[KU Fint]

I've been playing with this mod for 10 hours with my new character, and I have one small thing I'd like to point out: The silvered steel smithing. I don't think those weapons should need a flawness sapphire to create. Basically, at the level I unlocked it (13) I can't find a flawless sapphire. I'm pretty sure I'll have hit the next level of the smithing tree before I find a single one of them, and I need three. (two if I only create one sword and one dagger, but three if I create two swords and a dagger). If they must have some gem there, make it normal sapphires instead of flawless. (imo)

[Lil'.KiiDD]

I vote #1

Too many extra steps is just tedious. Requiring material resources is one thing, but requiring the player to take their resources and convert them and then convert them AGAIN is ridiculous.

[Lalla Vu]

I vote #1

To many extra steps is just tedious. Requiring material resources is one thing, but requiring the player to take their resources and convert them and then convert them AGAIN is ridiculous.

When you put it that way, I guess I agree with you. I change my vote to # 1.

[(G-yen)]

I'd also vote for #1, if I'm given a vote. Preparing wood isn't really a step that adds much. It's good with #1.

[Arnold Wet]

I also vote #1. I think the 'preparing' stage could easily be justified as included in the smithing process.

Regarding gems for item creation, I do think it's a bit much to require flawless gems for a lot of items. In my opinion, physically, there's no reason you would have to use a flawless gem as opposed to a common one in the creation of a weapon. Ideally you could use either, but that would be difficult to implement. Maybe there could be a system of transforming common gems into flawless ones, or the other way around. I don't know.

[Katie Louise Ingram]

For the record, I haven't touched any of the crafting recipes yet.

Gems will only be used on weapons that have gems on the model and yes they won't require flawless.

As for the wood:
So we've got a consensus that there shouldn't be a second step for wood making. But that still leaves us with the question of source.
It's either firewood blocks or lumber mills. Both require the same amount of steps (activate, wait) the only differences are that firewood blocks are somewhat more common and lumber mills don't need an axe. I'll admit that I personally prefer lumber mills, because they currently do nothing and because the idea of making a staff out of a chunk of firewood is pretty incongruous for me, but if people prefer firewood because of the simplicity of it then I'll go with it instead.

I am torn. From a realism standpoint id say yes to needing prepared wood; however, since the woodcutting axe is so heavy i never carry it. So getting the wood would be tedious. If prepared wood was regularly sold by smiths that would solve problem, imo.

Naturally Smiths would sell prepared wood, probably in about the same quantity that they currently sell iron ore or leather.

Current change list:
Silver weapons now have a new script. Damage is +25% instead of +20 points. Would like to know if people think this is too low.
Silver weapons are now no longer all listed as swords (Bug I missed in the change over).
New Perk tree.
Smithing leveling bug fixed.
Silvered Steel Forging Perk, currently not needed to make silver weapons, does unlock improving them twice as much.
Gem Dust value changed.
Steel Smithing changed to Apprentice Smithing. Now upgrades iron/leather/hide/etc twice as much as well.

Was hoping to have a release with crafting done for the Easter weekend, but I'll upload the mod with as much as I get done for you guys to playtest and finish it up when I get home.

To Do:
Make Gem Dust alchemical ingredients.
Set Silver gold value.
Lower Silver weight slightly.
Finish Books, add to leveled lists.
Edit all crafting recipes.
Add gold value to weapons with jewels.
Make variants for the plain wood longbow (steel core, silver core, etc).

[JUan Martinez]

Well, ideally the wood could be gathered both ways. I mean it's the same wood after all, it's only the shape that has changed, right? But if you -must- choose one or the other, I'd have to go with the wood-chopping instead of the mill.

The magic weapons that require runes could be worth a little less as well, say about 30% less?

As for the silver weapon damage, if the bonus is too low then it'll end up being better to use another weapon against undeads instead of a silver weapon. To maintain the usefulness of a silver weapon a bit longer, I'd say a bonus of +40% would be better than +25%. (+25% is very low imo)

[Dean Ashcroft]

I'm beginning to suspect that I'm failing to communicate properly here. Why would you no longer be able to get firewood if I made it so that you made handles from a different kind of wood you get somewhere else?

[Connor Wing]

I don't think anyone has thought that.

I think it's silly to spread one resource across multiple in-game items though. There's already a type of prepared wood in-game, along with a method for its acquisition. Case closed.

I understand a desire to make lumber mills useful, but this isn't a lumber mill mod. Making lumber mills useful should not be one of its design goals.

[Tina Tupou]

That's what I was getting from his post, not sure what he means by choosing one or the other if not that.

It's also not a making chopping firewood useful mod, there's not a great deal of difference as far as I can see.
Though I suppose firewood is already useful in that I'm using it for the arrow recipes. I'll just patch it for myself when I'm done then. Maybe it's just because I'm a carpenters son, but using firewood to make something longer than firewood makes about as much sense to me as sticking two cars together to make a truck.

Anyway, will be away from the civilized world for the next four days, but here's a little going away present:
http://www.mediafire.com/?qd3fl137b3449zo

Same as the change list above except for:
Silver weapons now do +50% damage against Draugr (So a weapon that did 20 damage per hit does 30 vs Draugr, Ghosts and Werecritters). Which means that against the undead it's roughly equal to high tier materials like glass and ebony. Feel like this may be overkill, but it does make a bit more sense than dwemer/orichalcum being better at killing the undead than silver, so playtest it and tell me how it works.
Gem dust now made at the smelter. Makes as much sense as making it at the forge, but this way it won't level your smithing skill.
Flawless gems can be cut into two regular gems. Yes I know this is game breaking (two regular are worth more than one flawless) and more than a little silly, I just did it to see how it felt in game and forgot to take it out again.

[Natasha Biss]

HEY. I like the idea of making handles at lumber mills. I would love to use Lumber Mills if I actually got something out of it. IT'S PERFECT.

[M!KkI]

I think this mod has completely forgot about forsworn weapons. Those are, for example, still upgraded with ingots.

I have a question though: Is it normal that I still have crafting options of the -old- items in the forge? For example, I have to identical versions of a dagger, but one of them needs two strips and ingots, while the other needs only one of each. In addition, there's still some other weapons in the game that require ingots to upgrade, for example the Orchalium Orchis Axe that I spawned with thanks to live another life. When I went to upgrade it, it needed an ingot and not gem dust. Is it normal that these normal items are still in the game?

[Jamie Lee]

I don't think all the vanilla items have been removed yet Gorbad. I think that is one of the next steps if memory serves.

[Ash]

Yep, that's part of dealing with all the crafting recipes, old recipes are yet to be removed (they were left in for testing by Baratan). Forsworn weapons won't been left out, I was wanting to make some variants for them (principally high end ones made from chips of orichalcum/glass/ebony ore), but that would delay the release quite a bit, so for now at least the plan is to make them craft-able with antlers.

Had also planned on re-balancing them so they'd no longer better than steel, which never made sense to me and made them pretty imbalanced if you got your hands on them at low level. Was thinking of making them about on par with iron, but having nearly all of them have an enchantment. Makes them about as dangerous as they were before, removes the logical inconsistency of having them do massive damage and adds to the forsworn's character by playing on the magic using savages angle. Not sure if they should be craft-able off the bat or require a book though.

[Devin Sluis]

I wouldn't require a book for the Forsworn stuff. They just throw stuff together and hit you with it. There's no real craftmanship, and anyone could emulate it easily.

[Siidney]

Basic Bows:
http://i418.photobucket.com/albums/pp267/TWmodshots/AOTBows.jpg

[Zosia Cetnar]

Basic Bows:
http://i418.photobucket.com/albums/pp267/TWmodshots/AOTBows.jpg

Looks good Albatross. Which overlays did you use?

[Dona BlackHeart]

Basic Bows:
http://i418.photobucket.com/albums/pp267/TWmodshots/AOTBows.jpg

Those look great Albatross.

[maria Dwyer]

Looks good Albatross. Which overlays did you use?

Nordic Blue for the silver and steel, Orcish Green for Orichalcum, Elven Red for Moonstone and Leather Blood Soaked for Daedric. Ebony, Dwemer and Glass I just used a solid colour overlay. For the wood I used Darkwood for the Ebony and Glass and tweaked the rest by hand.

Thanks a tonne for sending me the texture files, made it a lot easier to do. Will probably go back and try to tweak the Glass and Dwemer ones though, the colours don't match up well enough to your work.

[Andrea P]

I might see about setting up the algorithms for enchanted weapons sometime this weekend, just giving you a heads up.

Might even get the leveled list replacement set up for all the enchanted weapons, too. At the least it's easy to add each to their own lists.

[Sista Sila]

Yes, I would love to be able to forge and craft Forsworn and Falmer stuff. Also, to make Pickaxes and Woodcutting Axes Improvable with the apprentice smithing.

[Frank Firefly]

Doing the tempering recipes at the moment.

How does everyone feel about:
Diamond - Daedric
Emerald - Glass
Sapphire - Ebony
Ruby - Dwemer
Amethyst - Moonstone
Garnet - Orcish
Corundum - Iron/Steel/Silver

Also, just a heads up, I've replaced the current gem dusts with versions that act as alchemical reagents (Because Morrowind), so you might want to hold off on converting those gems till the next version.

[Pawel Platek]

I wouldn't use corundum as its own gem. Rubies and sapphires already are corundum.

[SWagg KId]

Doing the tempering recipes at the moment.

How does everyone feel about:
Diamond - Daedric
Emerald - Glass
Sapphire - Ebony
Ruby - Dwemer
Amethyst - Moonstone
Garnet - Orcish
Corundum - Iron/Steel/Silver

Also, just a heads up, I've replaced the current gem dusts with versions that act as alchemical reagents (Because Morrowind), so you might want to hold off on converting those gems till the next version.

You could require mamoth tusk dust or salt pile for the iron/steel, and maybe pearl for silver. There is a mod that adds pearls to clams. Or have them for sale at merchants/loot.

[Ben sutton]

They state pretty clearly in game that only giants can grind mammoth tusks to dust and I'd rather not have the player have to buy a rare material to upgrade basic weapons. As for the pearls, modding them into the game specifically for that seems to be a level of feature creep I'd rather not get into and as above, I'd rather not have buying it be the only way for the player to get it.

And well, salt to sharpen iron and steel. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you don't live near the coast?

I wouldn't use corundum as its own gem. Rubies and sapphires already are corundum.

What should I use corundum for though? As it is it's pretty useless, it's no longer required to make steel ingots and I'd rather not change it's value/name for compatibility with other mods.

I know it's the same material as ruby/sapphire, but then again so is ruby/sapphire. Changing the name is pretty pointless, so I might as well just hand wave it as corundum the metal rather than corundum the gem as it is in the base game. If people want to change it's name themselves that's fine, but the name isn't really a good reason to omit it from the game completely. And changing the value/name to use as something like an accent material for iron doesn't work either, that just makes it less compatible with other mods and makes iron harder to make than steel.

Edit:
I guess you could just call it Emery. The colour is wrong, but it is a type of Corundum that's distinct from sapphire/ruby and is used as an industrial abrasive.