Trust me, he's one of the worst. He murdered a man's daughter in front of him just to watch him cry as he was hauled off to prison for supporting the Forsworn. He's horrible. The Jarl who replaces him if you support the Stormcloaks is no better.

Almost every Jarl in this game svcks. It's true. They are either dumb as a box of rocks, or selfish, easily manipulated, or corrupt. I think that Ulfric is among the better Jarls in Skyrim. Unfortunately, that doesn't say much. Balgruuf, Vignar, and Brunwulf Free-Winter I would also count as decent Jarls, though they are not saints either. Elisif comes off as a decent Jarl, until you realize that she is basically a puppet, repeating what her 5 or 6 advisers constantly tell her day after day. The Empire wants Elisif as High Queen not because she is an intelligent young woman (which I think she is), but because she is too inexperienced to make her own decisions, giving the Empire license to make decisions for her, like they did with Torygg. Maybe in about 20 years Elisif will be a great Jarl, but now she just isn't.

Brunwulf Free-Winter is probably my favorite Jarl. He's the one with the best intentions, IMO.

fair enough. I forgot about those Cidna Mine guys.

and no, Vignar seems like a huge opportunist to me, an old, whiny, snake. I hate him.

Brunwulf is also a good Jarl, I agree.

Balgruuf states his policy quite clearly - he doesn't consider the war to be something he wants Whiterun to involve itself in. Ulfric is the one who makes the mistake there by assuming Balgruuf is an enemy. Ulfric could probably have waged the entire war against Tullius without ever once involving Whiterun but he wants the trading city so much he decides to anyway.

It's a mistake that gives Tullius an extra Jarldom.



Counterpoint, serfdom doesn't exist in Tamriel. Also, commoners can apparently become Kings. Skyrim nobility thus resembles nothing we've ever seen on Earth.

perhaps. It may just not be in English. Norse/Scandenavian medieval history may be enlightening, not sure.

He's a nice man, but not who I'd want in charge during a time of war- which in Tamriel is almost always. I think he was so embittered by his experiences in the Great War that he has gone too far to the other side. Ulfric, at least, has his eye on the ball- to defeat the Thalmor. Brunwulf's hopes to reinvent the dynamic that has existed between Dunmer and Nord for two centuries is ambitious but probably naive, and his speeches about how there is no glory in war won't help Skyrim do what it has to do in face of the Thalmor threat.

Have you listened to Ulfric's and Galmar's discussion about Balgruuf? Ulfric wants to give him more time, says Balgruuf is a "true Nord" and will come around. But Whiterun is absolutely crucial to holding the country. It is a trade hub and breadbasket. Both sides recognize this, which is why Tullius is also pressuring Balgruuf and tells Rikke to feed him false information about Ulfric if she has to.

Early Germanic kings were not hereditary. They were chosen by the assembly based on who was the strongest war leader. It wasn't a given that a king's son would become king after him. Early Germanic society also didn't know feudalism. Landowners and warriors were free men, who might take an oath for a time but then move on if they wanted to.

Yeah, they make us Thanes so we aren't mis-identified as "common rabble".

Except Ulfric.

The aforementioned, "Good Jarl" too.

You misunderstand. What I mean is that Ulfric doesn't consider his people "common rabble" which means he cares more about the people than some of the other jarls. Don't misuse my words

No. No I don't. I don't doubt Ulfric doesn't consider people common rabble (even if it's just Nords). I just said Mister Free Winters doesn't do it either.

where did we get the impression that the whole of the Empire being weak meant that Skyrim would be powerful?

Ulfric represents a return to the way things were. A resisted return on the part of some of the Jarls like Balgruuf who tries to balance the expectations of the Empire and the traditions of his people.

They're wimpy, and worse after the Stormcloak victory than before it because Elisif and Laila stay in place and are joined by Gray-Mane and Silver-Blood.

A High King will have to unite them and then give them opportunities to grow or be replaced, I suspect.

My Dovahkiin would happily take Riften if he so chooses. She likes it there and... well... SOMEONE has to lead it and make it strong again. Laila is gonna lay down and let her crooked steward and Maven Black-Briar use her as a doormat and will never bring Riften back to where it used to be.

On that note, btw... anyone taken a look at the distressing state of buildings and repair in Windhelm?

a valid point, but I must ask which war you're referring to? The civil war, or the upcoming thalmor war?

if it's the civil war, remember that Brunwulf only takes charge when Ulfric, and the steam of the civil war, is killed, thus ending the immediate conflict for skyrim. While i agree he does come across as a pacifist, I feel that it's only because he thinks the civil war is a pointless waste of lives. Plus, Skyrim is relatively isolated. When war with the Thalmor does break out, Skyrim will be distant enough to escape most of the damages, other than personnel. This lull before the storm would possibly be the perfect time for him to successfully bridge the gap between the nords and dunmer.

War with the Dominion. It's coming, whether it's in Skyrim or not. Since the PGE says the Altmer are masters of naval warfare, they could try to attack from the sea. Ulfric seems to think they will invade. After a victory he says that his biggest worry is that the Thalmor will attack before they're ready. That sounds to me like he believes it's a matter of when, not if.

Eh, when you first approach him he says it takes daring to approach a jarl without summons. He's as imperious as any of them. He seems to be on more level terms with his men. At one point Ralof comments that he doesn't think Galmar even knows his name, but Ulfric knows it and is concerned about him.

Yes, the number of useless Jarls on both sides is one of the reasons I like this game so much.

also, i too have noticed the structures in windhelm look a bit... decrepit.

It's a very old city. Other than that, not really? Riften looks more dilapidated.

Well she is young and was put there because of Ulfric.

And unlike many of the horrible Jarls, she knows she's inexperienced and won't make wise decisions, so she defers to her advisors who do have expertise. I don't think it is clear that she's dumb at all when she can admit her own shortcomings. For all we know she'd be a great Jarl in a few years after she gains experience. She certainly cares about all of her citizens which makes her a good bit better than the majority of the Jarls. As a result of all that, Solitude is clearly one of the best-run cities.

Well said sir.

No one's made the claim that she's dumb. She's just inexperienced. Yes that makes her a bad jarl currently, but perhaps not in the future.

Keep in mind she does rule by emotion too. The burning of king olaf is a rather important bard college and in books is said to be a highly celebrated tradition for the city. That's a good deal of commerce you're giving up by cancelling the ceremony. The problem I have with her is she's too easily influenced at the moment by all her advisors. One bad apple could spoil the bunch.

She may become a good jarl in the future, she's been given a rather rough start.

He's not a 'nice man' in that he won't do anything to protect his citizens - in fact, he's just the opposite. He'll take action to defend ALL of his citizens, Nord or otherwise. That's why I think he's the best man for the job, especially in a town that's been turned so far backward as Windhelm.

Balgruuf is the only worthwhile Jarl

To be fair, I don't think Ulfric is looking down at you when he says that. I think he respects anyone who comes directly to him without going through all of the protocols that other Jarls go through. He doesn't say it in an, "I'm better than you because I'm a Jarl" way but in more of a, "Someone who knows how to come directly to me can probably get stuff done" kind of way. He certainly doesn't seem to give much of a crap that you did. More than anything, Ulfric judges people on their passion and their actions. To him, anyone who cares deeply for Skyrim and is willing to put their money where their mouth is is not "common," no matter where they come from. And he even thinks this about people who support the Empire, such as Legate Rikke and, yes, Jarl Balgruuf.


This. While being able to listen to advice and know when you are in over your head is a good thing, being wholly dependent on advisors is not and leaves you open to corruption or being misled. Look at the Jarl of Riften. She cares about her people a great deal, but trusts her Steward and Maven Black-briar who tell her there is no corruption and nothing wrong and her city is a hellhole. Solitude is run well. It is also completely run by the Empire, with both General Tullius and her Empire-approved advisors steering Elisif in the direction of supporting the Empire's interests. That isn't a good thing. It doesn't make Elisif a bad person, but in my opinion it doesn't make her anywhere near the best choice to lead Solitude or Skyrim.

you've mentioned two different Jarls. i hope you're aware of this.