So you didn't actually create this thread with the intention of asking the question, did you?

Dawnguard was just released. Comparing the price of this to the sale prices of older games is an exercise in pointlessness.

Yeah, mods that rely on scripts should be used sparingly and with care, but with everything else conflicts are easy to resolve. Using many mods takes some knowhow, an advanced mod user is pretty much a modder himself, but the end result is more than worth it.

My current New Vegas install has 147 plugins (including all official DLC), and the only issue is the occasional loading screen freeze that is an engine problem, and as a result it is pretty much the only game i need when it comes to shooting things

On the mod subject...

Yes, I know I COULD scan, but as I said, the sheer amount of dross available... well, it's like looking for a single pearl in a vat of oysters, for me anyway. I don't feel as if I'm "missing out" by not taking advantage of this side of the game. BTDT on many previous games, and never felt any of them were really "up to snuff" (with a few minor exceptions for some of the Quakes' mods).

On potential viruses, etc. Don't kid yourself. It is entirely possible to embed a virus inside a texture image. They're not "safe", inherently.

Personally, I'd like to see a proof-of-concept on that one. Using JPEG, please. (We'll keep it easy, for now.) But you are a coder, so you know that what you just said means that there if there is an exploit in the render engine, then code may be inserted in the image to be rendered. Images are easy to hide code in, but rather difficult to hide code in that will cause an action to be performed inside the render engine. Not that the hiding of the code is difficult, (it is trivial) but the finding the exploit on the engine. Code that does mess with the graphics engine usually never gets any farther than dropping the GPU. Which is a PITA, but not data-threatening.

Are you sure that you are a coder?

I don't know if Dawnguard is worth 20$ or not but I do know that my 'pride' is worth more than that. When Beth is ready to maintain and support their original fanbase again, I'll be ready to buy their products once again. People who come on the forums raging about getting lied to, overlooked and ignored but then run shopping the minute this company farts out something will always get screwed and continue to complain and feel sour. I'm done with that. Vanilia Skyrim with a decent amount of mods is more than enough.

If you're a PC user, you could also think about it this way: Should I spend 20$ on something that modders already gave me months ago for free? Summonable horse, huge castle, monster follower, vampire/werewolf perks and overhaul, new zone, new dungeon, new monsters, new NPCs and dialogues, new storyline. All of these can be grabbed at Nexus. All of them.

rule #1 of marketing: start high, because you can never go up, but you can always go down.

now either buy the dlc or wait, now quit your damn whining

Except the Nexus versions of these things are not even close to being in the same league as Dawnguard. I love mods as much as the next guy, but there's just nothing available for Skyrim that's close to a professional level of development.

LOL. If I'm not than I've been doing something wrong for the last 20week uears or so. Perrun. Cmon I can't be that "cutting edge". Surelyyou know the implications of this, and other, demonstrated exploits and how easy they are to modify into something more malicious?

$20 isn't much considering the amount of content you get compared to other games DLC but I'm really not interested in this DLC at all, I'll just pick it up dirt cheap after all of the other DLC is released. Now if they released something similar to Bloodmoon or The Shivering Isles then count me in, but Vampires and Werewolves bore me.

This.
There are some incredible quest mods out there ('Much Ado about Snow Elves' uses voice actors from the original game, for example, and Moonpath is constantly held up due to the sheer amount of content it adds), but none really reach the quality of professional DLC, and a lot of the shining examples don't integrate brilliantly with the main game itself, feel a bit isolated (exist in their own worlds etc.). The achievements of a mod often get a bit exaggerated because it was made by an amateur rather than professionals - they can be great, yes, but let's be realistic, if a professional company released some of the better mods out there, people would be very critical. Bethesda knows this - it's why they're comfortable charging $20 when the creation kid is readily available.



The problem with this topic is that opinion's will differ quite a lot as to what $20 is 'worth' in terms of DLC, particularly when there's so much free content out there. Personally, I'm constantly on the nexus and my game is straining under the weight of my load order, but I don't feel that all that free content necessarily devalues Dawnguard. If there were mods that truly did replicate Dawnguard (or come close) then that would be different - aside from freely available arrow-smithing mods, I don't really see that happening. You might think differently though - playing through some of the excellent mods on the nexus will occupy a lot of time and I can see how that might dissuade you from spending $20 when you've got plenty of free content still to explore. I've run through most of the good stuff, so I feel more inclined to cough up.

Finally someone with some self-respect. I look at these people buying it after days of complaining and just think "wtf??"

Mods cause numerous problems that are beyond Bethesda's control. They don't build DLCs around custom content from modders and they don't test using every mod out there. As for the CTDs some of them are caused by Mods not the DLC. Other CTDs is becaue the person's PC is not up to the task or they did not patch their game to 1.7 before installing the DLC. I don't install several mods play the game until all DLCs are relased then I go get more mods.

This, another reason I like to stick to consoles, in terms of crashing and stuff, a console is ten times more stable.

Oh consoles are so great. At least I can mod with the PC version and use console commands to get around bugs. Bugs on a console you are stuck without anyway to get around it. I bought Skyrim no crashes and Dawnguard no crashes. I play on the PC. I find consoles limiting. Please don't start a war over this one is better than that one. Same argument that Apple's are better than a PC and Apple's don't crash ever!? Why even reply to what I said? Want to start a flame war? Not good.

20 dollars yes, 20 euro's no. 20 euro's is 16 dollars.

I think you reversed the exchange rate, so that sentence makes no sense.

EURO 1 = USD 1.2379

Judging from the content it is worth $20....

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls_V:_Dawnguard

The value of the product is determined by the buyer.

For me it was worth it because I have money to buy it with, even if it was bad I would have bought it because I'm a fan on the series. If Skyrim had been the worst game I had played I wouldn't have bought it, but that isn't the case. I've played Skyrim for 240 hours and I've completed everything in the game, that's just how I played. I've been circling around like a hungry shark waiting for Dawnguard. I wouldn't have an issue paying more because honestly I have the cash to throw at it. Obviously if it is worth it for you is determined by how much money you have, I would never make a post like this because I watch trailers, I read reviews, I generally have a good sense of the quality of a game before I make a purchase and I don't think you'll get a load of unbiased critique on the Dawnguard forums.

Maybe he could have left out the final exaggeration in his post, because other than that, I'm kinda inclined to agree. If I had more time on my hands, I would probably have a fairly high spec rig. The problem is, my gaming time is a precious commodity these days. If I had to spend it unravelling some big problem being caused by a mod, or one of the other myriad things which could balls-up on me... Well... I think the PC would end up flying out the window.

I personally will sacrifice graphics and mods for the plug n playability.

Well I'm NOT a Bethesda employee, and I enjoy Dawnguard.

Come at me bro.

No way. Everyone knows that the only people who enjoy Bethesda games are their employees. That's how they make millions of sales on each of their games. By employing millions and millions of people.

Yeah really, lol.

Well, seeing as how it is 3x less than most full games, and adds 3x the content, yes, I'm happy at the price.

No,in fact forgotten vale alone worth even more

Exactly, and Bethesda has failed to convince me that it is worth that much. Additionally it costs more here in europe than in the US.