Picture this:
CoC and Dovahkiin face each other. CoC stops time for everything but himself. Dovahkiin uses Become Ethereal. With this he can be invincible during the time slow down. Dovahkiin has 100% + magic resistance, so there's no effect of CoC using Mehrune's Razor on him. He just keeps freezing time and attempting with the dagger until he runs out of uses for both.
And the Dovahkiin can
1. use "Become Ethereal" for all damage to him to become void.
2. Slow Time
3. Storm Call
4. Call Dragon
5. Whirlwind Sprint
6. etc..
All of which he can use one right after another. And Dovahkiin has millions of heal, stamina and magicka and does millions of damage on every weapon, no enchantments needed on the weapons. So, CoC about to slow down time? Become Ethereal. Invincible during time slow down. CoC super fast? Slow Down Time. One shot him with a bow, slow down time even more by zooming in. Call Dragon for Odahviing to rain death upon him. Storm Call for lightning death too. Whirlwind Sprint to dodge. Just having Dragon Shouts don't make him win but they do help a helluva lot.

EDIT: THIS NEXT THING ENDS YOUR WHOLE ARGUEMENT. Taken from the page on the Staff of Sheogorath: "...and no target affected by the staff can be damaged by attacks." http://uesp.net/wiki/Shivering:Staff_of_Sheogorath
So... yeah.

My Mage from Oblivion has destruction spells that could one-shot my Dovahkiin because Destruction was actually good in OB. Shouts don't mean [censored]... CoC every time.

How is he supposed to cast Become Ethereal if time has stopped? And what's keeping CoC from waiting for Become Ethereal to wear off?
And I know you can't damage anything when time is stopped, but all you have to do is stop time, count to ten, use the dagger, rinse and repeat.
And not that it matters, but how the hell will he ever get a chance to use ALL those shouts? Hell, it's debateable if Storm Call would even work, seeing as Sheogorath (and the now CoC) can manipulate the weather himself.

And again, taken from the wiki, referring to Skyrim:

Dovahkiin cannot get 100% magic resistance. He's vulnerable to the Razor.

Unique items, not crafting when it came to reflect damage/spells. 100% chameleon would have to be a different set of gear or a spell.

Mundane Ring, spell breaker, Necklace of swords, etc stacked a few other items and you're set.

P.S. Small point, the razor may be potentially deadly, but it's a crappy overall weapon and incredibly unreliable. It could even be reflected back at you in oblivion.

EDIT: To be perfectly fair, a lot of the repute CoC has is because of DLC, if we wanna make this fair it has to either be with vanilla CoC and Dovahkiin (which is boring) or with both with all their DLC.

He casts Become Ethereal a CoC is about to slow down time. It lasts for 18 seconds, Staff lasts for 15. So Dovahkiin has 3 seconds to sprint away, then whirlwind sprint for more distance. CoC never gets the chance to use the Razor. And with Dovahkiin 80% spell absorption as well as 85% magic resist, the already small chances of the Razor working are even more dimmed to almost naught.

1. The Staff of Sheogorath makes targets invulnerable, which makes sense if you think of it since each atom is immovable.

2. Dovahkiin can get 100% magic absorb so it's the same thing.

3. Kill animations = 100% Mehrunes with larger range. The second time stop wears off, Dovahkiin will do a kill animation on the COC if he tries to get close for a hit.

The Dovahkiin at his peak, is a nightingale, werewolf, cannibalistic, emperor assassinating, dragonborn. I've played oblivion, and I think skyrims main character is the tougher guy. The fact that he can use shouts is more than enough for an advantage.

Dovah may be able to use shouts, but CoC can silence him, Shouts won't do much if you can't talk

Lets see... (will use lore view because I find gameplay view to be plain ridiculous)

Eternal Champion and Uriel's Agent are weaker than the future heroes so I won't consider them...

Nerevearine: Dragonborn, blessed by Daedra Lord Azura and Talos, good with words, slayed two half-gods and defeated the avatra of a Daedra Lord Hircine

Champion of Cyrodiil: blessed by the Nine, reincarnation of Pelinal Whitestrake and thus possibly another reincarnation of Lorkhan/Shor, god of mortals, killed the Dragonborn trio of Mankar Camoran and his children in their own pocket realm and that after fighting his way through Daedra, defeated Daedric Prince of Order who, in Dawn Era, almost conquered entire oblivion and the CoC is now Sheogorath, god of Madness and one of most powerful Daedric Princes

Dovahkiin: Dragonborn, blessed by Akatosh and Kyne, slayer of Alduin the World Eater, master of Odaahviing, Alduin's right Hand and thus one of most powerful dragons, either Leader of the resourceful and powerful Blades OR friend of Paarthurnax, Alduin's brother and new king of dragons, able to summon most powerful Nordic heroes from Sovngarde

Battle-wise, I'd say CoC beats Nerevearine who beats Dovahkiin.
Overall Power-wise Dovahkiin (has powerful allies and his story still ain't finished) beats CoC (who is no longer person he once was and can only influence Mundus now due to Martin's victory) who beats Nerevearine (who was Azura's puppet to the point that he left Morrowind when the Red Year phase of her plan got near)

peen cheese

You could have at least use better items, Imperial Dragon armor svcked.


Why bother hitting CoC at all? Just fus it down the cliff.

I don't think Shouts quite fall into the same category as other spells.

Silence effect doesn't exist in TES5: Skyrim.
Thus, Dovahkiin can't be silenced as there is no effect to make him unable to shout... or unable to cast spells for that matter... thus he is immune to that spell effect

The hell, this is still going?

I think we need to wait for the Skyrim DLC's to come out. I mean at the moment the most valid arguments against Dovahkiin lore-wise is that CoC os Sheogorath, but we seriously have no idea what Bethesda is planning. After all DLC's are out then this will become a fair battle.

"Silence" as in the inability to speak? you can't shout if you can't talk

I don't think the spell effect "silence" literally makes you unable to speak. Silence, like, your magic ability is silenced.

actually that is exactly what it means. in early RPGs a character would have to speak to be able to cast spells. then eventually developers made it so the caster does not what to chant, but they Kept the name for the debuff "Silence" as a silent tribute to the RPGs of old (D&D anyone).

wow, no wonder people call me sheldon....

Magic is immaterial. Slience can be absorbed by a vampire-necromage's 100% magic absorption. Both COC and Dovahkiin are effectively immuned to targeted magic.

I guess I can allow myself to play this game we are playing here and participate in the mechanics discussion of this thread.

The Nerevarine does not need to fly. In Morrowind we had a little something called "Sanctuary" and if you had 100 of it then you basically dodged every single attack, arrows too. And with 100% in either spell resistance or spell absorption no magical nor physical attack can ever touch you. And if the kill animation would ignore sanctuary then the Nerevarine can still fly up and reign death from above

Just 1 point to add, even though you could phrase it so Dovahkiin's actions seem more epic, when you actually consider the things you did as CoC in the main campaign it was really way more impressive.

You literally went to a Daedric Lord's realm (which basically resembles hell), took on a HUGE amount of enemies (a lot of them at once too) like Dremora, Xivilai, Spider Daedra, etc all the way up a tower in order to collapse that gate.
Fighting dragons was badass, and I've certainly had awesome stuff happen to me in Skyrim where I was even fighting more than one dragon (though that was a bug), but when you consider the fact that the CoC would fight a small army of daedra every time he went inside a gate, dragons don't seem as problematic.

And the fact is (and this is one of the ways you could look at this question), if my Oblivion guy fought my Skyrim guy -even though I love my Skyrim guy more- my Oblivion guy would destroy him. Dovahkiin might have an advantage in melee combat, but CoC's magic and enchanting (anyone remember the stacking weakness spells?) would be damn near overwhelming.

It is quite safe to say Kill Animation will ignore sanctuary because the concept of dodge is not present in Skyrim and therefore does not factor in the calculation for triggering.

It will be a stalemate at most because raining zero damage fireballs at someone don't do much except messing up his picnic spread. Been forced to levitate at a distance forever has it's problems, namely the Dovahkiin can loot your house and poo on your bed.

100% resist magic dovahkiin though.


But, CoC wins if we look purely at what the games offer: 100% reflect damage and reflect spell for CoC, 100% chameleon. 100% resist magic for dovahkiin. CoC kills dovahkiin because dovahkiin can't see him or hurt him, while CoC's normal attacks do damage the dovah.

Purely looking at what the game offer, CoC wins. Dovahkiin can't hurt him in any way, but CoC can hurt dovahkiin.

Dovahkiin. Shouts serve as an advantage, and the eater of worlds surely ruin CoC in a short and quick fashion.

Before CoC even has time to grab the staff Dovahkiin would have fus-ro-dah'd him off a cliff.