would it be too much to ask if maybe Beth themselves could fix this with a patch?

Mods are all fine and dandy, but what about us 360 and PS3 players? this affects us as much as it affects PC players, and besides, it's a FLAW on Beth's part. A modder shouldn't have to fix Beth's mistakes in this modern age of patching and updates.

patching process is cumbersome, for all we know Beth may be hard at work fixing all of these things. they first have to get cleareance from Microsoft first though. What I want is at least a confirmation that Beth acknowledges what we're saying and at least confirm that at a patch to fix this IS coming.

Please do NOT patch this. It does not need patching. Get it out of your heads that there is such a things as "Pure" anything. Theres your problem right there. Put on armor if you want, do whatever you find to be effective. My expert spells still do damage at level 50 so i'm honestly unsure where that's comming from but hey maybe its just me.

Do you guys not have companions? or summons? or illusion? or restoration? or alteration?. Enlighten me as to how your characters are failing so badly?
The fact that I can cast all of my spells one million times is a help as well.

Sounds like more people should have rolled warriors

If it really is that bad at high levels then they need to patch it officially for xbox and ps3, otherwise they should warn people to use bow/melee as their primary damage source.

I'm also worried that illusion will stop working at high levels. I plan on getting all illusion perks that raise level that it works on, and if isn't enought o keep them working at high levels, then I just wasted a looot of perk points.
And not just destruction, and illusion, but also other spells where it makes sense, like armor and healing and summons. Those all need to scale. :\

Hopefully they patch it before I get that high, cause I currently am having no problems.

For mages that don't get it:

Warrior with 100 1h might do more damage with an iron sword than he did at 20 1h, but he still isn't killing [censored].

What one really has to ask themselves is, "why the [censored] is that warrior with 100 skill in 1h still using an iron sword?"

The point is pretty obvious, but i know some of you are pretty dense; so basically USE HIGHER TIER SPELLS WHEN YOU HAVE HIGHER TIER SKILLS.

The vast majority of complaints are sub level 30 where they have no merit. If there are no longer any higher tier spells after that then the only other alternative is enchanting, which funny enough is apparently on applied to melee builds. As if there aren't items that aid mages.

playing a "pure mage" is a viable play style in all other TES games and most other RPGs. Why not in Skyrim?

Second, beinga pure mage means not using armor or weapons. Destruction IS your weapon. Destruction is the equivalent to a warrior's sword. Imagine if at lvl 35 you suddenly couldn't use your sword, or axe, or bow.

I completely agree that a pure mage should be using ALL schools of magic, and Beth has tried to do that. But completely gimping what is supposed to be a mage's PRIMARY means of attack is not how you go about making players utilize everything.

you'd be crying foul just as much as we are right now.

Undebatable. Well said.

Because you can't roll a PURE anything in this game. As a warrior you pick up a bow if you see a dragon. You do whatever you have to to survive.

This game wasn't built around arbitrary classes for a reason. Where in skyrim did it say that to be a mage it meant no armor or weapons? I didn't see it in the game anywhere.

You are playing with a predisposition that doesn't fit the game. There are no "Mages" or "warriors" or "thiefs" they are general terms to describe how a person fights but are meaningless in skyrim. You are only "a man" or "a women". You make the game more difficult on yourselves and, thus, I don't want it patched lol. And many others feel the exact same way as I do they are just too busy playing.

Virtually all of my friends and myself have leveled destruction. I use expert spells and slip in and out of combat easily with illusion perks. Its ridiculas that some people willingly limit themselves on options they can use and then cry at the game. I SHOULD BE ABLE TO USE A LOCKPICK TO KILL EVERYTHING IF I WANT!

is how you guys sound (mostly). Novice level spells are useless. Instead use your expert spells to cause some damage. Use your summons. Slip in and out of combat with illusion. Use companions and, most of all, pick up a freakin sword lol.

There is no such things as just being a mage. In fact that's the whole reason why bethesda got rid of classes in general. They don't want you to feel defined and limited to what you can and can't pick up. Its not a game meant for you to limit yourself to only destruction or something. Just play. If you focus on destruction wear some robes and use alteration and restoration.

this would be a problem if you were playing an MMO and competing with people..

lower the difficulty if it's too hard for you.

The dawn of the amoeba class.

"Play as you want" has morphed into "Play the way the design forces you to play."


Funneling the lemmings around the character build in the same manner they funnel character around the map with levitate ignored...

I'm not claiming to know anything but take this as a food for thought:

Conjugation does more than summon deadric level weapons... while melee skills are simple. Magicka has more utility (in terms of what you can do with it) than Stamina. So, while I have no doubt that a pure caster won't have comparable "firepower" as a melee character, I'm sure there is more to the equation.

I'm convinced that a conjured sword and a minion would deal the same (if not more) damage than a warrior swinging his battle axe... Not to mention having illusions spells to back him up... Since we're talking about a warrior that does smithing and enchanting, we could also assume that the Mage does destruction, conjugation and illusion.... Oh and doesn't it also increase your weapon skill when you use a bound weapon? So isn't that, theorectically, a more powerful combination?

No idea if what I say is actually applicable, but I figured I'd throw it out in the open for consideration.

Carry on.

conjugation

*cough* staves *cough*

Wow, see yeah this isn't Fable, this is TES. By trying to teach us how to play, you're forgetting how they intended to design the game. Everything you're saying in thsi paragraph is stuff bethesda is against

Not at all,
A: you're not even talking about destruction anymore
B: no combination of spells and summons can ever surpass those 2000+ damage swords you can forge multiplied by warrior perks
C: mage would need to take warrior perks to have comparable damage but is then you're just a warrior using a summon sword.
D: Illusion spells have a strict level limit

This is what I was thinkng when I was reading those numerous posts about how a mage struggles through the game. I was thinking - maybe I dont get something, but when you have all the perks and plenty of mana AND a lot of options on how to spend it, how can you possibly struggle?.... ^ That guy has expressed my thoughts and points quite in transparent way and he actually plays as a mage and is high level. Unlike myself, as I play as a warrior.
Btw, the only problem for me in the game are mages - the rest of the population dies pretty quickly of my sword. -D


offtopic:
I would like to add that I enjoy the game really a lot, and I'd like to thank Bethesda for making such a great Game. Thanks you!
(I just wish it looked a bit less like Follout3 at times )

I support this. BETHESDA NEEDS TO SEE THIS.

I said it before, and I'll say it with all these threads that pop up...

See this thread: http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1269220-scale-magic-magnitude/page__view__findpost__p__19240938

There are simple and elegant solutions that make magic scale appropriately, even without reintroducing spell crafting (although that would be a plus). Simply making the spells scale based upon either magicka or an enchantable equippable item make it fit into line with the way everything else in the game scales with level growth.

I'm not telling anyone how to play but there is a limit of how you can expect to play anything. That'd be like me making an archer and saying I DON"T WANT TO SNEAK EVER OR WEAR ANY ARMOR OR TAKE ANY PERKS BECAUSE THATS HOW I WANT TO PLAY.

No.

If your going to play a mage you need to do whatever you can to survive. Obviously tougher battles are gonna use magic potions, stock up. Bring a companion, you know that enemies aren't going to just stand around as you cast at them so you need something to draw attention.

By the end I can now summon 2 creatures with advanced health and have a companion. I have a veriatible army for each enemy to get through before they have a chance at getting to me. While my friends are fighting i'm right behind them calling down blizzards and shouting enemies to death. Its insanely fun, I have restoration and glyphs to place on the ground. While illusion for tight moments.

The game was definitely not built for you to limit yourself. Yeah you can play how you want but you aren't supposed to go in thinking "i will never use conjuration and i will be a pure lightning mage". That's not what was intended, if you notice there are no classes.

You are supposed to jump in, find a prefered way of killing things but use everything available to you. If you love magic don the robes since they increase many magic related abilities. Bring a sword for dire moments. Take mage armor and increase your health.

I also rolled a archer focused character and I have to increase my health as well. Health is not a "warrior only" stat. Its the general ability for you to take a hit. If you just invest everything into magic then you are gimping your own self and I feel no sorrow for your plight.

I'm gonna get off the boards soon though and continue casting blizzards and watching enemies bow before my magics. Have fun complaining about not being able to run around as a naked fist fighter and still survive lol.

I'm telling you, if you want to be a mage get rid of this pure notion. There isn't a pure warrior either or else many a dragon will swoon in and eat you alive. Neither is it pure archer as you are slow while pulling back a bow so you HAVE to take a sword with you or some form of secondary protection.

Mage is no different, it has short comming just like the other archtypes that must be filled to survive effectively.

I wish I could say I was surprised that a magic system overhaul combined with removal of spell making produced a wildly nerfed mage.
Unfortunately given Bethesda's lack of effort in play-testing mages in past TES games, I'm really not surprised at all.

This is not even an issue that we should need mods to fix, it such a core issue it should be patched into the core game so PC or console, you can play a game with some sembalance of balance.

I'm done with this topic, shadow isn't even talking about the same thing at all. He's talking about the overarching 'mage playstyle' when we're talking about a skill tree that nobody should use due to other offensive skills being better and scaling properly.

I don't play as a spell caster but would like to eventually. Is this something Bethesda can fix in a patch or is it due to the way the skill/perk system is designed?

The shortcomings shouldn't outweigh every single positive, that's the point. Can we stop arguing over whether or not it's a problem and start focusing on how to get BETHESDA to fix it.

Take your difficulty off novice and get back to us.

In each thread where we try to do that, these vikings come in an tell us "destruction is fine, im level 15 and i own. l2n NOOB! stop trying to only use fireballs LAWL"

It's really frustrating to have a serious conversation with these people interrupting