and it was then Oderless stumbled on the event of Masser & Secunda.

a Deus Ex Machina is an entity or character that appears with no precedence in the story to immediately resolve the plot. Given that Elder Scrolls are prominent in the lore, and their potential is known (But not understood) I don't really think this qualifies.

The Crucible in Mass Effect 3 was a plot device, the catalyst(Starchild) was a Deus Ex Machina.

Still, I'm unsure of how exactly an Elder Scroll is supposed to do something to the sun. Maybe the belief that Coldharbour is simply an example of Nirn's future is true, and using the Elder Scroll hastens the transformation?

you know to much.....

I don't know if anyone thought of it this way, but blocking out the sun is a better way of the vampire lords showing their power then if they just removed the damage of sun. What would be better than striking fear into Tamriel than showing you can make it night, forever. You show you have the ultimate control, ultimate power, and that you shouldn't be meddled with.

Also, the use of E.S. is the only way that could make sense in the mortal plane. Why would a Daedric Lord or a Divine want to help a group strike more fear/obedience into Tamriel than they can cause.

Dude the empire was using Crossbows, and they knew how to make them.

Crossbows weren't in Skyrim originally because the devs didn't want to put them in.

I think it was originally because of physics and collision issues (Specifically in Oblivion). When Fallout 3 came out, it had the Railway Rifle, and that gun alone had a lot of game-breaking bugs (Lockups and the like) so at least that makes sense.

In Skyrim, I think they're just afraid of any redundancy at all, which is kind of stupid. I've said it once, and I'll say it again, Bethesda is so afraid of redundancy, if they ran a Nuclear Power Plant, we'd all be dead.

But at least we have Crossbows now, that's one off the list (Of weapons alone)... Maybe Spears in Hearthfire?

I don't know what the development issues were.

I was saying that the Crossbow dosn't exist in this xpack because they use an Elder Scroll to make one lol.

But crossbows do exist in this expansion... because the only difference between a bow and a crossbow is a trigger assembly... I don't see where the Elder Scroll factors into Crossbows.

I just think they've had enough of the complaints, and want to prove once and for all, that when they do add crossbows, nobody is going to use them anyway. (Redundancy argument)

the same could be said about alot of things in Skyrim

haha nice

i dont remember stealing an elder scroll in OB but i do remember the boots of springheel jack

so according to the loophole lore, there could be any number of elder scrolls, or 1 is anywhere at anytime?

can some one explain to me what a elder scroll is...detailed...i know what it is its a scroll with limitless potentional to do anything right? i played oblivion and i have skyrim sooooo...it was used to travel though time and send something back in time in the main quest...and in the dawnguard trailer the ending the dude said he was going to use the "scrolls" meaning more then one right? to destroy the sun...he used the word "tyranny"......

There where like 50+ Elderscrolls in that one room in Oblivion where you steal the one for the Thieve's guild

I actually really like that theory, better than what I came up with earlier in this thread.

As one guy said in Skyrim (can't remember who said it) the elder scrolls are of unknown quantity, as things are now there is no way of knowing how many exist. But there are definitely more than one.

I don't think it's so much as "afraid" of redundancy, but being forced to minimize it to work around the consoles' limitations.

Over the course of 5 games we've seen 3 elder scrolls.
You do the math.

I'm kinda grooving on the concept of an Elder Scroll being a metaphor for Game development of nirn....something mysterious but we are seeing these 'scrolls' used more often in parallel with Bethesda's gift of The Construction Kit, Creation Kit etc...in that light, this DLC (an official mod) IS an elder scroll. Breaking the 4th wall...we are ALL becoming the divine. O.O

It's !#^$ing META

So they use the Elder Scrolls twice for some pretty cool and very lore based things and you complain? Wow man.

Except the lore never mentioned an ability like this for the Elder Scrolls. Before Skyrim, all that was known about the scrolls was that they unwaveringly recorded history and could not be altered, while also showing possible futures. Then Skyrim came and out of nowhere it was like "oh yeah, and they can send you back in time." No explanation given as to how or why they have this power, just that they do because no one knows exactly how they work. Now with Dawnguard it's like "oh yeah, and they can block out the sun." Again, an ability out of nowhere that was never so much as hinted as being possible before. I bet with the enxt DLC, it'll be like "oh yeah, and they can respec you."

It's a cheap plot device, having an artifact that can't be explained and whose power is changed at the whim of the writer. It shows a lack of creativity, and ruins consistency the more it happens.

Considering that the Elder Scrolls can do anything...

I couldn't really put it any better. I should copy paste this at the top of every page, so people get it.

On another note, there definitely have been links to the Elder Scrolls and dragon breaks of the past. It is also a known fact that the exact number of Elder Scrolls in existence at any given time fluxuates. Maybe Amauri (on the 2nd page of this topic) has a point and their increased appearance and relevance to the games heralds the coming of another dragon break. Reality breaking into pieces and restructuring itself.. that could be pretty spectacular.

No matter how poor this DLC is, it should provide some extra resources for modders to create a decent system for vampirism.

I never said it was going to be a bad DLC! Seriously people, read! One plot mechanic!

This is how i look at it.

The Elder Scrolls is a blueprint of all things Nirn. It knows the past, and the future. Its power is immense, and rarley ever used.

The Elder Scrolls is named after... well... The Elder Scrolls... so why not be able to see them more often. Now if the Elder Scroll suddenly turns into a lightsaber... then i might have to say, "Really Bethesda!".

Doubtfull thats gonna happen ^^

I believe just because they use something that has great power, does not mean its a cop out. Its something that was wrote into the lore of the game, and its more original then mainstreaming it and building rocket ships to blow up the sun. The Vampires are clearly trying to make an eternal Eclipse so that they can walk the earth both day and night. If that ever happened Nirn would not be powerful enough to stop it.

Ussually DLC is not taken into being actual LORE, more of just a fun addition to the game. Much like Shivering Isles, there is no recorded lore that i know of mentioning the Champion of the oblivion crisis become the new Sheogorath.