discrepancies. If releases like that are more successful and do not see higher rates of piracy, companies like Bethesda and Obsidian will be less inclined to see DRM as desirable.
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Bad News Rogers
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 4:33 am

I personally like Steam..especially when they have sales.

Never had any problems with Steam games or games added to Steam.

I have the retail version of New Vegas.

Installing and unlocking was a breeze..didn't have to re-download it like so many other retail version buyers had to.

Latest patch has NV humming like a V- 8.

Don't blame game makers or Steam for DRM...blame the pirates.
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Rob
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 12:14 am

Well we can all hope that GoG's plan to release the Witcher 2 DRM free across all regions with store credit given to adjust for currency conversion price discrepancies. If releases like that are more successful and do not see higher rates of piracy, companies like Bethesda and Obsidian will be less inclined to see DRM as desirable.

Yeah, I just got that email and saw the "100% DRM Free" bit. Will be interesting to see how it turns out.

I personally like Steam..especially when they have sales.

Never had any problems with Steam games or games added to Steam.

I have the retail version of New Vegas.

Installing and unlocking was a breeze..didn't have to re-download it like so many other retail version buyers had to.

Latest patch has NV humming like a V- 8.

Don't blame game makers or Steam for DRM...blame the pirates.

I blame Pirates for DRM, but I blame companies like Valve for making the DRM so poorly implemented, because we all know it has little to no effect.
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BRAD MONTGOMERY
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 12:10 am

Don't blame game makers or Steam for DRM...blame the pirates.


Yeah even if one were to presume the argument that DRM does not reduce the rate of piracy in AAA titles was true there would have to be sufficient examples of AAA titles with DRM free releases and sales/piracy figures to convince publishers of this. In the absense of sufficient evidence that DRM simply costs the publisher money without having the expecpted effect on overall piracy figures they will err on the side of caution and do what they believe will help protect their intellectual property.

No amount of arguing will accomplish what making a conscious decision to purchase DRM free products when available. I usually wait for a game of the year version to purchase DLC anyways- if they release a DRM free version of the eventual game of the year or gold edition of Fallout New Vegas then I will be certain to purchase it. Usually it's cheaper than purchasing individual DLC anyways or roughly the same price. If it means I get to help the marketplace vote for less DRM as well- all the better.

In the meantime though I don't find Steam to be particularly objectionable. Sure DRM free is preferable, but at least they aren't pulling an Ubisoft on us (heck they've even switched to Steamworks now due to consistent backlash over their own DRM efforts).
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Lisa
 
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Post » Mon May 02, 2011 9:36 pm

Showler

so this is interesting. There is no exe once the DVD finished installing.

So that swap exe trick does not work thanks to Steam.

It looks like the exe are created while doing the forced update but those exes are v1.2.


1. Install DVD

2. While close to finish installing cut internet line to prevent Steam auto update (while being deselected, nice Steam)

3. No FalloutNV.exe or FalloutNVLauncher.exe visible.

4. Start FalloutNV while update is disabled game cannot be started and Steam goes into update mode.

5. While doing the update the exes appear.

6. Property check and version reveals they are all 1.2 versions.





I had a similar issue with Operation Flashpoint. The game was so buggy and online servers
so useless the game was dead 3 month after release and they do not spend any time on it
fixing it more.

I am not risking this again.


So thats it then for me. No other option. Bestbuy I come.
No matter what legal right they claim I do not have.

This is not right either. We are customers not cash cows.
If they wanna run an update make sure it works. Or there is at least a way to use this product with
having the update forced on you.

I have to do the same for work.

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c.o.s.m.o
 
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Post » Tue May 03, 2011 10:46 am

It stops those with less computer knowledge (IE: anyone who knows how to burn a DVD is out of luck) but other then that, there is little measurable effect. And of that effect that is measurable, most people who do pirate games end up buying them as well, though I would imagine that NV isnt seeing that so much.

Hell, look at Minecraft. That game has over 600,000 units sold, and yet the game has no DRM. The only thing stopping someone from pirating it is you need to log in via the client after you buy it to unlock the off-line mode. No need for me to share what happens after that.


Actually, since the .exe for a Steam only title is stored on the Steam servers and encrypted, it makes it impossible to leak a Steam only game before release - which is the most damaging form of piracy from a publishers viewpoint as day 1 sales are usually the highest volume you will ever see. Publishers easily see between 25 to 40% of their total sales just from day 1.
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jessica Villacis
 
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