Destruction magic scaling (why it's fine)

Post » Sun May 13, 2012 7:05 am

It's not all that hard to send your summons in, chain nuke and shield/heal yourself on the off chance something actually attacks you at your safe distance. When you spec right it's not a very hard game.
But we're talking about Destruction here. Not Conjuration, Restoration, Alteration, or Illusion.

But to be devil's advocate here: pair melee or archery with smithing and you're still better than a mage with ALL of those. Forbid if they decide to take up enchanting or alchemy.

Enchanting benefits melee and archers tenfold as to what it does for mages. Alchemy is a wash - both can get similar benefits from it.
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Tinkerbells
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 7:07 am

How much can weapon damage be upgraded?

How much can spell damage be upgraded?

K, thx, bye.
Your point is?

I have said over and over and over that magic should scale. And yes, should be upgradable.

None of that stops you from being [censored] dumb if you compare ONE tree of an archetype with MINIMUM FOUR from another.
But we're talking about Destruction here. Not Conjuration, Restoration, Alteration, or Illusion.

Pair melee or archery with smithing and you're better than a mage with ALL of those. Forbid if they decide to take up enchanting or alchemy.

^ See my point? "Hey, we are only talking destruction here, dont bring in the other trees into this. What? You? Yeah, now we are talking about smithing and alchemy and enchanting and your weapon skill of course!"

Can conjuration + destruction do as much as Weapon skill + smithing would be a fairer comparison.
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Latisha Fry
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 9:05 pm

Akesh, i wont start taking your post bit by bit, i'll just answer you in one post:

Imagine a world where all magic scales.

Now you have Mage A and Mage B
Mage A uses Destruction but also has Conjuration and Alteration perked up.
Mage B only uses Destruction because thats all he cares about.

Now you want Mage B to be as effective as Mage A.

Can you understand the problem? If you buff mage B, you buff mage A. But mage A is already balanced, because that is how the game was designed, so if you buff him the game will become way too easy.

You are basically asking them to completely break the game so you can play it in a way it wasnt intended to (using only 1/5 of your perk points), and the only real argument you have to back you up is "because I expected to be able to!".

EDIT:

Taken out of context you are right. But if that build (pure glass cannon destruction) is balanced to provide the average challenge level, then any build using destruction + somthing else becomes a powerhouse for whom the game is a lot less challenging.

Aka you SHOULD be struggling if you are only using destruction, as you are only using your character building blocks partially. If you are not struggling, then other players are bored.

As I stated in the post right below yours - I want to see where someone said that they just wanted to pwn face with destruction only while using no other skills? OF COURSE, they will use other skills, destruction is just their choice of weapon as melee weapons or archery might be yours. Why are players that choose destruction as their specialization and weapon of choice penalized at high level? And again, it's a single player game. I have yet to hear from someone how it would affect theirs other then the fact that they don't like it because of "balance", lol!?
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noa zarfati
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 10:45 pm

Couldn't agree more. People are saying that the magic system is underpowered... I laugh. Have they tried Conjuration? Conjuration is immensely superior to Oblivion. Not only are the bound weapons (I know this isn't technically magic because you use 1h, 2h, or archery with these weapons, but I'm a hybrid so I'm counting this part), but also things like Dremora(sp?) Lords. Pop a Dremora(sp?) Lord and whip out some destro spells or a bound weapon and mow everything down. You can't just stand there and cast fire and kill everything and expect to be able to do just as good as something else. You can, however, use destruction and run around and actually actively participate in the combat and be 100% effective with purely Destruction. But doing that would honestly be silly. A Mage should use all magics available to him, whether that be healing, summoning stuff, or even creating Bound weapons. If you expected to just be a fireball thrower for the game and be fine with no combat strategy or utilization of your other skills, you're being plain silly.

TL;DR: OP I 100% agree. Magic is working just fine.
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Kari Depp
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:43 am

But we're talking about Destruction here. Not Conjuration, Restoration, Alteration, or Illusion.

But to be devil's advocate here: pair melee or archery with smithing and you're still better than a mage with ALL of those. Forbid if they decide to take up enchanting or alchemy.

Enchanting benefits melee and archers tenfold as to what it does for mages. Alchemy is a wash - both can get similar benefits from it.
Alchemy actually benefits the physicals more. Since Alchemy boosts Blacksmithing which in turn boosts the physicals.

Couldn't agree more. People are saying that the magic system is underpowered...
Not magic, destruction. Say it with me slowly D-E-S-T-R-U-C-T-I-O-N. You're much better off going Conjuration+Illusion+Archery+Enchanting+Blacksmithing (No need to actually put perks into BS/Archery, however it'll help) then Conjuration+Illusion+Destruction+Enchanting.

Your point is?

I have said over and over and over that magic should scale. And yes, should be upgradable.

None of that stops you from being [censored] dumb if you compare ONE tree of an archetype with MINIMUM FOUR from another.


^ See my point? "Hey, we are only talking destruction here, dont bring in the other trees into this. What? You? Yeah, now we are talking about smithing and alchemy and enchanting and your weapon skill of course!"

Can conjuration + destruction do as much as Weapon skill + smithing would be a fairer comparison.
No it's not. Because Conjuration does not in any way benefit Destruction, and Destruction does not in any way benefit Conjuration. Hilariously though, the weapon skills benefit from Conjuration.
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Casey
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 2:40 am

Your point is?

I have said over and over and over that magic should scale. And yes, should be upgradable.

None of that stops you from being [censored] dumb if you compare ONE tree of an archetype with MINIMUM FOUR from another.

Trees aren't the argument, damage is. The end.
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Nathan Barker
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 1:44 am

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1273804-the-bottom-line-with-destruction/ but I don't really see this as a priority problem right now. Maybe once they've gotten the game a bit more stable and optimized, switch focus to re-balancing destruction.

I do agree with the voices that destruction is weaker than the other forms of "principle combat." I do not agree that it constitutes an outrage, or that it needs to be addressed immediately.
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Rude_Bitch_420
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 7:18 pm

Couldn't agree more. People are saying that the magic system is underpowered... I laugh. Have they tried Conjuration? Conjuration is immensely superior to Oblivion. Not only are the bound weapons (I know this isn't technically magic because you use 1h, 2h, or archery with these weapons, but I'm a hybrid so I'm counting this part), but also things like Dremora(sp?) Lords. Pop a Dremora(sp?) Lord and whip out some destro spells or a bound weapon and mow everything down. You can't just stand there and cast fire and kill everything and expect to be able to do just as good as something else. You can, however, use destruction and run around and actually actively participate in the combat and be 100% effective with purely Destruction. But doing that would honestly be silly. A Mage should use all magics available to him, whether that be healing, summoning stuff, or even creating Bound weapons. If you expected to just be a fireball thrower for the game and be fine with no combat strategy or utilization of your other skills, you're being plain silly.

TL;DR: OP I 100% agree. Magic is working just fine.

TL;DR: Conjuration is better at destroying things then Destruction.
Kthxbye
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Amy Melissa
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 7:45 pm

As I stated in the post right below yours - I want to see where someone said that they just wanted to pwn face with destruction only while using no other skills? OF COURSE, they will use other skills, destruction is just their choice of weapon as melee weapons or archery might be yours. Why are players that choose destruction as their specialization and weapon of choice penalized at high level? And again, it's a single player game. I have yet to hear from someone how it would affect theirs other then the fact that they don't like it because of "balance", lol!?
2 post above the one I quoted, and my comment on it in the one right under. Get reading.

Also: how hard is it to grasp that if you change the balance for one person, you change it for everyone? Meaning that changing it for you may mean my game suddently just turned way too easy. How is that not affecting me?

EDIT:
Trees aren't the argument, damage is. The end.
Alright, no problem. So now we can compare mage damage with full Conjuration + Destruction + Enchanting + Alchemy with a warriors?

Of course, lets not mention utility stuff like slows, freezes, range, elemental weaknesses, CCs, etc. Would throw a stick in the wheel of your Whaaaaambulance.
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Rachell Katherine
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 6:27 am

problem:

Heh, this again.



How dare I tell you stuff like "go play some other game"? Well its very simple: This is how this game is! This is how it was designed!
Skyrim was designed with no class system but a number of "perk trees" from which to choose to create your own class. Sure, you can use Destruction as your main offense, and asking for it to be fixed so that this goal is achieved is 100% legit, and I'm backing you 100% on that. It needs to scale.

Yes, how dare you. In fact how dare you expect people to play how you think they should in a game series that's always been about being the character you want and playing how you want.

Asking to be able to ONLY take Destruction and not have to touch any other perk, yet be able to perform as well as someone who uses all their perk points, is not only illogical, it is down-right childish. You are not thinking AT ALL about how that change would affect the current game, you are just obsessed with re-creating a different game.

That's a lot of assumptions in one post. For one thing, you seem to have no concept of TES lore or past TES games. The very lore of magic in the game has included the idea of specialized casters, even concentrating on them, not just the gameplay mechanics. Beyond that, the NPCs and Enemies in Skyrim, guess what? They specialize as well.

As for what you think "I want" ? You're wrong. You confuse want with support. My character has Conjuration, Illusion, Destruction, Alteration, Restoration, Enchanting, Smithing and more as this point. What you're unable to grasp is that I support people that want to, "Play the game in the way they choose, just as EVERY SINGLE PRIOR TES GAME ALLOWED." Skyrim isn't one game. It is a part of a series of games, and thus must absolutely deal with the fallout when they change the long standing mechanics (or contradict the longstanding lore) of everything that has happened prior in the series. People have every right to be disappointed and to complain.

More importantly, it goes well beyond wanting to specialize in a specific school. Certain schools of magic, like destruction, stop. They just stop. They stop entirely. Past a certain point they no longer improve in any way. They do this long before the level cap. A 30+ player will start to see it, a 40+ player will have to grit their teeth through it with overly complex strategies and the 50+ plus players will be tearing their hair out by the time they get to the 60s and eventually hit 70. Why? Because they stop. Melee and Ranged continue to scale all the way up to 70 through a variety of means. Spells though?

Nope.

Certain schools, like conjuration, continue to scale - bound weapons especially because they work hand in hand with melee or ranged scaling. Things like Alteration's Dragonhide will continue to scale because 80% reduction of all damage is always going to be 80% no matter what level you are.

But a fully perked Master spell from destruction? That stops. It just stops. Entirely. You will slowly see one melee hit equating to half a dozen casts of your strongest spell, and by the time you get to the 60s a single melee strike will completely eclipse anything you can throw out. That's not "an intended form of play" that's, "this skill set continues to scale all the way to 70, and these? These over here? They stop. You can get max level spells before you even hit 30 and be fully perked out and that's the most damage you'll ever have unless you switch over to melee or ranged or bound weapons for melee and ranged. It's not just night and day. The amount of damage you can do when comparing a 60+ melee player to a 60+ caster is that the melee player scaled all the way to 60 and will continue to scale to 70. The Caster though? He won't. He stopped scaling entirely back in his 30s, because he was perked out then and he had his master spells then and he's never going to get anything better."

There are a variety of reasons for this, but one of the most important doesn't even have to do with the skills themselves but entirely different skills. Enchanting and Smithing. Guess what the interesting thing is about how enchanting and smithing effect melee and ranged versus how they effect casters?


-

All of that is meaningless though. What's important is you can't get down off your high horse to realize, it's a single player series of games that have always let you create the character you want, a series with long standing - still canonical - lore that supports specialization and a series that has always allowed specialization. A series that even in Skyrim supports specialization by presenting you with NPCs that specialize. But you? The player? You can't specialize in what you want anymore. Sure some schools like Conjuration can get away with it, but restoration and destruction? Nope. It's especially bad for restoration because it actually used to have damage built into it.

Luckily none of what you think is relevant or valid.

Why?

Because if Bethesda doesn't fix it, then the modding community will.
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Everardo Montano
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 7:38 am

It's scaling is fine because it's not a stand-alone skill. Mage schools are all supplemental and the schools that supplement destruction more than make up for the less scaled damage.

If everyone would take a set back and look at this for a minute (and think critically).. It makes perfect sense..

Do I think Destruction should scale with character/skill level? Of course. As the only form of direct damage from magic skills, I think this would be obvious.

However, there is a fine line that needs to be treated here.. Destruction is ONE skill tree.. It takes at least 6 perk tree's to build a truly powerful warrior. For both the abilities you need to use, and the ability to craft the best gear to support them.

1/2 handed weapons
Heavy/light armor
Blocking
Archery
Smithing
Enchanting

Destruction by itself, even when 100% maxed in skill and perks, should NOT be equal to a warrior who needs to invest into all three of these tree's in order to be successful.
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Ilona Neumann
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 8:45 am

I think a better fix would be to allow enchanting to improve destruction spell damage or allow smithing(or if the CK supports it, add another skill entirely) to improve magic.

The biggest problem is that there's no real way to improve destruction magic all that much.
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MR.BIGG
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 1:57 am

Here are the facts. I'm tired of idiots on this forum like OP who are just too ignorant or trolls. I've lost all respect for people like that but I'll give you the facts.


There are just TOO MANY points I can make that say mages overall are underpowered compared to warriors that I can write a book on it. Here are just a few

1. Destruction never gets stronger.

2. Mage spells are either too weak or cost too much mana to sustain in a fight.

3. Mage runs out of mana, has to run. Warrior runs out of stamina, continues to pound heavy damage.

4. Mages do less damage than warriors AND are 10-100x less durable in battle.

5. Master level destruction spells take 5 seconds to cast, cost too much mana, and don't get stronger after you get them at level 50 while monsters get stronger.

6. Warrior late game can have insanely strong legendary armor and weapons that do 500 damage per regular swing without power swing and tank like a god, mages have the 100 damage master spell that takes 5 seconds to cast when they are vulnerable.

7. Warriors can faceroll through the game with 2 skills and two hack buttons. Mages need to constantly switch spells, run around, drink potions, use shouts, use lydia, ect just to get by.

8. Robes with magic regen/cost reduction is nowhere near as good as the armor that makes warriors unstoppable late game.

9. Warriors with heavy armor and weapons can whip out their flame spell anytime and do as much damage as a mage while able to tank so much more, mages who want to fight with swords end up getting [censored].

10. I have yet to find a pure mage at any level able to complete the main quest line, I see warriors level 20ish complete it easily.

11. A TON of people complain about destruction being underpowered and mages in general compared to warriors. No one complains about warriors be underpowered, only overpowered.

12. This is a TES game. Players should be able to play how they want. If they want to focus on destruction without much help in other magic fields they should be able to do that. Game favors warriors heavily to faceroll through the game. Destruction is probably the most important school magic yet it is one of the more useless and full mages can't seem to do well with it without resorting to conjuration.

13. Full mages have to switch between 3-5 spells, conjure creatures, bring lydia, drink pots, hide behind obstacles shooting down enemies, scout the enemies well, before EVERY battle. It's fun on the first few battles but throughout the thousands of battles it becomes tedious and worthless. Warriors just charge into 10 men mobs without thinking and faceroll everything.

14. People say well mages have stunlock and with late game enchants can cast spells without mana. Don't be dumb. It still takes 10 spells to kill one same leveled thug and it's only viable 1v1. Warriors just charge into 10 men mobs button mashing two buttons and tanking all they want.

15. In even decently balanced games, warriors can always tank more damage while mages do much more damage and can nuke from afar. Mage destruction spells are mid-close range spells and can't nuke while warriors do more damage. In league of legends we see spell casters like ryze who die instantly and move slowly but can nuke so well and does more damage than tanks like malphite who are very hard to kill but barely do any damage. Imagine if malphite did more nuke damage than ryze. Who in their right mind would want to play ryze then? Everyone would want to play malphite. Same thing is going on here. People play the more balanced characters and like to play by what is better. This is an elder scrolls game and people should be able to play how they like but instead are forced to be melee or struggle through as a mage.



agree, exept at the 15th, got no idee :D
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Silvia Gil
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 5:25 am

Okay guys how about this
Player 1: 1h alchemy heavy armor smithing
Player 2: destruction alchemy heavy armor smithing

Who will completely wreck an opponent first at higher levels?
Who will have to spell lock a single opponent for 3 minutes?
You all know the answer to that, so we can justly say 1h is much > destruction in a 1v1 situation,
If your fighting more than one opponent, who will suriive due to higher health even if both have amazing armor?
Once again destruction although it does have AOE spells cannot compete with a 1h build due to the fact 1h kills an opponent and moves to the next, destruction hurts all of the opponents and all of them can continue hurting you in the meantime until they all fall dead at the same time so it does not lower the damage output of them all whereas 1h does.

This is a comparison of 1h vs destruction, not anything else in the magic schools which should be a choice.
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trisha punch
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 3:52 am

Some people I swear...

Let me put it this way: every single time someone is comparing destruction to a warrior's with crafted gear, every single time someone is complaining that they should not have to use other trees like Conjuration or Alteration if they dont want to, every single time someone is complaining that they should be able to "speciallize" solely in destruction...


Dude! That is the way you SEE it! Let's go with your "balance" issue in a single player game for giggles. In that case, we are arguing for all things being equal at high levels since destruction magic does not scale, thereby leaving us behind. What part of that is so complex to understand? COMPARISONS are being made to illustrate a point, NO ONE says that they just want to be able to level destruction only and nothing else! That is YOU and others putting words into people's mouths!
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Laura Simmonds
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 10:30 pm

. . .

Yes, how dare a player choose magic and expect their spells to be as effective, no more, no less, as a player that choose to be purely melee or a player that chose to be purely ranged.
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Kayla Oatney
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 9:52 pm

They're comparing Smithing+Enchanting+NO WEAPON OR ARMOR SKILLS WHAT SO EVER vs Destruction+Enchanting.

It's hopeless man. It's like trying to explain something complex to 3rd graders. I will just wait and be content when the cs comes out.
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ImmaTakeYour
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 10:58 pm

Do I think Destruction should scale a bit with character level? Yes, as the primary source of direct damage to enemies sure.. But people can't honestly expect to just just max every perk in the Destruction tree and expect to be some uber-deathdealing Juggernaut of spell-casting...

No, people just expect to be able to upgrade spell damage with destruction skill as a mage when weapon damage can be upgraded with 1h/2h skill as a warrior, since mages cast...you know...spells.
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Nicole M
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 3:48 am

Yes, how dare a player choose magic and expect their spells to be as effective, no more, no less, as a player that choose to be purely melee or a player that chose to be purely ranged.

Clearly you didn't read my post.

Not even going to formulate a reply because you are absolutely not worth a second of my time. Oh wait, I already replied to you. Darn, wasted a whole 30 seconds of my life on you.
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Laura Ellaby
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 2:42 am

If everyone would take a set back and look at this for a minute (and think critically).. It makes perfect sense..

A effective warrior has to invest into at least 4 perk tree's in order to be effective overall. Heavy/light armor, blocking, archery, and 1/2 handed weapons.. That's four tree's to make a effective character. Not counting Smithing/alchemy/enchanting.

Do I think Destruction should scale a bit with character level? Yes, as the primary source of direct damage to enemies sure.. But people can't honestly expect to just just max every perk in the Destruction tree and expect to be some uber-deathdealing Juggernaut of spell-casting... In fact, I think that, were you to specialize in any particular tree and use it by itself, Destruction would be the most powerful, with maybe archery as a 2nd.
No he doesn't.
1) Mages and Warriors use the same armor, your choice of Armor Skill or Alteration (Hint, your mage is probably better off with the Heavy Armor) is a completely independent choice.
2) There's really not any need to take any of the Armor/Blocking perks in the first place. Offence is the best defence as always.
3) There is no actual synergy between the spell schools. Destruction isn't any more useful to your conjuration&/illusion/whatever compared to a Bow, it's actually worse since it uses the mana you'd otherwise use for other spells.
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Tiff Clark
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 6:01 am

Guys, calm down. This is a lot easier than it looks.

Swords, Bows, Black Magic.


Those are the three archetype attack modes for Warriors, Thieves, Mages, respectively. It's pretty clear to everybody, mathematically speaking, that Destruction does not improve as high as the others. That's all there is to it. Every build needs http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1273804-the-bottom-line-with-destruction/page__view__findpost__p__19279537.

The only question becomes whether or not these should be patched to be more balanced. Why don't we just compromise and say, "Sure, a balance patch would be great. Let's just rank it behind stability patches."

Boom. Everybody wins.
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Cagla Cali
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 3:11 am

But we're talking about Destruction here. Not Conjuration, Restoration, Alteration, or Illusion.

But to be devil's advocate here: pair melee or archery with smithing and you're still better than a mage with ALL of those. Forbid if they decide to take up enchanting or alchemy.

Enchanting benefits melee and archers tenfold as to what it does for mages. Alchemy is a wash - both can get similar benefits from it.
When people complain about melee they're actually talking about (for instance) 2H + Blacksmithing + Enchanting + Alchemy + Heavy Armor. Destruction doesn't synergize with those professions, it synergized with other spell schools. Destruction is the damage that gets added to your insane shielding, Healing, Summoning and CC capabilities. Destruction does less damage because of how insanely powerful it's supplements are.
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Mashystar
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 9:08 am

Guys, calm down. This is a lot easier than it looks.

Swords, Bows, Black Magic.


Those are the three archetype attack modes for Warriors, Thieves, Mages, respectively. It's pretty clear to everybody, mathematically speaking, that Destruction does not improve as high as the others. That's all there is to it. Every build needs http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1273804-the-bottom-line-with-destruction/page__view__findpost__p__19279537.

The only question becomes whether or not these should be patched to be more balanced. Why don't we just compromise and say, "Sure, a balance patch would be great. Let's just rank it behind stability patches."

Boom. Everybody wins.
I wouldn't really expect the same people to be working on those issues. The balance issues are trivial programming and almost completely up to the design team. The stability issues are almost solely programming issues and thus handled by the programming team.
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Pawel Platek
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 11:06 am

All of that is meaningless though. What's important is you can't get down off your high horse to realize, it's a single player series of games that have always let you create the character you want, a series with long standing - still canonical - lore that supports specialization and a series that has always allowed specialization. A series that even in Skyrim supports specialization by presenting you with NPCs that specialize. But you? The player? You can't specialize in what you want anymore. Sure some schools like Conjuration can get away with it, but restoration and destruction? Nope. It's especially bad for restoration because it actually used to have damage built into it.
Oh it is meaningless.

But its just sad. Im on my high horses, yet you are the one pranting on about expectation and how you have a right to see your expectations be met.

Blah blah blah. Farts in the wind. You, my friend, are the one on your high horse. You have this feeling of entitlement, like Bethesda "owed" you something, like they "owed" you to build their game as you expected it to be.

Well its not. Get over it. You can quote all the TES lore you want, in the end, its all moot, because you are wrong. And why are you wrong? Because you are not the one who made the damn game. Its that simple. Now you can learn to deal with it, or you can QQ.

I for one believe that spells desperatly need to scale and keep getting stronger as you level. That we agree on. From there tho, the game is as it is, and that is how you should take it. If Destruction is still not strong enough to stand alone without either Illusion CC, or Conjuration tanks, then thats the way it was meant to be. You should take a hint from the amount of perk points you can spend in each tree vs the amount of total points you can gain: this game is NOT about tunnel-visioning (what you call Speciallizing) a single tree.

Then again: who cares, you are all going to mod everything anyway haha.
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Inol Wakhid
 
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Post » Sat May 12, 2012 9:40 pm

Couldn't agree more. People are saying that the magic system is underpowered... I laugh. Have they tried Conjuration? Conjuration is immensely superior to Oblivion. Not only are the bound weapons (I know this isn't technically magic because you use 1h, 2h, or archery with these weapons, but I'm a hybrid so I'm counting this part), but also things like Dremora(sp?) Lords. Pop a Dremora(sp?) Lord and whip out some destro spells or a bound weapon and mow everything down. You can't just stand there and cast fire and kill everything and expect to be able to do just as good as something else. You can, however, use destruction and run around and actually actively participate in the combat and be 100% effective with purely Destruction. But doing that would honestly be silly. A Mage should use all magics available to him, whether that be healing, summoning stuff, or even creating Bound weapons. If you expected to just be a fireball thrower for the game and be fine with no combat strategy or utilization of your other skills, you're being plain silly.

TL;DR: OP I 100% agree. Magic is working just fine.


why dont you just start an mage and see for your self. an warrior needs to focus and put perks in what? 1 tree for damage and 2 half ones for tank. an mage need to put perks to what? all the magical tree just to be able to kill something,
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Sammygirl500
 
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