It's the fact you can hardly survive as a mage at level 50...mages want to feel more powerful not weaker.

Here is where your argument crumbles: they ARE viable. You can complete this game with absolutely any build whatsoever. Does that mean all builds will have equal power? Thats just an illogical conclusion.

This is artificially limiting people. Picking destruction therefore becomes your hypothetical poor build above that makes the game more challenging.

EVERY build should not be viable in a single player game. How do you make a destruction only build able to easily spam down the entire game and then make a Destro/Resto hybrid build even remotely challenging? SINGLE PLAYER games need to be balanced to be fun as well. Destruction gets some MASSIVE supplements so making it a stand-alone god school would break it. Mages aren't about stand alone schools; you're supposed to intermingle them if you're going pure magic.

this

Warriors go into god mode after maxing your crafting skills for damage and armor skills to stay alive. As a mage you can mix destruction with any schools that supplement it well and be fine, but you all just refuse for some reason.

You should really stop arguing on stuff you dont know anything about. Its just making you look foolish.

Warriors dont go into god mode. Crafters do. The problem is that if you fully level all 3 crafting trees, then exploit the loop-back created by their synergies, you can create ridonculously powerfull weapons and armor. To the point, really, where being a warrior is actually moot: a full mage with such items would kick almost as much ass.

Its the items and crafting that is broken, not warriors. Compare a warrior that has only, say, smithing leveled up to your mage, and you will have a MUCH fairer comparison.

Btw, isnt it a little hypocrite to rant about how you shouldnt have to take other perk-trees up, but then go complaining about a warrior that has 5 of them maxed up (heavy/1h/smith//enchant/alchemy)?

another post about a pure destruction and again i feel the problem here is not the mage that destructions but rather mana regeneration while in combat

the damage from destruction is fine there are perks that can improve the damge of destruction givening it a decent boost but the problem lies in that mana regen items and potion are not working while you are in combat and are only working outside of it test it out for yourself to understand.

once its bee patch/fixed whatever then i think magic based character will be better of right now tho the lack of a decent mana regen makes fight alot hard than they need to be as you can uses more than 4ish spell before your mana is drained.

You've conflated skills and classes.


I think you mean a character using a melee skill who has foregone Conjuration, Illusion, Sneak and Archery does. A "Warrior" could just as easily pull out a bow and never enter the room, train Illusion and paralyze the entire room, train Conjuration and summon a Frost Atronach to take the damage.


He would last longer with that tactic than anyone else.


So can a Warrior, Thief or Archer. There are no classes, you're using arbitrary names and presuming, wrongly, that it somehow precludes them from using any of the aforementioned spells or skills.


Melee and bow attacks have access to a variety of poisons and enchantments.


It's not a matter of putting out the same damage, it's a matter of the damage scaling at all. At level 50 there is absolutely no reason to ever cast a Destruction spell, you might as well be unarmed.

Also, please show me a way a mage can do this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOSw36zv7YI

Warrior, ezmode or easiestmode?

No, no you can't. I've played three characters so far. One was a warrior, using one-handed, heavy armor, and shields primarily. One was primarily a magic-user...took Destruction, Restoration, and Illusion. Third was a sneaky bow-user. With every one I was playing on Expert, and with every one I fought the first dragon at level 10. Guess which of these characters couldn't kill him no matter how many potions/heals were used?

I'll repeat what I said before, as it seemed to have been missed:

"And your god-mode argument is ridiculous. If people wanted to be god-mode from level 1, they could do that with cheats or the console already. That's not what any of us are looking for. We're looking to have the option of building a magic-using character that EVENTUALLY becomes unstoppable after we put the time and effort into it. You know, just like all the other builds do already.

But you're just trying to make excuses for Bethesda's poor decisions at this point, so whatever. "

I advise you to try the other schools. I really do. Destruction has always been the pure mages sword.

Not a problem, but why all the negative attitudes towards other class types, not just comparisons? These threads become crap fast.

No, it's not a problem at all in a game where you should be able to make the kind of character that you want to play if you put in the effort and pick the appropriate skills. A specialist in ANY of the skills in this game should be unrivaled in said skill. That's not to say that a destruction specialist would NEVER use other types of magic - of course they would. It's just that they chose DESTRUCTION to be their primary source of damage. If one specializes in something, should they NOT be one of the best in the field and get a return on that investment?

It wont matter soon anyway for pc users at least when we fianlly get the ability to mod what we want.

You entire arguement breaks down when you consider the other damage modalities of 2H/1H/and Bow can all use Conjuration, Restoration, and Illusion - but with far more magicka due to not wasting it on Destruction, and far more damage, and far more toughness.


It simply seems like Destruction is weaker than all other damage types, even conjuration can better succeed on Master without having to completely rely on other skills.

Not sure what your point is.

If you want the game to be that easy for a mage just use some console command or a mod that makes destruction overpowered (if on PC). Or if on console just drop difficulty to novice.

If your point is that you dont want it to be that easy for a melee character, then just stop exploiting the smithing/enchanting/alchemy stuff that makes melee so overpowered.

Problem solved.

It's not a negative attitude, it's simply that the counterarguments are meaningless because everything they say should be avoided is applicable to another class and apparently that's OK.

A warrior who specs and gears for melee won't be touching any high level magic abilities. No magicka for it. We're talking about pure mages here and how they compare to pure warriors. Hybrids are hybrids.

You cant use only one ability and win the game. To be an effecive warrior I have to work on leveling up:

1.One hand weapon
2.Heavy Armor
3.Blocking
4.Smithing
5.Alchemy
6.Restoration
7.Enchanting


Now, what happends is that those "Mages" want to use their fireball to kill everything around with one or at least two spells of their mighty fireball spell, standing there in Robes...
Not gonna happend. You have to be skilled in several different abilities to succeed. Not just in destruction magic.
If I wanted to play with the sword only, even it were maxed out to the 100th level - I wouldn't be competitive either.

Quit looking at everything in a vacuum. You are just blindly throwing a tantrum because YOU want what YOU want WHEN you want it AS you want it. You are not a [censored] child (are you?), grow up!

Look at the bigger picture. This is a game in which you can max minimum 4 trees before reaching the end. Asking that 1 tree be made as good, stand-alone, as a build that would max 4, is completely illogical and game-breaking. It would make every single other build in the game ridiculously broken, and therefore leave Skyrim a wreck for everyone but your little selfish self.

Let me explain the mages situation to you.

At level 40, they are done with their power. they cannot get any more powerfull spells, they are locked at a strength.

The enemies keep on getting stronger

Now, a mage's max damage is 100.

A warrior's max damage is 3199.

A warrior can also get armour above 2.4k

So, with the mage's destruction spells locked at one amount, the enemies keep on getting stronger.

I have heard of mages using 3/4 of their magic on a single -regular- enemy.

And the Conjuration summons never get stronger, so eventually their HP can be wiped out by everything.

The max armour a mage can get with alteration (i belive) is 100.

The max armour a warrior can get is 2469.

There, do you all understand it now?

Conjuration is better with 2h/1h/bow than Destruction. Destruction actually bogs your character down compared to those skills at higher levels. The only reason someone with conjurtion and/or ilusion would use destruction is for RP purposes. All other damage modalities would make him 2-3x more efficient. 10x efficient when including crafting exploits.

This is a fact atm.

Nope.avi

Read comments for vid.

He didn't use the alchemy/enchanting exploits.

Oh and for that person who said max for mage is 100 -> max armor for mage is 300 with Ebonyflesh and that maxed perk in the alteration tree.

Dragonflesh which is the master version gives 80% physical mitigation. Which would be great... except 20% of a [censored]ton of damage still allows you to be 2 shot. Since you have sod all for armor anyway.

Still waiting on your replies Gigan.

Thank you, I don't even understand why this is an argument! THESE ARE FACTS!

If you're fighting melee you need HP and stamina, not magicka. If you spec for high-level magic you won't be doing much damage with your sword or surviving long in melee range.